Poppy appeal

[Jomoore]

I was in and around Leeds yesterday for over 5 hours; I must have seen and walked by many hundreds, or thousands, of people including in the Trinity Centre, Kirkgate market, the bus station, the Victoria Quarter etc.  I can honestly say that the number of people I saw wearing poppies hardly got into double figures, and they were all well over 50yrs old, most over 70. 
I've never seen a year with so few on display.  Has anyone else noticed this in their areas?

[RandomGuy99]

I donated online. I noticed Amazon have launched a poppy donation service.

[Spunky34]

I sometimes wonder if the decline of people carrying cash means fewer people see a poppy seller and stop to buy one.  That said, I am seeing more and more of the enamel pin badge type poppies, which people often don’t wear on their outer coats.  In the office this week there are many more of the badges than there are paper poppies.  They don’t fall off anything like as easily.

[Followyourdick]

Sadly the poppy symbol has been hijacked to a degree by right wing bellends like fucking 30p Lee and his buddies including the knuckle dragger Gullis, that maybe why some folk are not wearing them.
I will still buy one and wear it despite despising those nobs fucking preening and trying to politicise it.

[timsussex]

I donated online. I noticed Amazon have launched a poppy donation service.

Thanks for that
I saw my first poppy seller yesterday - 2 of the older kids at my granddaughters school - unfortunately not selling many because I and many others dont carry cash. In years gone by I would always have a pocket full of change 

[RandomGuy99]

Thanks for that
I saw my first poppy seller yesterday - 2 of the older kids at my granddaughters school - unfortunately not selling many because I and many others dont carry cash. In years gone by I would always have a pocket full of change

Donating online was convenient and I donated more than I would if I was buying a poppy plus they get 25% extra with gift aid.

[mr.bluesky]

I was in and around Leeds yesterday for over 5 hours; I must have seen and walked by many hundreds, or thousands, of people including in the Trinity Centre, Kirkgate market, the bus station, the Victoria Quarter etc.  I can honestly say that the number of people I saw wearing poppies hardly got into double figures, and they were all well over 50yrs old, most over 70. 
I've never seen a year with so few on display.  Has anyone else noticed this in their areas?

In my home city Coventry I would say it was the exact opposite,  Probably about 70% of people wearing poppy's especially the older folk but quite a lot of younger people too. I don't know whether it is down to the fact that Coventry was heavily bombed during the war and HMS Coventry was sunk during the Falklands war 

[Romeo Sensini]

Stopped buying them on principle. The Royal British Legion have tens of millions in the bank while ex-service personnel are sleeping rough is just one reason.

[NewGuy89]

I put £2 in the collection at Tesco this week without taking a poppy. I used to wear one, but I always ended up losing it so I stopped taking them.

[Stevelondon]

Stopped buying them on principle. The Royal British Legion have tens of millions in the bank while ex-service personnel are sleeping rough is just one reason.

I catch your drift.    But as a principal. For those who gave the ultimate sacrifice…. I wear mine.

[RedKettle]

Stopped buying them on principle. The Royal British Legion have tens of millions in the bank while ex-service personnel are sleeping rough is just one reason.

Not buying one helps how?

Have you looked into why they have bank reserves?

[PumpDump]

I was in and around Leeds yesterday for over 5 hours; I must have seen and walked by many hundreds, or thousands, of people including in the Trinity Centre, Kirkgate market, the bus station, the Victoria Quarter etc.  I can honestly say that the number of people I saw wearing poppies hardly got into double figures, and they were all well over 50yrs old, most over 70. 
I've never seen a year with so few on display.  Has anyone else noticed this in their areas?

I noticed the same in London. Was out and about In Central last weekend but not many Poppies. I thought maybe it is down to the fact there are just not that many indigenous English in London anymore. But interesting to hear the same story from Leeds.

[badsin]

I've got three, on different coats. I always make a donation whenever I see tin even if I already have a poppy, it's just loose change.
Unfortunately not that many folks wearing them in Derby. I'd suggest it's less than 50%.

* I remember what the remembrance day parades on TV in the late 70's when I was a nipper.
Thousands of ex service men all smartly turned out to march through London.
Can't be many left now, passing of time is a sad thing.

[PumpDump]

I've got three, on different coats. I always make a donation whenever I see tin even if I already have a poppy, it's just loose change.
Unfortunately not that many folks wearing them in Derby. I'd suggest it's less than 50%.

