Stabbing in Southport

[sir wanksalot]

A lot of this come about due to a information vacuum.Things have moved on with the internet and if the police do not give  good information quickly others will fill that vacuum , often with incorrect ( sometimes deliberately ) information. I know for legal reasons the police can only say so much but they need to say more.

As for the rioters they are just a bunch of thick thugs.

I think that is a very fair point to make.

The police don't help matters by saying that people should not speculate about the identity of the knifeman but then remain silent for too long. As you say, speculation cannot be suppressed. It is up to the police to control the narrative and sadly, but nonetheless true, many of the mindless massacres in this country have some connection to people from overseas, either immigrants or heritage.

I know people will bristle at that but it is true.

[scutty brown]

A lot of this come about due to a information vacuum.

Like hell it does.
How does a legal requirement on the police not to divulge information regarding the suspect turn into a justification for a riot?
Absolute nonsense. Nothing justifies violence by a bunch of political nutters, especially given that a suspect has been arrested.
The rioting is just a cynical ploy by extremists, probably using Russian funding, as just another part of the process of breaking down British cohesion and stability

It's just disturbing how quickly this time the organisers got this rent-a-mob together to carry out the riot, almost as if they knew in advance that the attacks were going to happen

[Doc Holliday]

I know for legal reasons the police can only say so much but they need to say more.

In actual fact 'legally' they have possibly said too much as the suspect is 17. However despite the Police announcing that the named individual and information on social media was false and the individual was born in Cardiff to Rwanda parents and not an illegal asylum seeker from Syria who arrived by boat and was on an watchlist etc, it made no difference as many people prefer to believe they are lying and that the social media posts are correct. This thread is an example of this.

[Stevelondon]

Like hell it does.
How does a legal requirement on the police not to divulge information regarding the suspect turn into a justification for a riot?
Absolute nonsense. Nothing justifies violence by a bunch of political nutters, especially given that a suspect has been arrested.
The rioting is just a cynical ploy by extremists, probably using Russian funding, as just another part of the process of breaking down British cohesion and stability

+ 1.   👍🏻

[8MillionDollarMan]

almost as if they knew in advance that the attacks were going to happen

  really?

[sir wanksalot]

In actual fact 'legally' they have possibly said too much as the suspect is 17. However despite the Police announcing that the named individual and information on social media was false and the individual was born in Cardiff to Rwanda parents and not an illegal asylum seeker from Syria who arrived by boat and was on an watchlist etc, it made no difference as many people prefer to believe they are lying and that the social media posts are correct. This thread is an example of this.

The police CAN name a suspect under the age of 18 in some circumstances. There is clear precedence in this regards already. Interesting article here External Link/Members Only.

I think the law was designed to protect children who had committed serious crimes. When the suspect is a hefty looking 17 yr old then it does give the police wiggle room should they decide it's necessary.

I think they have tried to protect the identity of the suspect (so far) NOT because he's under 18 but more so because he probably has a name and a face that is likely to stir anger amongst some sections of our community. There is also a growing perception that the police (much like our governments) are trying to control the narrative.

[Doc Holliday]

The police CAN name a suspect under the age of 18 in some circumstances. There is clear precedence in this regards already. Interesting article here External Link/Members Only.

I think the law was designed to protect children who had committed serious crimes. When the suspect is a hefty looking 17 yr old then it does give the police wiggle room should they decide it's necessary.

I think they have tried to protect the identity of the suspect (so far) NOT because he's under 18 but more so because he probably has a name and a face that is likely to stir anger amongst some sections of our community. There is also a growing perception that the police (much like our governments) are trying to control the narrative.

Yes anonymity is complex (and controversial) but in this case it isn't just his age, but he hasn't actually been charged yet. The latter will be in part due to mental health assessments which in turn feeds back to the right to anonymity.

That wasn't really my main point though. The Police stated it was not the fictitious person being banded about on social media and provided some information about the suspect to back this up, but many people haven't accepted that and it did nothing to prevent the riots last night 

I disagree that the police are holding back because of his ethnicity. It is because of the reasons above.

As for the Police and how they control the narrative, then remember this is comes on the back of the mess made in the Nicola Bulley case and is also complex 

[scutty brown]

really?

Yes really

[berksboy]

I think that is a very fair point to make.

