Renting rip off's.

[standardpostage]

A family member is looking to rent a home. No fault eviction due to owners selling the house they are in now.

Looked at one today, 3 bedroom terrace, small northern town. £650 per month 

It was a right tip, I would not live there for free.

Rubbish in front garden, rubbish in back yard. Broken back yard gate. PVC front door damaged, broken light in bathroom. Bath tub tap would not turn off, and loose.
Kitchen taps both extremely loose and floppy. No gas fire or electric fire in the fireplace.
Basically it was just an empty shell, painted with cheap white paint, to hide the damp, we thought. Very scruffy, cheap looking, nasty doors and windows, needed a clean.
The letting agency lady, who showed us round, said a plumber would be requested, to fix the taps. An electrician to fix the lights.
Told her it was not worth £650. I got the impression, she did not care.
I feel sorry for renters nowadays. Rip off prices for low quality accommodation.

[lewisjones23]

£650 for a 3 bed house is cheap

[PilotMan]

Lots of landlords are pulling out of the BTL market due to new legislation and taxation etc. It's getting increasingly harder to make it work, probably the reason why their current landlord is selling up.

Supply
Consequently the available properties for rent are getting fewer, so prices inevitably go up.

Demand
It's harder for people to get a mortgage, so they're forced to rent, increasing the number of people looking for rental properties.

It's a squeeze at both ends - supply and demand.

The effect in the market for selling a property, is that there are many BTL properties coming on to the market, however fewer people qualify to get a mortgage. So asking prices have started to fall.

[standardpostage]

£650 for a 3 bed house is cheap

£650 would have been fair "if" the condition was fair.
"But" it was like a condemned house inside. Not fit for human habitation. Like the house of horrors.
Definitely not suitable for young children, let alone adults.
The area is in a Selective Licensing scheme.
I thing though that it may be one of those rouge landlords. Takes the money, does no repairs.

[shed]

Must be a back street solus agency  to take on a shit hole like that.

[standardpostage]

To PilotMan. Yes your right about the difficulty to get a mortgage. Usually if you can afford the rent, then you can afford the mortgage payments. My family member can't afford the deposit plus associated costs of getting a mortgage.
 Plus the bank reclaimed their 1st house due to divorce and non payment of original mortgage. That's life, as they say.

[Adoniron]

To PilotMan. Yes your right about the difficulty to get a mortgage. Usually if you can afford the rent, then you can afford the mortgage payments. My family member can't afford the deposit plus associated costs of getting a mortgage.
 Plus the bank reclaimed their 1st house due to divorce and non payment of original mortgage. That's life, as they say.

The lenders' affordability rules mean that proof you have been paying rent of eg £650 a month is not proof you can afford to pay a mortgage of £650. It's crazy.

[standardpostage]

Must be a back street solus agency  to take on a shit hole like that.

Just checked the websites involved. The owners of the house cater for people on housing benefits, and also deal with houses of multiple occupancy (HMOs).
The lettings agency looks newish and a bit iffy.

[berksboy]

In Berks £1500+ to rent a 3 bed 

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Cambridge around 1600 to 2000 for a three bed;!...

I was told by an estate agent that a lot of firms pay those rents for their staff, and a lot of the renters were on 6 figure saleries - each!...

[PilotMan]

A friend of mine is involved in some property management and refurbishment. He just oversaw a tenant move in to a large house in Belgravia. They're paying £100k per month rent 😵

[standardpostage]

I think, were slowly going back to The Victorian Era (1837 - 1901) , when three generations lived together 

[GreyDave]

£650 for a 3 bed house is cheap

I am in the cheaper -mid end of refurbing rentals in the North West of London .....You`d be paying 2000 - 2500 pcm for that even 3000 in better areas...

However some are still in the 1200 mark and a fe rare can be found under as doer upers for tennants ...There is a move out by many "Straight " honest landlord as the BTL  market does not work if your un balanced in your finances now you used to be able to borrow and then rent out reciving more rent than intrest due but if your figures are out it doesnt work..

Also many of the lets ive delt with now do not want to supply White goods (Fridge frezer Washing machine oven dishwasher) as you are responseable for the repair and Ive heard of Landlords being held responseable for suppling in event of accident  ( although I onlyyheard of this I cant find on line anything ) . Before covid were aproaced by a Balkans guy and his wife who vagely knew the small house we were about to reburb ...He offered to clean clear and tidy it up for a discount on rent and non payment of Depoist as he had none rather than the house be left empty for a few months the landlord went ahead ....he got the house back as he moved a few months ago ...Spotless the garden could of been Monty Dons and a shitty 30 year old bathroom was like a fresh spa...Landlord was sorry to see them go house was rented  after a week ...this true story is helping to build what i suggest...