* I remember what the remembrance day parades on TV in the late 70's when I was a nipper.
Thousands of ex service men all smartly turned out to march through London.
Can't be many left now, passing of time is a sad thing.

Won't they be replaced by the poor bastards who fought in Iraq and Afghanistan?

[badsin]

Correct I'm sure they will.

[willie loman]

Not buying one helps how?

Have you looked into why they have bank reserves?

maybe you can explain, only found out this myself yesterday.

[timsussex]

Perhaps they should move with the times

heres an idea Virtual poppies - donate £1 via phone and get a poppy screen saver or home screen until 11th

I saw a lot more mobiles than poppies today 

[PumpDump]

Stopped buying them on principle. The Royal British Legion have tens of millions in the bank while ex-service personnel are sleeping rough is just one reason.

You are right, they have over £400m in assets. What the fuck. There are a couple of homeless ex-military guys always asking for money outside the local Tesco. Why is £400m sitting in the bank or investments when people badly need it?

External Link/Members Only

Some more info from their External Link/Members Only

They have 1,544 full-time employees and pay out £57 million in salaries each year, that's an average salary of £37,000. They spend a further £3.56 million on agency fees. Fifty-seven employees are paid over £60,000 with the highest being on £150k.

[RandomGuy99]

Perhaps they should move with the times

heres an idea Virtual poppies - donate £1 via phone and get a poppy screen saver or home screen until 11th

I saw a lot more mobiles than poppies today

There's a Royal British Legion store on Amazon where you can donate.

[Spunky34]

You are right, they have over £400m in assets. What the fuck. There are a couple of homeless ex-military guys always asking for money outside the local Tesco. Why is £400m sitting in the bank or investments when people badly need it?

External Link/Members Only

Some more info from their External Link/Members Only

They have 1,544 full-time employees and pay out £57 million in salaries each year, that's an average salary of £37,000. They spend a further £3.56 million on agency fees. Fifty-seven employees are paid over £60,000 with the highest being on £150k.

The salary cost is £47m, not £57m, so the average salary is more like £31k.  The other £10m is employers national insurance and pension costs. For comparison the ONS says the average UK salary is just over £38k.  Hard to argue they are overpaying people.  And just one person on over £150k in an organisation that size and of that prominence doesn’t seem excessive.

[PumpDump]

The salary cost is £47m, not £57m, so the average salary is more like £31k.  The other £10m is employers national insurance and pension costs. For comparison the ONS says the average UK salary is just over £38k.  Hard to argue they are overpaying people.  And just one person on over £150k in an organisation that size and of that prominence doesn’t seem excessive.

Yes fair points. But the £400m in assets, shouldn't they spend it on their stated aim which is "The Royal British Legion, formerly the British Legion, is a British charity providing financial, social and emotional support to members and veterans of the British Armed Forces, their families and dependants, as well as all others in need."?

[Spunky34]

Yes fair points. But the £400m in assets, shouldn't they spend it on their stated aim which is "The Royal British Legion, formerly the British Legion, is a British charity providing financial, social and emotional support to members and veterans of the British Armed Forces, their families and dependants, as well as all others in need."?

Not all those assets are cash though.  They operate care homes and things like that (it’s why they need so many staff), so some of those assets will be bricks and mortar to actually help the people you are talking about.  The investments they have will make a return every year for the charity, irrespective of public sentiment and ability to donate.

I’m not trying to be argumentative, but I have literally no idea how hard it must be to run a charity like that which is a huge enterprise and well known so everyone has an opinion on what they should be doing. 

If you want to know what a badly run charity looks like, anything to do with the Captain Tom charity should show you why it needs proper governance and good people who know what they are doing.  That costs money because the people who can handle those kind of decisions won’t do it for nothing.

[willie loman]

There will always be homeless ex service men, service life  makes  a man out of many, but  it actually prevents many from becoming adults, being responsible about money, and work etc, the same goes for the merchant navy, nought to do with combat trauma etc

[RandomGuy99]

There will always be homeless ex service men

I agree. Some just struggle to settle and everyday life. 

[Bertiebeenthere]

There will always be homeless ex service men

Yes, but half of £400 million will build and manage care homes/sheltered accommodation for ex service personnel and help towards alcohol/drug treatment/counselling.

[willie loman]

Yes, but half of £400 million will build and manage care homes/sheltered accommodation for ex service personnel and help towards alcohol/drug treatment/counselling.

service men are actually helped disproportionately, plenty of care homes and supported accommodation are exclusively for services staff.