The police don't help matters by saying that people should not speculate about the identity of the knifeman but then remain silent for too long. As you say, speculation cannot be suppressed. It is up to the police to control the narrative and sadly, but nonetheless true, many of the mindless massacres in this country have some connection to people from overseas, either immigrants or heritage.

I know people will bristle at that but it is true.

Nice to see someone gets the point i was trying to make .

[berksboy]

Like hell it does.
How does a legal requirement on the police not to divulge information regarding the suspect turn into a justification for a riot?
Absolute nonsense. Nothing justifies violence by a bunch of political nutters, especially given that a suspect has been arrested.
The rioting is just a cynical ploy by extremists, probably using Russian funding, as just another part of the process of breaking down British cohesion and stability

It's just disturbing how quickly this time the organisers got this rent-a-mob together to carry out the riot, almost as if they knew in advance that the attacks were going to happen

 Were did i say there was justication for a riot ? I did say "As for the rioters they are just a bunch of thick thugs."

[scutty brown]

Were did i say there was justication for a riot ?

when you said

A lot of this come about due to a information vacuum.

Which is manifestly untrue. Claiming otherwise is giving a facade of legitimacy to anyone who fancies a riot or punchup with the police

[DastardlyDick]

There is a video on X of one of the thugs being taken out by friendly fire - a rock bounced off a riot shield and hit his head and then someone threw a bit big rock and hit him in the nuts.

Before I head off to X for a good laugh, I'll guess the scumbag hardly noticed the one to the head - where there's no sense etc 

[RandomGuy99]

Before I head off to X for a good laugh, I'll guess the scumbag hardly noticed the one to the head - where there's no sense etc 

I suspect he had to go to hospital and he probably won't be having sex for a few months and perhaps a reduced chance of him reproducing so not all bad news.

[myothernameis]

There is a video on X of one of the thugs being taken out by friendly fire - a rock bounced off a riot shield and hit his head and then someone threw a bit big rock and hit him in the nuts.

I expect this clip to appear on many tv programs, like Caught on Dashcam, and many more, and guess he wont be able to hide away, as everyone recognizes as the programs get repeated

[Novatech]

Ban me for fuck sake. Cunts

[PumpDump]

There is a video on X of one of the thugs being taken out by friendly fire - a rock bounced off a riot shield and hit his head and then someone threw a bit big rock and hit him in the nuts.

I saw that, watched it several times, pissing myself laughing 

[daviemac]

Ban me for fuck sake. Cunts

Told you we don't do requests, just log off and fuck off.

[scutty brown]

Ban me for fuck sake. Cunts

What's the hurry? One post in 2017, then nothing until four today requesting to be banned
Why the desperation to get banned?

[daviemac]

What's the hurry? One post in 2017, then nothing until four today requesting to be banned
Why the desperation to get banned?

He can't answer.   

[chrishornx]

He can't answer.   

odd chap not sure what his motive was. Good riddance

[scutty brown]

He can't answer.   

I know.......I just wanted the satisfaction of him trying to answer and not being able

[Jerboa]

The English Defence League are named by the police as behind the ongoing trouble on the streets of Southport, officers hurt, police van fired.

Meanwhile three children are dead and others fighting for their lives; families grieving and a community in shock.


It's too bad for words

Apparently a Merseyside police ACC Goss briefed the press that the majority of the violent protesters were members of the EDL, oh really? maybe he should educate himself, the EDL disbanded like 10 years ago, but hey, let's not allow the facts to get in the way of the narrative. The lying media have just repeated the info for 24hrs.

[scutty brown]

Apparently a Merseyside police ACC Goss briefed the press that the majority of the violent protesters were members of the EDL, oh really? maybe he should educate himself, the EDL disbanded like 10 years ago, but hey, let's not allow the facts to get in the way of the narrative. The lying media have just repeated the info for 24hrs.

You might call your pet a hound, but if the fucker goes mad and bites you it's still just another fucking dog which needs putting down.
Same with the EDL - they can chop and change names and membership lists as much as they like, but they're just another bunch of fucking mad rabid dogs. Names don't define thuggery and thugs, their actions do that

[mr.bluesky]

There is a video on X of one of the thugs being taken out by friendly fire - a rock bounced off a riot shield and hit his head and then someone threw a bit big rock and hit him in the nuts.