Make an offer ;
If you / they are able to take a step back and clean it up take rubbish away and paint it and agree a sum of non payment rent for this it might help .

if you can turn it around , then maybe their lives will turn around for the better too Good Luck 

[sir wanksalot]

£650 would have been fair "if" the condition was fair.
"But" it was like a condemned house inside. Not fit for human habitation. Like the house of horrors.
Definitely not suitable for young children, let alone adults.
The area is in a Selective Licensing scheme.
I thing though that it may be one of those rouge landlords. Takes the money, does no repairs.

I get what you're saying about it being "fair" but think of it another way. £ 650pm for a 3 bed terraced is the current market rate. It may not be fair but that is the market rate. It will be more for a house which is well presented and in good condition.

I am presuming you may be talking about B/Burn/Darwen/Burnley area. I am not that far away and there seems to be a massive shortage of housing stock both for buyers and renters.

[standardpostage]

I am in the cheaper -mid end of refurbing rentals in the North West of London .....You`d be paying 2000 - 2500 pcm for that even 3000 in better areas...

However some are still in the 1200 mark and a fe rare can be found under as doer upers for tennants ...There is a move out by many "Straight " honest landlord as the BTL  market does not work if your un balanced in your finances now you used to be able to borrow and then rent out reciving more rent than intrest due but if your figures are out it doesnt work..

Also many of the lets ive delt with now do not want to supply White goods (Fridge frezer Washing machine oven dishwasher) as you are responseable for the repair and Ive heard of Landlords being held responseable for suppling in event of accident  ( although I onlyyheard of this I cant find on line anything ) . Before covid were aproaced by a Balkans guy and his wife who vagely knew the small house we were about to reburb ...He offered to clean clear and tidy it up for a discount on rent and non payment of Depoist as he had none rather than the house be left empty for a few months the landlord went ahead ....he got the house back as he moved a few months ago ...Spotless the garden could of been Monty Dons and a shitty 30 year old bathroom was like a fresh spa...Landlord was sorry to see them go house was rented  after a week ...this true story is helping to build what i suggest...

Make an offer ;
If you / they are able to take a step back and clean it up take rubbish away and paint it and agree a sum of non payment rent for this it might help .

if you can turn it around , then maybe their lives will turn around for the better too Good Luck 

Thank you for story. Good information 

[standardpostage]

I get what you're saying about it being "fair" but think of it another way. £ 650pm for a 3 bed terraced is the current market rate. It may not be fair but that is the market rate. It will be more for a house which is well presented and in good condition.

I am presuming you may be talking about B/Burn/Darwen/Burnley area. I am not that far away and there seems to be a massive shortage of housing stock both for buyers and renters.

The area is correct. Thanks for info regarding going rates  and availability

[Watts.E.Dunn]

I think, were slowly going back to The Victorian Era (1837 - 1901) , when three generations lived together 

My mum and dad and his sister and hubby lived with my nan in a three bed house back in 1948 to 1952 when the council got their act or enough bricklayers together!..

I do know of Two couples who live with a divorced parents now!..

[Squire Haggard]

An interesting history of house prices. Us boomers had it lucky unlike first time buyers today.

''The average house in the UK currently costs around nine-times average earnings, based on data as at 30 November 2022. The last time house prices were this expensive relative to average earnings was in the year 1876, nearly 150 years ago.''

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[standardpostage]

My mum and dad and his sister and hubby lived with my nan in a three bed house back in 1948 to 1952 when the council got their act or enough bricklayers together!..

I do know of Two couples who live with a divorced parents now!..

Memories of my childhood are coming back now.
Living in a large terraced house on the ground floor.
Another unrelated family, living on the first floor and another unrelated person on the 2nd floor.
At the time, it seemed normal to me.
We had those gas and electric meters in, which you put  real coins in. This was in the 60s.
It was a shared bathroom and toilet.

[standardpostage]

To Squire Haggard. The answer appears to be, build more, smaller affordable houses 
I had a look at your websites.
And increase wages.

[Pillowtalk]

An interesting history of house prices. Us boomers had it lucky unlike first time buyers today.

''The average house in the UK currently costs around nine-times average earnings, based on data as at 30 November 2022. The last time house prices were this expensive relative to average earnings was in the year 1876, nearly 150 years ago.''