[Spunky34]

I’d also say that whatever anyone thinks about whether the charity should be doing this or that, we shouldn’t forget that it is the role of government (via the armed forces themselves while the individuals are serving) who should be responsible for making sure they don’t HAVE to rely on the charity when they leave. 

It’s easy to forget because it’s an emotive issue but the charity is the plaster over the scandal that is the number of homeless and traumatised veterans.  I’m going to stop there for fear of getting political.

[Romeo Sensini]

It really seems as if some of these charities largely exist to benefit those running them, with only minuscule amounts actually reaching the “front line”. Also witness Captain Tom’s leaching family who are trying to play the game but at amateur level.

Someone above mentioned £400 million in assets, that could build thousands of 1 bed apartments that could be let out for token rents to struggling people.

[Bertiebeenthere]

service men are actually helped disproportionately, plenty of care homes and supported accommodation are exclusively for services staff.

I presume you mean ex servicemen and ex service staff?
Also, from where did you obtain that information?
Or is it your opinion?

[willie loman]

I presume you mean ex servicemen and ex service staff?
Also, from where did you obtain that information?
Or is it your opinion?

are you actually doubting that? there  are countless care homes where entry is reserved to ex service men, i cant think of any other occupation that is accorded that privilige, to that extent., ,my relatives have ended their days  there, and one had only done national service.

[Bertiebeenthere]

Not doubting that, but from my limited knowledge from relatives and friends these places are only for ex NCOs and above. The ex service personnel that are on the streets are those that have had short times in the services and not qualified for this accommodation.

[willie loman]

Not doubting that, but from my limited knowledge from relatives and friends these places are only for ex NCOs and above. The ex service personnel that are on the streets are those that have had short times in the services and not qualified for this accommodation.

certainly entry to service retirement homes is open to anyone who has served at whatever rank, and for whatever time, its absurd to pretend that ex service staff are hard done by, thats my personal view.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Whilst on the subject of charties to be run by private sector or goverment it strikes me that the RNLI runs itself very well.OK I suspect that many who crew the boats may do that as they feel they ought by living by the sea..

Such outfits likr charities are in fact businesses and need a level of experetise to run..

I only knoiw onwe who did depend on the BL an they did help him with accomodation then a place in a home before he passed.

I've not been out much of late owing to illness but a donation is forthcoming and as I can't be there in person in i shall be in spirt sprit on at the TV service and I hope all the other protestors do the decent tnhing and stay out of it.

Fortunatly we only lost three in our family, and that was in world war one all 18 year olds poor lads had a few injured in WW2 ...

[RedKettle]

Yes, but half of £400 million will build and manage care homes/sheltered accommodation for ex service personnel and help towards alcohol/drug treatment/counselling.

As said above much of the 400m is not cash, it is property such as care homes and sheltered accommodation

[RedKettle]

It really seems as if some of these charities largely exist to benefit those running them, with only minuscule amounts actually reaching the “front line”. Also witness Captain Tom’s leaching family who are trying to play the game but at amateur level.

Someone above mentioned £400 million in assets, that could build thousands of 1 bed apartments that could be let out for token rents to struggling people.

You are ignoring the questions I asked so I assume you do not have a sccoby.  Also as was said above, but you are ignoring, the £400 is assets not cash so may include property already.

[PepeMAGA]

Whilst on the subject of charties to be run by private sector or goverment it strikes me that the RNLI runs itself very well.OK I suspect that many who crew the boats may do that as they feel they ought by living by the sea..

Such outfits likr charities are in fact businesses and need a level of experetise to run..

I only knoiw onwe who did depend on the BL an they did help him with accomodation then a place in a home before he passed.

I've not been out much of late owing to illness but a donation is forthcoming and as I can't be there in person in i shall be in spirt sprit on at the TV service and I hope all the other protestors do the decent tnhing and stay out of it.

Fortunatly we only lost three in our family, and that was in world war one all 18 year olds poor lads had a few injured in WW2 ...

Do other countries have an equivalent charity or are they government run? The closest I can think of is Baywatch style lifeguards, which are I guess state funded

[DastardlyDick]

I sometimes wonder if the decline of people carrying cash means fewer people see a poppy seller and stop to buy one.  That said, I am seeing more and more of the enamel pin badge type poppies, which people often don’t wear on their outer coats.  In the office this week there are many more of the badges than there are paper poppies.  They don’t fall off anything like as easily.

