Punting phones, Hushed, Secure Folder and how to set up a punting WhatsApp?

[NotThe]

 I wanted:

• to briefly summarise my thoughts / experience, and
  
• to ask if anyone has found a better way to use a second, "hidden" Whatsapp on a phone

I know there are quite a few topics on this already, but I have not found any with the level of detail I'd like.

A separate punting phone
Not a big fan of the idea. Even when justifying it is not an issue, I find it's a hassle to have a separate phone to carry around. Of course YMMV (your mileage may vary).

Dual-sim phones:
I am not a big fan of this. Too risky. A previous employer gave me a dual-sim phone so we could put both private and work sim in, and lots of people would always make confusion, calling private contacts from the work number and viceversa. The risk of confusion is just too high.

The hushed app
I think it's great because it is an app that you log in and out of. If you are logged out, there is no way you can receive a text or call. The call quality is a bit temperamental at times; I wouldn't use it if you are self-employed and want a separate number for work, but as a punting number it is absolutely great. If you are really paranoid, unless you punt everyday, you can uninstall it when you don't use it and reinstall it when you need to call/text to make another booking.

Samsung Secure Folder
Most unrooted Samsung phones have this great feature called  "secure folder" - it's like a separate space on your phone where you can install apps and store files which are kept encrypted and separate from your main phone. Some Chinese manufacturers have something similar, too (dual apps, second space, etc)
I am not aware of reliable alternatives that work on all Androids (eg on a Motorola or  Sony)
Hushed + secure folder is a great combination. You keep the Hushed app in the Secure Folder space, log out when you don't need it, and you have a perfect punting setup

Whatsapp + Secure Folder
In Samsung Secure Folder, you can install Whatsapp and link it to your Hushed number. Whatsapp will send you a verification text to your Hushed number but, after this, I understand Whatsapp has no clue you are using a Hushed number.

Some useful settings are:

• Whatsapp - 3 dots at the top right - settings - privacy - fingerprint lock (at the bottom). This way a dual  verification is required to access your 2nd Whatsapp: first the password to log into Secure Folder, then biometrics to log into Whatsapp
  
• Secure Folder - 3 dots at the top right - settings - notifications and data - app notifications - disable Whatsapp.

With 2) you are disabling the notifications of your second Whatsapp in the SecureFolder, NOT of your main whatsapp linked to your main number. Up to you if you want to do it but I think it's useful. This way you won't risk a whatsapp notification when you give the phone to your elderly father so he can videocall Aunt Annie who has moved down under 

With the phone set up this way, you will not receive any notification when someone tries to call you or text you on your hidden Whatspp. But if you enter secure folder and then whatsapp, you will see the texts/ missed calls there.

It would be better if Whatsapp had an option to log out, like Hushed does, but this is probably the best.

If you don't do 2), when you get a Whatsapp message you will receive a notification in the statusbar showing Whatsapp and a locked folder. If you click on it, it will ask you for the password to SecureFolder. Which I suppose is a risk most people will want to avoid.

Of course you can use 2) to block the notifications of any similar app (Signal, Telegram etc) you set up in Secure Folder
SecureFolder has an option to display or not display the content of the notification

Also, contacts are kept completely separate - the contacts I add to my hidden Whatsapp show up in the Contacts in Secure Folders but NOT on the "main" part of my phone.

Oh, and with SecureFolder I can have a hidden browser that keeps me logged into UKP

Whatsapp Business
I haven't tried it, but, if I got this right, installing Whatsapp Business is the only way to have a second Whatsapp number on the same phone, if you don't have something like SecureFolder dual space etc.
You can set a biometric app lock for WA Business, and you can disable notifications in the Android settings, but I have no idea if the contacts you add to  WA business get synced to your main contacts.

Iphones
Don't now much about iphones, sorry. I understand from an older thread that on Iphones you can have a password-protected hidden browser, but you cannot hide and password protect an app like Hushed https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=354071.msg3652237#msg3652237

Difference between Hushed and Whatsapp
If I have both in SecureFolder, the main difference is of course that I can log out of Hushed but not out of Whatsapp.
So with Hushed I can keep notifications on and log out if I ever have to briefly share my phone with someone else. This also means that if  a WG texts me I will see the notification straight away.
With Whatsapp I prefer to disable notifications altogether. This means I will not see it immediately if a WG messages me (I have to open the hidden Whatsapp and check)  but I prefer it this way. YMMV.

[contentguy]

Check out Hushed on a review site.

For me, it's a punting phone every time.  I wouldn't take my valuable personal phone to a punt.

[NotThe]

You mean for fear of being mugged?

[contentguy]

You mean for fear of being mugged?