External Link/Members Only

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House prices alone give a misleading picture. A decade of historically low interest rates has made houses more affordable to many hence the reason for rapid increases. Rising interest rates seem to be dampening prices. You need to look at house prices and interest rates in combination to assess the 'real' cost of housing.

[Squire Haggard]

House prices alone give a misleading picture. A decade of historically low interest rates has made houses more affordable to many hence the reason for rapid increases. Rising interest rates seem to be dampening prices. You need to look at house prices and interest rates in combination to assess the 'real' cost of housing.

True.

The dip in the chart around 1992, and the recent sharp rise seem to confirm this. 1992 was a time of very high interest rates and a stagnant housing market.

[PilotMan]

There's some great feedback on this thread.

It's good to hear different peoples perspectives on housing, how it applies to them, their specific situation and what the future may look like.

@GreyDave I love your story about the Balkans guy.

There are some really genuine people out there and some good tenants, there are some dreadful one's too.

My worse two were a disabled woman in a wheelchair, she wrecked a bungalow, how she was able to rip a door off of its hinges I'll never know, as well as smashing several holes in the partition walls.

I also had a married pensioners who were very heavy smokers, despite the tenancy stating it was a non smoking home. The whole property had to be jet washed and redecorated, the white UPVC window frames had to be scrubbed with bleach.

Most concerning though, was that one of the pensioners got convicted and sent to prison on historical child sex abuse from the 1970's 

You can't make this stuff up.

[sir wanksalot]

To Squire Haggard. The answer appears to be, build more, smaller affordable houses 
I had a look at your websites.
And increase wages.

I watched a documentary a couple of yrs ago about how housing stock is being taken over by large conglomerates.

When I hear about "affordable housing" I don't believe it.

[DastardlyDick]

Here in leafy Hertfordshire, a one bed "cluster home" is around £800 - 1000 pcm.
As others have said, changes in the Tax regime, and other changes in the Law have made being a Landlord a
less attractive prospect.

[DastardlyDick]

When I hear about "affordable housing" I don't believe it.

Trouble is "affordable" means a maximum of 80% of market value - understandably, developers tend to charge that maximum, which If bought on a BTR basis, gets passed on to the tenants, plus the Landlords profit, which prompt adds another 10 - 15% - you might as well buy!

[standardpostage]

Here in leafy Hertfordshire, a one bed "cluster home" is around £800 - 1000 pcm.
As others have said, changes in the Tax regime, and other changes in the Law have made being a Landlord a
less attractive prospect.

Had to google "cluster house".

A cluster house must share at least two common walls, with their back wall also shared with another property.
Also known as, strata landed homes.

[standardpostage]

A friend of mine is involved in some property management and refurbishment. He just oversaw a tenant move in to a large house in Belgravia. They're paying £100k per month rent 😵

Was it Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates or Elon Musk ? 

[PilotMan]

Was it Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates or Elon Musk ? 

All my friend would tell me was that the guy was a US citizen and was involved in M&A and you would have never heard of him (outside of the M&A world). The house was rented for one year and they paid up front.

[DastardlyDick]

Had to google "cluster house".

A cluster house must share at least two common walls, with their back wall also shared with another property.
Also known as, strata landed homes.

If you imagine building a square house, then putting dividing walls in a cross shape, that's 4 cluster homes.
I'd never.heard of these strata landed homes before today - sounds very posh!

[standardpostage]

All my friend would tell me was that the guy was a US citizen and was involved in M&A and you would have never heard of him (outside of the M&A world). The house was rented for one year and they paid up front.

M & A. Mergers and Acquisitions.

Wow, 100k per month, 1200k up front.

Maybe he came to London, to acquisition the UK and merger it with the USA 

[standardpostage]

I used to work with a lady, whose father, rented out 2 houses, to students in Liverpool.
Every year, he had to refurbish the houses, she said.
The students caused a lot of wear and tear 
Plus, a lot of call outs involved e.g. blocked toilets, central heating issues, cookers going faulty etc.
She said, he made a few bob, but it was a lot of hassle.

[Adoniron]

I used to work with a lady, whose father, rented out 2 houses, to students in Liverpool.
Every year, he had to refurbish the houses, she said.
The students caused a lot of wear and tear 
Plus, a lot of call outs involved e.g. blocked toilets, central heating issues, cookers going faulty etc.
She said, he made a few bob, but it was a lot of hassle.

Yeah houses tend to get wear and tear when people live in them and things go wrong too. If you're the landlord it's your job to fix them. You have responsibilities; there's more to it than sitting back and counting the rent money.