Having watched that clip it looks like the rock comes from behind him that hits him on the head followed by a great one to the nuts. Serves the silly old bastard right.

[RandomGuy99]

Apparently a Merseyside police ACC Goss briefed the press that the majority of the violent protesters were members of the EDL, oh really? maybe he should educate himself, the EDL disbanded like 10 years ago, but hey, let's not allow the facts to get in the way of the narrative. The lying media have just repeated the info for 24hrs.

That's strange because there were individuals in the crowd with EDL flags.

[Jerboa]

You might call your pet a hound, but if the fucker goes mad and bites you it's still just another fucking dog which needs putting down.
Same with the EDL - they can chop and change names and membership lists as much as they like, but they're just another bunch of fucking mad rabid dogs. Names don't define thuggery and thugs, their actions do that

EDL label was clearly used to link the protests as far right, it's so boring these day, and only the dumb still buy it.

[8MillionDollarMan]

Yes really

And I thought Mills and Buna was stupid but you've topped him there.

[RandomGuy99]

Parody Keir Starmer on X has a great video of a supporter explaining why they defend England.

[scutty brown]

And I thought Mills and Buna was stupid but you've topped him there.

Do you think I really care what a thick idiot like you thinks about what I say?
Something - or someone - triggered that boy to attack those young kids. And the most plausible likelihood at the moment is that it was someone who wanted an excuse to create a riot, to cause more schism. The riot happened too quickly after the event to be unplanned. The false narrative that appeared originally in the USA citing Russian sources came out too quickly: it was prepacked, waiting to go.
This is a cynically planned false flag attack to stir up tension in the UK
If you can't see that, then there's little point in talking to you

[scutty brown]

EDL label was clearly used to link the protests as far right, it's so boring these day, and only the dumb still buy it.

But the protesters rioters were far right.
The label is irrelevant, but if the cap fits it fits.

[Doc Holliday]

Apparently a Merseyside police ACC Goss briefed the press that the majority of the violent protesters were members of the EDL, oh really? maybe he should educate himself, the EDL disbanded like 10 years ago, but hey, let's not allow the facts to get in the way of the narrative. The lying media have just repeated the info for 24hrs.

I did think it odd that he chose to use EDL? As you say the organisation was disbanded over a decade ago when it ultimately failed.

So what name would you give to those who travelled to the coastal resort and who were clearly part of a well coordinated group.

Did you yourself travel to Southport last night?

[David1970]

First I would like to share my sympathy for the families of the 3 girls murdered. One of the mothers has asked the racists thugs to stop the violence, when she should be privately grieving.

I see the people of Southport came together to clean up the mess after the rioting and looting by the racist thugs that attack the town. The police did well to stop the pogrom against the local mosque.
I hope the police get all the racist thugs involved, including those who posted disinformation.

Laurence Fox thugs are running riot in London as I write this post, using the terrible events in Southport as a excuse.

[jeanphillipe]

How did the rioters think they are being patriotic by looting a local store for its "fags and booze"...

Just yesterday these types were calling out the certain members of the Romani community ( while initially blanket blaming muslims... ) for behaving like animals and here they are doing the same.

This is clearly the actions of someone completely mentally unstable and needs to be isolated for life.

If i understand correctly all we know is that he british born from Rwandan parents.

I really don't understand how even the most mentally ill has the heart to slice children this is abominable .

[myothernameis]

The youth has now been charged and charged with, with three counts of murder, 10 counts of attempted murder and possession of a knife, and will appear at Liverpool court

[Doc Holliday]

The youth has now been charged and charged with, with three counts of murder, 10 counts of attempted murder and possession of a knife, and will appear at Liverpool court

Reporting restrictions remain in place. We now have the usual bizarre situation where MSM in the UK cannot name him, but the rest of the world can. His identity is now readily available online.

I think however it would now be beneficial if the Police announced that the family are not Muslim.

[RandomGuy99]

I think however it would now be beneficial if the Police announced that the family are not Muslim.

I think it would be better if people assumed he wasn't muslim until proven otherwise and what's whether he was Muslim got to do with it?

Nobody has said that there's a religious motive behind the attack.

[myothernameis]

I think it would be better if people assumed he wasn't muslim until proven otherwise and what's whether he was Muslim got to do with it?

