The Politics Thread

[Vice Admiral]

According to a letter in the Times the other day, 39% of the children currently in British schools are from ethnic minority backgrounds.  The policies of Reform or Restore won’t be able to affect that statistic, or indeed make a significant dent in current immigration, which has already been much reduced under Shabana Mahmood’s Home Secretaryship.

In the real world, therefore, the best that can be done is (a) try to integrate Britain's various communities more fully into the fabric of British society and (b) try to mitigate the threats posed by population movements from sub-Saharan Africa over the next few decades – which could otherwise make all other immigration look like a drop in the ocean.

In this context I return to William Hague’s article in the Times on 4 August, from which I quoted in my Reply #23709.

Here is another extract:

This underlines, of course, the need for tough but effective immigration policies now. But it also shows that such policies will not be enough. In the near term, the UK and our allies need the military capabilities to act against terrorist threats forming in the Sahel and to move in to help legitimate authorities when opinion turns against Russian exploitation, as it eventually will. When that happens, aid that is now diverted to housing asylum seekers at home should be redirected to help education and the environment in Africa.

Longer-term, the West should prepare to re-engage across the Sahel, laying the ground now with diplomatic and intelligence work to be ready to help when millions of people in their twenties demand justice and opportunity in their own countries. Otherwise, the people swimming to Ceuta will not only be the tragedy of last week but the forerunners of many more tragedies to come.

A letter? Do you have a link or know which day was it published? I've got to see the sources for this claim.

The letter in question was in the Times the day before yesterday.  Here's the full text:

Sir, Lord Biggar (letter, Aug 7) is quick to jump on the apparent discrepancy between the statistic in Roger Mosey’s article that 35 per cent of Cambridge’s UK undergraduates come from ethnic minorities, and that only 18 per cent of the overall population do so. However, Department for Education statistics tell us that the figure for the school-age population is rather higher: no less than 38.7 per cent of them now come from ethnic minority backgrounds. This aspect of the demographics of the country is rapidly changing, and Cambridge University’s admissions figures have changed to reflect it.
William Hale
Oxhill, Warks

[Doc Holliday]

A letter? Do you have a link or know which day was it published? I've got to see the sources for this claim.

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[Vice Admiral]

Two items on pp. 6-7 of today’s Times remind one why the only hope for the future governance of the United Kingdom is a coalition led by Count Binface and Howling Laud Hope.

1.   First this:  “After his return from holiday, the prime minister [Andy Burnham] intends to spend much of the rest of August travelling the country asking the public how the government can improve their lives.  Officials said he would be in ‘listening mode’, with a focus on tackling the cost of living and improving local high streets.

No comment is necessary.

2.  Second, a photograph of Sir Keir Starmer in an Arsenal shirt playing football on Saturday.  (I can’t find the same photo online, so am uploading one from the Daily Mail.)

It would be curmudgeonly to suggest that 63 year old ex Prime Ministers shouldn’t play football with their friends.

One would not to be a curmudgeon, however, to suggest that for Starmer to be wearing the shirt of his favourite club tips the activity over from the acceptable to the risibly embarrassing.  A reminder of how poor old Starmer so often got things "just slightly not right".


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[bigden40]

I'm guessing it will be his Dad being Greek and then German Grandparents / Great Grandparents / Whatever etc

Right. I see now, Lowe being a bit of a twat.

Charles dad was half Greek, paternal grandmother was born in the UK. As were both maternal grandparents, his mother and Charles himself.

[mh]

The letter in question was in the Times the day before yesterday.  Here's the full text:

Sir, Lord Biggar (letter, Aug 7) is quick to jump on the apparent discrepancy between the statistic in Roger Mosey’s article that 35 per cent of Cambridge’s UK undergraduates come from ethnic minorities, and that only 18 per cent of the overall population do so. However, Department for Education statistics tell us that the figure for the school-age population is rather higher: no less than 38.7 per cent of them now come from ethnic minority backgrounds. This aspect of the demographics of the country is rapidly changing, and Cambridge University’s admissions figures have changed to reflect it.
William Hale
Oxhill, Warks

OK, that enabled me to find the source even before the Doc added it. The claim that "no less than 38.7 per cent of them now come from ethnic minority backgrounds" is wrong on the figures.

First the data doesn't cover "those where ethnicity is unclassified". Secondly the letter writer is turning white non-British into ethnic minorities to bolster their numbers. The actual number of "ethnic minority" pupils is close to 30%, not almost 40% and that is of those where ethnicity has been recorded.