When I got married to my ex we moved into her house. It was during the 1992-94 recession with sky high interest rates and houses weren't selling so I rented my house out. I covered the mortgage and maintenence but that was about it. I sold it as soon as the market picked up.

[JontyR]

I covered the mortgage and maintenence but that was about it. I sold it as soon as the market picked up.

Was that an interest only or repayment mortgage?

My thinking in terms of landlords is that the investment itself is sound. You do indeed pick up an income, but the asset itself generally rises in value too. So whilst the tax breaks aren't what they were there is still a place in an investment portfolio for property.

[Adoniron]

Was that an interest only or repayment mortgage?

My thinking in terms of landlords is that the investment itself is sound. You do indeed pick up an income, but the asset itself generally rises in value too. So whilst the tax breaks aren't what they were there is still a place in an investment portfolio for property.

It was a repayment mortgage. It was a house I had bought to live in, not as an investment. In those days interest rates were about 14%. Also the house wasn't in London. It was a very different rental market to nowadays. I reckon I made a few hundred pounds a year and managed to sell it after about 4 years.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Craptial gains tax and the arsehole tax system are seeing around 30 houses off the rental market a day in the country!.

Most councils are funking useless in housing provision and some housing societies are little better..

[Ali Katt]

My mum and dad and his sister and hubby lived with my nan in a three bed house back in 1948 to 1952 when the council got their act or enough bricklayers together!..

I do know of Two couples who live with a divorced parents now!..

I think the problem is the type of housing available now. Most property going up near me is student housing. Good for the owners and most are large companies like Unite, bad for everyone else, even the students get ripped off by paying for 12 month contracts when they are there for 9. Then there's crap flatpack Barrat homes, ugly tower blocks, shit housing all round.

[WASA38]

Also known as back-to-backs.

Condemned in Disraeli's  1875 Artisan's Dwellings Act if my GCE History studies, 60 years ago, serve me correctly.

[WASA38]

Had to google "cluster house".

A cluster house must share at least two common walls, with their back wall also shared with another property.
Also known as, strata landed homes.

Also known as back-to-backs.

Condemned in Disraeli's  1875 Artisan's Dwellings Act if my GCE History studies, 60 years ago, serve me correctly.

[LincsLad12]

There's a lot of dodgy landlords out there. A few decent ones too, but far more dodgy ones who just want to take their monthly rent and never hear from their tenants.

Having previously worked in property management for 2 years, I can tell you that letting agencies put on a good song and dance about looking after you, but the LLs are their real clients at the end of the day.

I'm surprised I lasted 2 years at that company, my conscience certainly didn't thank me for it 

[Lou2019]

£650 for a 3 bed terrace bloody hell you are spoilt! I understand it’s 1k plus for a 1 bed apartment in the complex I live!

[Watts.E.Dunn]

£650 for a 3 bed terrace bloody hell you are spoilt! I understand it’s 1k plus for a 1 bed apartment in the complex I live!

Good job your not in Cambridge then thats cheap! Thats also why we don't get that many touring ladies here:(..

[Blackpool Rock]

£650 for a 3 bed terrace bloody hell you are spoilt! I understand it’s 1k plus for a 1 bed apartment in the complex I live!

This thread is turning into............ 

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[sparkus]

Kind of related but government is to pass a new "sex for rent" law:

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[standardpostage]

£650 for a 3 bed terrace bloody hell you are spoilt! I understand it’s 1k plus for a 1 bed apartment in the complex I live!

Wow, is that Chelsea, Mayfair or Kensington then ? 

[standardpostage]

This thread is turning into............ 

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Just watched, very funny 

[standardpostage]

Kind of related but government is to pass a new "sex for rent" law:

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Had a quick look, good idea, needs to stop. It's abuse of power.

[Blackpool Rock]

Kind of related but government is to pass a new "sex for rent" law:

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I thought there was a law brought in about this in the last few years anyway 

[PilotMan]

Kind of related but government is to pass a new "sex for rent" law:

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"not allowed estimates that over 200,000 women could be victims of ‘Sex for Rent’ in the United Kingdom".

Must be true if it's on not allowed 

[sparkus]

"not allowed estimates that over 200,000 women could be victims of ‘Sex for Rent’ in the United Kingdom".

Must be true if it's on not allowed 

I know one person who was suggested such an arrangement (15 years ago). The physical description was as you can imagine. His exact words were "would be required to sleep in my bed some evenings".