Nobody has said that there's a religious motive behind the attack.

A comment on twitter tells us 94% of Rwanda people are Catholic

[Jerboa]

But the protesters rioters were far right.
The label is irrelevant, but if the cap fits it fits.

Well the EDL were never far right, read the Home Office description of them, rather than wiki and fake media descriptions.

[myothernameis]

Sky news are reporting this youth turns 18 in 6 days time, which then will make him 18 years old, and how will things proceed, does he get named

[scutty brown]

Sky news are reporting this youth turns 18 in 6 days time, which then will make him 18 years old, and how will things proceed, does he get named

no

[Thecunninglinguist]

Sky news are reporting this youth turns 18 in 6 days time, which then will make him 18 years old, and how will things proceed, does he get named

I think you will find that English/Welsh law takes the view that any issues around identifying those involved in legal proceedings take their age at the time of the crime. If anyone is convicted of a serious crime the judge MAY allow the offender to be named. The next point at which the public become dissatisfied is any sentence handed out, even if the offender is 18 or over at time of trial, as the offence was before that they could still be punished as a juvenile. I doubt in this case it would mean too much but it might define where he is kept in the short term and a whole life tariff would be unlikely.

[scutty brown]

I think you will find that English/Welsh law takes the view that any issues around identifying those involved in legal proceedings take their age at the time of the crime. If anyone is convicted of a serious crime the judge MAY allow the offender to be named. The next point at which the public become dissatisfied is any sentence handed out, even if the offender is 18 or over at time of trial, as the offence was before that they could still be punished as a juvenile. I doubt in this case it would mean too much but it might define where he is kept in the short term and a whole life tariff would be unlikely.

I have a feeling sentencing will be irrelevant: my guess is this kid's heading for Ashworth hospital following a psychiatric diagnosis.

[Doc Holliday]

I think it would be better if people assumed he wasn't muslim until proven otherwise and what's whether he was Muslim got to do with it?

Nobody has said that there's a religious motive behind the attack.

Seriously? So they just attacked the Southport mosque at random?

[RandomGuy99]

Seriously? So they just attacked the Southport mosque at random?

They attacked the mosque as they spread misinformation to give them an excuse to attack it.

[Doc Holliday]

A comment on twitter tells us 94% of Rwanda people are Catholic

I think that figure is Christian, although within that group Roman Catholic is the majority. Less than 4% are Muslim

[scutty brown]

They attacked the mosque as they spread misinformation to give them an excuse to attack it.

The mosque was attacked following disinformation traceable back to Russia falsely describing the attacker as Muslim.
As I said earlier, that seems to have come from pre-packed news releases ready to go as soon as the children were attacked - it was a remarkably quick piece of work. To may eye it links the disinformation to the attack on the children - they were planned together.
Big question is who is responsible for the planning?

[Squire Haggard]

He has been named,

''Axel Rudakubana is charged with murdering three little girls and harming 10 others at a Taylor Swift-themed dance class in Southport with a 'curved kitchen knife'.

The 17-year-old, who turns 18 in just six days time, was born to Rwandan parents in Cardiff before moving to the village of Banks in Lancashire.''

External Link/Members Only

[scutty brown]

Sky news are reporting this youth turns 18 in 6 days time, which then will make him 18 years old, and how will things proceed, does he get named

reporting restrictions removed
named in court as Axel Muganwa Rudakubana

not that it makes any real difference knowing who he is

[RandomGuy99]

The mosque was attacked following disinformation traceable back to Russia falsely describing the attacker as Muslim.
As I said earlier, that seems to have come from pre-packed news releases ready to go as soon as the children were attacked - it was a remarkably quick piece of work. To may eye it links the disinformation to the attack on the children - they were planned together.
Big question is who is responsible for the planning?

I suspect that it wasn't planned and they just have the capacity to quickly crank out this stuff.

[8MillionDollarMan]

The mosque was attacked following disinformation traceable back to Russia falsely describing the attacker as Muslim.
As I said earlier, that seems to have come from pre-packed news releases ready to go as soon as the children were attacked - it was a remarkably quick piece of work. To may eye it links the disinformation to the attack on the children - they were planned together.
Big question is who is responsible for the planning?
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