[DastardlyDick]

You'd be kicked out by Lowe then.

Not necessarily, if both parents were born in the UK, you're fine.
You can be an Irish Citizen if one of your Grandparents was born in Ireland.

[DastardlyDick]

OK, that enabled me to find the source even before the Doc added it. The claim that "no less than 38.7 per cent of them now come from ethnic minority backgrounds" is wrong on the figures.

First the data doesn't cover "those where ethnicity is unclassified". Secondly the letter writer is turning white non-British into ethnic minorities to bolster their numbers. The actual number of "ethnic minority" pupils is close to 30%, not almost 40% and that is of those where ethnicity has been recorded.

How were the Ethnicities decided? If it was by Self Defined Ethnicity, then it's probably inaccurate.

[Adoniron]

Not necessarily, if both parents were born in the UK, you're fine.

As has been said, Lowe's definition would rule out the King. Also Boris Johnson (no bad thing?). And Winston Churchill.

[Jerboa]

I find these posts saying Lowe will kicked people out of the UK for Irish ancestry dumb, as it was before Brexit when the remoaners said similar twattery.
We have the Common Travel Area with the R.O.I 

[DastardlyDick]

I find these posts saying Lowe will kicked people out of the UK for Irish ancestry dumb, as it was before Brexit when the remoaners said similar twattery.
We have the Common Travel Area with the R.O.I 

I don't remember any prominent remainers saying that - can you back this claim up with proof?
Restore has stated on the record, that, if they form a Government they will report anyone whose parents are not British.

[Jerboa]

I don't remember any prominent remainers saying that - can you back this claim up with proof?
Restore has stated on the record, that, if they form a Government they will report anyone whose parents are not British.

I didn't say prominent remainers said it, I like the way you move the context, Restore have not said that, have you any evidence of Rupert Lowe saying that? Not what a Guardian hack or James (mug) O’Brien said he said.

[Thephoenix]

Very depressing and unsettling viewing the recent ITV documentary 'Inside Iran: War and Revolution.'

As is often the case it makes me thankful that I can enjoy the freedoms we often take for granted in our land.

It's a must watch for anyone interested in the conflict.

[Punting2022]

Discusting scenes. MORE PEOPLE then in a boeing 737
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237 terrorist ready here.

I also read that ISIS have so many weapons in mosques here. Government cant do anything as they wont search them.
UK is destroyed 

[Followyourdick]

Discusting scenes. MORE PEOPLE then in a boeing 737
UK is destroyed

*than

Don’t forget London is Fallen as well.

[Punting2022]

*than

Don’t forget London is Fallen as well.

The west has due to their incompetence and to satisfy one race and religion

[Vice Admiral]

From today’s Times:  "After his return from holiday, the prime minister [Andy Burnham] intends to spend much of the rest of August travelling the country asking the public how the government can improve their lives.  Officials said he would be in ‘listening mode’, with a focus on tackling the cost of living and improving local high streets."

No comment is necessary.

My worst fears about Burnham are being realised.  He's shallow and a lightweight.  Almost all his initiatives or interventions so far have been designed to achieve cheap popularity.

Spending the rest of August "travelling the country asking the public how the government can improve their lives" is vapid and performative.  He had plenty of time to gauge the mood of the British people when he was canvassing in Makerfield.

The best way for Burnham to improve the lives of the British people is to sit down behind his desk at 10, Downing Street and do some fucking work.

Meanwhile it is not the job of a prime minister to be interfering in the English justice system.  We were all appalled by the murder of PC Harper.  But you can't apply special rules to one case.

There are many other vile people in jail, for terrible cases of murder, child exploitation and rape – people who many would like to see locked up almost for ever.  Most of these cases don't make the headlines.

But if there's one thing that's guaranteed about the usurper Burnham it's that he will always follow the headlines...

[bigden40]

My worst fears about Burnham are being realised.  He's shallow and a lightweight.  Almost all his initiatives or interventions so far have been designed to achieve cheap popularity.

Spending the rest of August "travelling the country asking the public how the government can improve their lives" is vapid and performative.  He had plenty of time to gauge the mood of the British people when he was canvassing in Makerfield.

The best way for Burnham to improve the lives of the British people is to sit down behind his desk at 10, Downing Street and do some fucking work.

Meanwhile it is not the job of a prime minister to be interfering in the English justice system.  We were all appalled by the murder of PC Harper.  But you can't apply special rules to one case.