Not really.
But if it's not there, I can't:
- Leave it behind
- Pocket dial my wife at an inappropriate moment
- Have it nicked "honestly I haven't seen your phone 'bebe'"
- Have my location tracked because one of my settings was wrong.

 

[NotThe]

- Pocket dial my wife at an inappropriate moment

I see. Are you by any chance this actor, who calls his wife while shagging Nia Nacci?  External Link/Members Only

[jgillis]

Thanks for taking the time to share this detailed post. I use "secure folder" on Samsung with a 2nd WhatsApp tied to an old sim.

Samsung "secure folder" is actually more than a folder. It's a virtual phone within the main phone. It has independent contacts, browser, gallery, apps, etc. It's also hosted on an encrypted partition. The technology is called "knox".

I often hand my phone over to the wife to use and she knows the pin. The phone-within-the-phone needs my fingerprint to enter.

[NotThe]

How do you handle notifications on the 2nd WhatsApp? The same way as me? Or have you found another way?

[jgillis]

I switched them all off. I just check manually. Although I notice on the new S23 they appear quite discreetly with no details just the app name.

[PumpDump]

Thanks for the comprehensive review NotThe. That is very useful.

[Bru1901]

On samsungs with secure folder

On normal mode:
 1 whatsapp and 1 whatsapp dual messenger and 1 whatsapp business

Inside secure folder
1 whatsapp
1 business whatsapp

Total 5 x whatsapp in one phone

With this you can also have 2 signals and 3 telegrams too

No need for a second punting phone.

All secure folder content <pix, videos etc are separate from normal phone.  As are contact lists>

Use insta facebook and you have a phone within a phone.

Hushed app can be used but i have found most people these days are on whatsapp and telegram or signal

[LincsLad12]

Jesus some of you guys have some real James Bond shit going on with your phones.

I just keep a second phone that stays away unless i am arranging or going to a meet. This thread makes me paranoid that i'm too laid back 

[mrfishyfoo]

Jesus some of you guys have some real James Bond shit going on with your phones.

I just keep a second phone that stays away unless i am arranging or going to a meet. This thread makes me paranoid that i'm too laid back 

Same. 

Less complicated so less chance to fuck up.

[macman26]

Jesus some of you guys have some real James Bond shit going on with your phones.

I just keep a second phone that stays away unless i am arranging or going to a meet. This thread makes me paranoid that i'm too laid back 

Yes the 2ed phone; easy i always keep the last 2 old phones and 1 of them is the putting iphone on a pay as you go Gifgaf sim. Both kept away in draw.... Looks all very normally, two old phone kept.

Onto the punting iphone, the pin is different to my norm one, 30 sec lock on pin, not signed into Google, Bluetooth off, have apple id (for what's app) but iMessages and all location services turned off.



 

[NotThe]

I should also mention: you can also install a secondary version of Google Maps or Waze into Samsung Secret Folders. This version will not be linked to your gmail / Samsung profile.
But I suspect there are still other ways your phone can track you!

[ppunterr]

I should also mention: you can also install a secondary version of Google Maps or Waze into Samsung Secret Folders. This version will not be linked to your gmail / Samsung profile.
But I suspect there are still other ways your phone can track you!

I use the Maps in my Secure folder when navigating to a punt. No way I'm gonna use the maps from my regular account. Don't want the SP location appearing somewhere in a search history!

[PumpDump]

One thing you need to be very careful of with Samsung Smart folder is if you tap on a telephone number link, like the ones in Vivastreet escorts section, it will open the telephone app outside secure folder. If you go ahead and make the call it will be made on your main "real" number revealing it to the person you are calling.

[NotThe]

I only use Hushed for phone calls but thank you, it's an important thing to point out

[kayak]

I read somewhere that if you’re involved in a car accident (serious enough for plod to attend) they’ll confiscate your devices. Fuckers want to know everything. I just keep a 2nd phone hidden in my car which is my punting phone, but I’d also hand this to the plod if I were ever in that situation. I delete all the messages and calls after a punt anyway, in case my missus were to stumble across it. I have a story ready anyway, that I always keep a spare phone and some cash in my car in case my phone or wallet is lost or stolen.

[PumpDump]

I read somewhere that if you’re involved in a car accident (serious enough for plod to attend) they’ll confiscate your devices. Fuckers want to know everything. I just keep a 2nd phone hidden in my car which is my punting phone, but I’d also hand this to the plod if I were ever in that situation. I delete all the messages and calls after a punt anyway, in case my missus were to stumble across it. I have a story ready anyway, that I always keep a spare phone and some cash in my car in case my phone or wallet is lost or stolen.

If it's the police you are worried they can retrieve anything you deleted. If it's your wife, I very much doubt she has that expertise!

[jeanphillipe]

I discovered Samsung Secure folder. It Is such an amazing feature.