Yes, with the decline in people carrying cash and preferring the metal poppies (I do too) BRO really need to get awareness of their online shop out there - too late for this year, but it's External Link/Members Only for future reference.

[Blackpool Rock]

Yes, but half of £400 million will build and manage care homes/sheltered accommodation for ex service personnel and help towards alcohol/drug treatment/counselling.

There is a saying about there being no such thing as an uninjured serviceman and i'd say it's certainly true if they have seen active service or been in war / conflict zones with bullets flying around.

I knew a lad who was more a friend of a friend but we all went drinking quite often 25 years ago, he'd been part of the peace keeping force in Bosnia and had seen some fucking horrific things.
Remember him saying how they would go into a small town or village and there would be an eerie silence and once you'd experienced it you just knew what was coming next and basically everyone had been murdered but only women and children as all the men were off fighting somewhere else and murdering people in the next village 

He recalled having to deal with small children who had been shot or had their throats cut and I could see his eyes well up as he remembered this stuff and that he was doing this at the time having not seen his own kids back home for almost 6 months

And we wondered why he drank so much once he left the army 

[Colston36]

I sometimes wonder if the decline of people carrying cash means fewer people see a poppy seller and stop to buy one.  That said, I am seeing more and more of the enamel pin badge type poppies, which people often don’t wear on their outer coats.  In the office this week there are many more of the badges than there are paper poppies.  They don’t fall off anything like as easily.

It's a long time since we were at war ...

[Blackpool Rock]

Yes fair points. But the £400m in assets, shouldn't they spend it on their stated aim which is "The Royal British Legion, formerly the British Legion, is a British charity providing financial, social and emotional support to members and veterans of the British Armed Forces, their families and dependants, as well as all others in need."?

They do need to have cash reserves / savings / investments and that's probably a legal thing to ensure they don't run out of money, would you seriously have them spend every penny over the next 12 months and then have to stop all their good work and start turfing people out of accommodation etc 
Surely it's not rocket science 

[Blackpool Rock]

It's a long time since we were at war ...

That's done it, M&B will be trolling this thread now 

[mr.bluesky]

That's done it, M&B will be trolling this thread now 

Nah, the Russian occupation of Ukrain is just a military exercise,  besides which according to M&B its all Western propaganda and cannot be believed.  Come on Blackpool Rock you should know this by now 

[chrishornx]

are you actually doubting that? there  are countless care homes where entry is reserved to ex service men, i cant think of any other occupation that is accorded that privilige, to that extent., ,my relatives have ended their days  there, and one had only done national service.

when you say 'countless' Willie how many do you think there are? Royal British Legion have 6 homes nationwide, who else runs them?

Other occupations do have specific care homes - the Freemasons do and Denville House runs for the theatrical profession.

Why shouldn't our servicemen have care homes specifically for them? - many of the occupants may have injuries from tours of duty, PTSD and there is a strong common bond that would help them in care home. There is nothing to stop others having exclusive homes if they want

And why would people donate to the British Legion to specifically help our brave  servicemen only to find funds  distributed to alll and sundry?

[chrishornx]

That's done it, M&B will be trolling this thread now 

Inevitably 

[DastardlyDick]

That's done it, M&B will be trolling this thread now 

Hopefully, he's too busy spouting nonsense about Russia/Ukraine! 

[FLYING BLUE]

I will always donate and wear a poppy every year for as long as I'm able.

I do not care what anyone else may think, or who I 'offend' when I display this symbol of peace.

FB

[mr.bluesky]

I will always donate and wear a poppy every year for as long as I'm able.

I do not care what anyone else may think, or who I 'offend' when I display this symbol of peace.

FB

100% agree with you 

[chrishornx]

100% agree with you 

And me.
 
Well said FB

[RadioKid]

Tbh I stopped wearing it on principle years back

It was an anti war symbol to highlight the banality of war. Lest we forget the pointless brutality of war and avoidable loss of life.

Yet the constant stream of war profiteering and non-stop conflict the UK manages to push itself into is ridiculous. Politicians love to use it for optics and brownie points but never act on it.

War, conflict and death should never be hijacked by self serving groups.

[Jomoore]

It was an anti war symbol to highlight the banality of war. Lest we forget the pointless brutality of war and avoidable loss of life.

It was and it still is, hence my failing to understand why, suddenly, it has lost its high profile on this day of the year.  There have been some interesting responses on the thread, and it has made me wonder whether some who would normally wear a poppy have been intimidated into not wearing one, or even buying one?  If so, we've got ourselves into a bad place as a nation.