There are many other vile people in jail, for terrible cases of murder, child exploitation and rape – people who many would like to see locked up almost for ever.  Most of these cases don't make the headlines.

But if there's one thing that's guaranteed about the usurper Burnham it's that he will always follow the headlines...

Indeed.  But there should be zero surprises here, it was obvious.  Burnham has been in office of one kind or another for a quarter of a century.

[ulstersubbie]

My worst fears about Burnham are being realised.  He's shallow and a lightweight.  Almost all his initiatives or interventions so far have been designed to achieve cheap popularity.

Not a criticism of you VC, but seasoned watchers of politics knew this some time ago, Burnham isn't even a lightweight, more of a stumbling flyweight. If Spitting Image was still being broadcast on television, they'd have a field day with him.

[bigden40]

Not a criticism of you VC, but seasoned watchers of politics knew this some time ago, Burnham isn't even a lightweight, more of a stumbling flyweight. If Spitting Image was still being broadcast on television, they'd have a field day with him.

Remember how the used to treat David Steel.  Lord Steel would be a relative political titan compared to the calibre of the House of Commons today.

[mh]

My worst fears about Burnham are being realised.  He's shallow and a lightweight.  Almost all his initiatives or interventions so far have been designed to achieve cheap popularity.

Parliament is in recess. I would rather he went to places other than oop north to get input from the British people. Yes it is all mined for publicity but I'd rather he did this than said he had heard enough from the people of one constituency and then sat behind a desk.

[RedKettle]

My worst fears about Burnham are being realised.  He's shallow and a lightweight.  Almost all his initiatives or interventions so far have been designed to achieve cheap popularity.

Spending the rest of August "travelling the country asking the public how the government can improve their lives" is vapid and performative.  He had plenty of time to gauge the mood of the British people when he was canvassing in Makerfield.

The best way for Burnham to improve the lives of the British people is to sit down behind his desk at 10, Downing Street and do some fucking work.

Meanwhile it is not the job of a prime minister to be interfering in the English justice system.  We were all appalled by the murder of PC Harper.  But you can't apply special rules to one case.

There are many other vile people in jail, for terrible cases of murder, child exploitation and rape – people who many would like to see locked up almost for ever.  Most of these cases don't make the headlines.

But if there's one thing that's guaranteed about the usurper Burnham it's that he will always follow the headlines...

We get the politicians we deserve.  They are answerable to an electorate who are driven like idiots by what they see on social media and who rarely try to, or even can, understand the issues - just read what some put on this thread.  Starmer tried to be serious and got destroyed - although some of his own actions did not help.  Burnham posts a short video on the colour of his T shirt and is a hero.  Like children they will do what gets rewarded.

We had a PM who sat at his desk and worked really hard and understood the detail of issues - Sunak.  It did not end well for him and he proved out of touch with the people when he buggered off from the D Day event.

He would not have been my first choice but in my view he is doing OK so far.  If he makes progress on Social Care that will be a massive win, althought I suspect Reform.Tories will hurt him on it and probably block it.

It would be good to see some political leaders putting the country first, but I doubt I will see it in my lifetime.

[Followyourdick]

The west has due to their incompetence and to satisfy one race and religion

If this quote above looks like a racist comment and sounds like a racist comment then it probably is one.

[Squire Haggard]

I agree with the  comment below the article ''2 year custodial sentences for hurty words, suspended sentence for attempted murder? How does that make any sense what so ever?''

''Candace De Silva, 37, has been spared jail after disabling a police officer with her car. She admitted causing serious injury by dangerous driving and assaulting an emergency worker.
She was stopped by PC Simon Ward in Liverpool city centre after he suspected she was using a mobile phone while driving.
Tests showed she was more than three times the legal alcohol limit. De Silva told the officer: “You are not f***ing searching me – I am going. You cannot stop me.”
She then put her foot down and sped off as PC Ward desperately clung to the driver’s side window of her 4×4.''

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[mills_and_bhuna]

The west has due to their incompetence and to satisfy one race and religion

The funny thing is you're almost right .
Just the wrong religion/race.........

[Adoniron]

We get the politicians we deserve.  They are answerable to an electorate who are driven like idiots by what they see on social media and who rarely try to, or even can, understand the issues - just read what some put on this thread.  Starmer tried to be serious and got destroyed - although some of his own actions did not help.  Burnham posts a short video on the colour of his T shirt and is a hero.  Like children they will do what gets rewarded.