Little things like handing you phone over to show something on YouTube or someone wanting to check a location or restaurant as their battery died , and your holding on to your fone for dear life (for fear of what suggestions might bring up) or blatantly lying you have no data.

I use Samsung secure for all my suspect Google searches, and I got a backup watsap loaded on to their too and a backup contacts list.

[pantywetter]

I use Hushed.  It has been totally reliable for me.  I rotate the numbers every few weeks for anonymity.  I delete the app when not in use.

One thing to be aware is that if you make a call then it saves it in your history.  I only usually arrange punts via SMS though. 

I can see that more girls are starting to use WhatsApp so may need a different system soon.

[evg]

I use Hushed.  It has been totally reliable for me.  I rotate the numbers every few weeks for anonymity.  I delete the app when not in use.

One thing to be aware is that if you make a call then it saves it in your history.  I only usually arrange punts via SMS though. 

I can see that more girls are starting to use WhatsApp so may need a different system soon.

Not sure if it’s available on android as well, but on iOS there’s a setting to disable the integrated call list, so that the calls don’t appear in your main call log.

[NotThe]

The phone calls you make through Hushed appear in the log stored in the Hushed app itself.

I have triple checked: when you install Hushed on Android, it asks you if you want to grant access to your contacts to Hushed.
If you choose no, the calls you make from Hushed do NOT appear in the call log of your ordinary phone app, but only in the call log on the Hushed app itself - meaning no one sees them once you log off or uninstall Hushed.
This is true regardless of whether you install Hushed normally or within Secure Folders.

I have not checked what happens if you give access to your contacts but I see no reason to do that.

On a separate note, having SecureFolders installed is annoying because sometimes, especially when you reboot the phone but not only, you get a notification saying something like "secure folders is locked, can't display notification, etc"

[Maak]

how do you set up a second whatsapp with secure folder?

[Sparta Prada]

how do you set up a second whatsapp with secure folder?

You need a 2nd (or spare) SIM card. Insert into the handset, go to Secure Folder and download 2nd Whatsapp account. The first time I did this, I used a SIM card that was in my cellular iPad. I whipped this into my Samsung, set up the 2nd Whatsapp account then returned the SIM card back to the iPad. In other words, you don't need the SIM card in your Samsung handset all the time (see caveat below) other than to help the set up for the 2nd Whatsapp.

Just remember that Samsung's Secure Folder doesn't allow you to make/receive calls, for that you would need to permanently leave the 2nd SIM card in the Samsung handset. But of course you can use Whatsapp for that anyway.

I have a Xiaomi phone which has the Dual Apps feature. If you have a nosey partner I would not recommend this as the secondary apps are on show. It also has Second Space (ie, a second profile on the handset) but I have found this nowhere as easy to navigate compared to Samsung's Secure Folder.

[mj]

Thanks for sharing you very detailed advice.

But like many, I still think a dedicated punting phone not linked to anything else is the way to go.  Hiding it, or justifying it, is easy.  The only bit that ever concerns me is if anything happened to my car (where I leave my real phone) whilst I'm on a punt.  Because ordinarily, I never leave my phone in the car.

[Geko12]

I started punting at 24, I’m now 32, the longest I’ve gone without a punt in those years is 9 months and that’s because I was in a relationship.

The cycle for me is always the same.

Every punt i always say it’s the last for me, need to stop wasting money etc could spend it on other things etc
So I have a cleansing period, delete all porn/refrain from watching porn, don’t log into aw etc, keep myself busy
Busy I mean work hard and play sports etc.
Then a few weeks later or a month, it all gets too much, feel lonely, all my friends are married with kids etc and seem to be busy
Something triggers my hornyness, see a nice hot women in leggings with a massive arse( like a few days ago) and then I’m arranging a punt , with a voice in my head saying Lifes short you deserve it for working hard
I don’t think twice , withdraw the hard earns £ , punt and feel drained, go home and the whole cycle starts

I know the cure is probably finding a very long term companion/girlfriend/wife
But whose to say in the next 15 years I wouldn’t want to fuck a 20 year old something whilst my wife had rolls and is 50+

Once a punter always a punter tbh, eventually you will come
Back at some point.

[Geko12]

Also those 9 months I was in a relationship were the happiest I’ve been. I deleted my aw account and never thought about punting.

Sure it didn’t end well towards the last month but It was good whilst it lasted.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Also those 9 months I was in a relationship were the happiest I’ve been. I deleted my aw account and never thought about punting.

Sure it didn’t end well towards the last month but It was good whilst it lasted.

Can you say if you don't mind what "un-lasted" it?..

[Stevelondon]

So many things in this thread I can chat about.