We had a PM who sat at his desk and worked really hard and understood the detail of issues - Sunak.  It did not end well for him and he proved out of touch with the people when he buggered off from the D Day event.

He would not have been my first choice but in my view he is doing OK so far.  If he makes progress on Social Care that will be a massive win, althought I suspect Reform.Tories will hurt him on it and probably block it.

It would be good to see some political leaders putting the country first, but I doubt I will see it in my lifetime.

We do get the leaders we deserve. We are becoming ungovernable. We want conflicting things eg good public services and low taxes. We elect politicians who tell us what we want to hear rather than those who tell us the truth. We can't handle the truth or bad news. When they can't deliver what they promised we turn on them and follow the next liar.

[Blackpool Rock]

We do get the leaders we deserve. We are becoming ungovernable. We want conflicting things eg good public services and low taxes. We elect politicians who tell us what we want to hear rather than those who tell us the truth. We can't handle the truth or bad news. When they can't deliver what they promised we turn on them and follow the next liar.

As i've said many times people seem to want instant results but even then their expectations are totally unrealistic

[Punting2022]

Burnham made a good choice on drilling in the north sea. But for every good decision labour make a bad follows. Now he wants to spread the immigrants into all areas.
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No one should house them, They should be in detention centres. They get their basic human rights here. Food and shower, what more do they need. But nope Labour want them to invade our towns.

Cant even go to the local park etc with them making a mess and ruining the views.
UK has Fallen

[DastardlyDick]

Burnham made a good choice on drilling in the north sea. But for every good decision labour make a bad follows. Now he wants to spread the immigrants into all areas.
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No one should house them, They should be in detention centres. They get their basic human rights here. Food and shower, what more do they need. But nope Labour want them to invade our towns.

Cant even go to the local park etc with them making a mess and ruining the views.
UK has Fallen

Detention Centres are a perfectly reasonable solution, but whenever the Government try to convert MOD property into one, there are objections. The Thetford Protest started off being about the plans to convert RAF Barnham into migrant accommodation, but the usual suspects turned it into violence, which is unacceptable.
I think using old military bases is a good idea, regardless of where they are - it's got to be cheaper than renting Hotels.

[TallnHung]

Detention Centres are a perfectly reasonable solution, but whenever the Government try to convert MOD property into one, there are objections. The Thetford Protest started off being about the plans to convert RAF Barnham into migrant accommodation, but the usual suspects turned it into violence, which is unacceptable.
I think using old military bases is a good idea, regardless of where they are - it's got to be cheaper than renting Hotels.

Typical nimbies sadly and they dont trust that they can be kept contained.
Having lived on a few bases in the past I feel sorry for whoever lives in them now, they were shite then and likely worse now.  Very much doubt the security is up top much either spo the nimbies arent all wrong!
Looks what attacking hotels has done.  Pushed them into HMOs so rather than contained in one location now im multiple ones.
Its almost as if the protesters are too thick to understand how this shit works.  Still, keeps Farage, Tice and Lowe in jobes, well until they do the usual and go live offshore with their millions, Tice already does, so much for his patriotism.

[RandomGuy99]

BBC News - ICE plans to equip agents with gloves that can deliver electric shocks
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I hope they shock themselves.

[Punting2022]

BBC News - ICE plans to equip agents with gloves that can deliver electric shocks
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I hope they shock themselves.

Lovely, UK needs similar. I am for the hotel protest. It puts pressure and manages to close them. Lovely scenes when the one in essex was put under pressure to close.

They dont need army centres etc. All they need is a shelter and simple food. So lock them in detention centres on the border. Once the deterrent is there. they wont come. At the moment they come due to no deterrent. Thousands of ISIS terrorist living and planning something in the UK thanks to the immigrant invasion, mostly the somali invasion

[Jerboa]

Detention Centres are a perfectly reasonable solution, but whenever the Government try to convert MOD property into one, there are objections. The Thetford Protest started off being about the plans to convert RAF Barnham into migrant accommodation, but the usual suspects turned it into violence, which is unacceptable.
I think using old military bases is a good idea, regardless of where they are - it's got to be cheaper than renting Hotels.

What do you know about usual suspects? Afaik the protests have been mostly locals, protesting Barnham, then found out there were already HMO's in their town.

[bigden40]

BBC News - ICE plans to equip agents with gloves that can deliver electric shocks
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I hope they shock themselves.

So what?  US law enforcement looking at additional non-lethal options seems a good thing..

Presumably no more dangerous than tasers, and significantly less dangerous than firearms.