The topic of NOT taking your private phone on a punt as someone mentioned.
I know I’m not someone who has to worry about the security side of things like others. But really.
You’re away for a few hours without your phone and an emergency arises and you can’t be contacted……… cos you don’t have your phone.

Then there’s Geko12 saying every so often he says to himself he shouldn’t be wasting money on punting.
Jeez……… I’ve never considered it a waste of money. Bad punt for the dosh maybe (every once in a while)
But  a waste……….. never.

No matter how secretive we may think we are. Phones hidden in cars, cash stuffed under the seat etc.
There’s always a chance of misfortune. For some. 

[zel0s]

This is such a useful post. I'm new here and can't figure out if the pro of having a complete air gap with a separate punting phone is a bug or a feature.

The thought of an emergency happening at that specific moment and I miss it because I have a punting phone on me is weirdly unsettling. Chances are so low but I'm still like hmmmmmmm.

[jimbobted]

Not really.
But if it's not there, I can't:
- Leave it behind
- Pocket dial my wife at an inappropriate moment
- Have it nicked "honestly I haven't seen your phone 'bebe'"
- Have my location tracked because one of my settings was wrong.

 

Regardless of settings it's pretty much impossible to be tracked unless there is spyware on your phone. Even the Google maps timeline feature will only show movements of that physical device, not other devices logged into the same account. Pain in the arse TBH as now I have to fuck around on a mobile phone screen for my work expenses, used to be easy on my computer browser.

[bigboy96]

These days I only go to massage parlours, and simply turn up! As I usually go in the mornings they are usually quiet, and when I went to Herbal Clinic in Cricklewood, London, although all three times it was around mid-day, they have around five girls there, so always one available. So I have no need for  a punting phone or other James Bond secrecy that I've just been reading.

I find the timeline on google maps to be no problem, as it seldom tells me where I have been.  Just looking at it, the only location marked is Euro exchange in the town, but I went nowhere near there, and other streets I walked down are unmarked.

[UltraViolett]

I recommend samsungs secure folder its like having another phone.

TextMe is also a good app, the free version still allows for calls so you can verify with WhatsApp via call.

[PuntyMcPunter]

Yes the 2ed phone; easy i always keep the last 2 old phones and 1 of them is the putting iphone on a pay as you go Gifgaf sim. Both kept away in draw.... Looks all very normally, two old phone kept.

Onto the punting iphone, the pin is different to my norm one, 30 sec lock on pin, not signed into Google, Bluetooth off, have apple id (for what's app) but iMessages and all location services turned off.

this is exactly what I do. seems the simplest way to keep everything totally seperate both from the perspective of getting caught by the wifey, and also the potential risk of the WG deciding to try and blackmail you
I also always delete all the messages, call history, and never store them in my contacts either so in the unlikely event of my wife finding it and turning it on AND getting through the different pin, there is nothing to see.

whether I take my normal phone out with me depends on a few factors.
if I'm ONLY going out to punt, then I'll leave my phone at home. if my wife happens to check findmyiphone, my location will be at home where I am working.
if she happens to come home early, well i nipped out to go to go look at cars and  simply forgot my phone at home (I like just going to car dealerships and checking out cars so this is normal behaviour for me)

however, if I was planning to go out somewhere anyway, like collecting the shopping or something,  then I'll usually causally mention to my wife "oh I'm gooing to nip to the shops later, do the food shopping", then I'll leave my real phone in the car when I park for the punt (there is a car dealer right next to the most common hotel where WGs operate) so if she ever says "why were you parked at that hotel that would be my excuse - but this has yet to happen.

[PeterPanda01]

Thanks for heads up about apps in secure folder. For some reason i thought i can store there only sensitive files.

[fredhiggins]

Some great info here, thanks all.

[chodu1]

If you leave your punting phone (your old phone etc) in a drawer, before switching off, put it in flight mode. This reduces the risk that your Mrs finds the phone, switches the phone on and some new text message notifications may still show up on the locked screen, even without the password. Most phones have a setting whereby you can require the pw to even go from flight mode to normal.

You can just claim you've forgotten the PW and therefore the phone would need to be erased and restarted.

[JohnWaynes]

It looks like WhatsApp will eventually allow two accounts on one iPhone app: External Link/Members Only

[shed]

It looks like WhatsApp will eventually allow two accounts on one iPhone app: External Link/Members Only

Same on my Google Pixel

[Upsndowns79]

I currently use a 2nd number and have that linked to WhatsApp Business on my iPhone.

I also have the WA Business App invisible so you can only find it by searching for it. I have all notifications turned off and the 2nd telephone number disabled for calls. and then a secure folder with a password to access locked chats (all the numbers I have for SP’s are locked).

I find this way I don’t have the worry about a 2nd device been discovered and I worry less about my phone been left around the house like a ticking timebomb.

It’s not 100% safe cos nothing is