Author Topic: UK pushes forward with Central Bank Digital Currency (CBDC)  (Read 3280 times)

Offline Bobbyplastic

For those who doubt it will happen, here's the page for recruiting the Head of CBDC in the UK.

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Digital and hard cash will run side by side for a few years, but for how long? Its hard to say. Maybe expect to pay for services with a bag of high value groceries in the future?

Offline standardpostage

Because a lot of people already pay by card / smartphone / smart wristwatch / PayPal / bank transfer etc.

It already feels like we are living in a digital currency era:

Paper money may be going the same was as postal orders and cheques ?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2023, 08:29:59 pm by standardpostage »

Offline daviemac

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Because a lot of people already pay by card / smartphone / smart wristwatch / PayPal / bank transfer etc.

It already feels like we are living in a digital currency era:

Paper money may be going the same was as postal orders and cheques ?
Postal orders are still available??  As are cheques.   :unknown:  External Link/Members Only

Be a long time before cash disappears. 

Offline Mikeh38

The Bank of England have been beta testing the CBDC for a few months, the currency will be programmable and linked to your carbon footprint, in other words buy too much meat etc and your transaction will be rejected. Sunak wants a cashless society by 2025, Tesco will be the first supermarket to introduce biometric payments only at some point this year.

Offline GingerNuts

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It's a middle management role for a consultation exercise.

Quote
The successful candidate will be responsible for leadership of HM Treasury’s work on a potential digital pound - a UK central bank digital currency (CBDC).

Quote
Treasury and the Bank of England are working together through the CBDC Taskforce to explore the case for a digital pound. Treasury and the Bank of England have committed to consult jointly on a potential digital pound, and the successful candidate will lead the Treasury team in the wake of the consultation’s issuance, including working with the Bank of England to consider consultation responses.

Offline mr.bluesky

Postal orders are still available??  As are cheques.   :unknown:  External Link/Members Only

Be a long time before cash disappears.

Agree, small purchases are still bought by cash. Service providers would rather be paid by cash in hand. Would a punter with a shared account with his wife pay for a punt by credit card which the transaction could be traced. I doubt it.

Offline Adoniron

Because a lot of people already pay by card / smartphone / smart wristwatch / PayPal / bank transfer etc.

It already feels like we are living in a digital currency era:

Paper money may be going the same was as postal orders and cheques ?

My kids are in their 20s. They hardly ever cash. They don't use cards much either, just pay by phone.

Offline Blackpool Rock

The Bank of England have been beta testing the CBDC for a few months, the currency will be programmable and linked to your carbon footprint, in other words buy too much meat etc and your transaction will be rejected. Sunak wants a cashless society by 2025, Tesco will be the first supermarket to introduce biometric payments only at some point this year.
Can you use it to buy your tin foil hat  :unknown:

Offline puntingking

The Bank of England have been beta testing the CBDC for a few months, the currency will be programmable and linked to your carbon footprint, in other words buy too much meat etc and your transaction will be rejected. Sunak wants a cashless society by 2025, Tesco will be the first supermarket to introduce biometric payments only at some point this year.

thats not going to happen that quickly as the bank of england will be issuing the new king plastic cash notes early next year. the earliest it may happen will properly be  2028-2029.

The bank of England said last month that the digital money will work alongside physical money so as long there is still a need for it. There are still a lot of 50+ years olds that use cash more than cards so cash will still be here for a good few more years yet.

But once physical cash is gone we can all say goodbye to our freedom as they would be able to stop us from spending our cash if and when they like.

Just keep using cash whenever possible and avoid businesses that don't use cash payments at all.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2023, 03:51:47 am by puntingking »

Offline puntingking


Offline Colston36

For those who doubt it will happen, here's the page for recruiting the Head of CBDC in the UK.

External Link/Members Only

Digital and hard cash will run side by side for a few years, but for how long? Its hard to say. Maybe expect to pay for services with a bag of high value groceries in the future?

British governments have an uncanny talent for fucking up everything they touch. This will be no exception. And the reason is simple. Politicians go to uni, join the club of one or other party, work for a minimum number of years then go into politics with very little experience of real life - and proceed to make a bollocks of our lives.

Offline lostandfound


Offline anyfucker

Many central banks are investigating CBDC.
Here's a tracker of some countries  External Link/Members Only

It doesn't matter what they say, they will try and bring it in. Governments don't give up powers very often, remember income tax was temporary to fund a war.
"..114 countries, representing over 95 percent of global GDP, are exploring a CBDC..."
"...In late 2021, the House of Lords undertook an inquiry into the benefits of a CBDC for the UK and concluded in its report launched in January 2022, that there is no convincing case for why the UK needs a central bank digital currency. In March 2022, the Bank of England announced a research collaboration with MIT’s Digital Currency Initiative. On December 9, 2022, in a letter to the Parliament, the Chancellor to the Exchequer stated that the BoE will release a technical paper on the digital pound and set up consultations on the technical design. Following this, the BoE solicited vendors for a proof-of-concept for a CBDC wallet..."

The real danger in CBDCs is that there is no limit to the level of control that the government could exert over people if money is purely electronic and provided directly by the government.
A CBDC would give government officials full control over the money going into–and coming out of–every person’s account.

This level of government control is not compatible with human rights, economic or political freedom.

CBDC will be linked to people's  "social score", we can already see this in China where people are barred from travel if they infringe a requirement such as covid jab.
Negative interest rates can easily be applied, e.g. your savings could be subject to a 10% haircut to help fund "vital services".
An expiry date could be put on your money to prevent saving.
Purchases of meat could be banned if you have exceeded your permitted carbon allowance - of couse the erroneously named "elite" would still be able to fly their private jets to their ocean villas.

Offline Bigwilts


income tax was temporary to fund a war.

…. And facts are changed to support a prefered version

Income tax was introduced on a temporary basis under the Napoleonoc war, and it was ceased afterwards

The true version of a temporary income tax which didn’t end was in peacetime

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Online estats

I've said for many, many years we will get CBDCs. Cryptos will be regulated out of here so central banks can retain authority over monetary policy, and that is probably correct for currency stabilisation, to some degree.

What people are expressing in terms of  "governmental control", they should really more consider "central bank control" and understad the notion central banks are "independent" with a mandate. The danger isn's so much suddenly overnight the British state will turn into a one party Chinese state, but the CBDCs are a game changer, in these two respects, in my view.

1 - The speed of transmission of monetary policy. This sounds a very dry concept, but the last 12 months should have shown everyone the very destabilising impacts of inflation and monetary policy reactions, and yet the lag within monetary supply policy is multiples of months. e.g. the impact of current interest rate decisions are unlikely to be seen in the real economy for 6-9 months. A CBDC and the alteration in the velocity of money would enable much quicker policy transmission in both tightening and loosening, especially if the middle clearing banks are removed from the process. A very quick example, say the MPC predict a 12-24 month recession (as they are) and wish to stimulate the economy to avoid this, a very simply way to do that in a large service based economy would be to apply a negative interest rate to bank deposits or a time expiry on certain spend on certain services. The reverse would be true, rather than the bank rate sitting at 4% and many commercial banks offering easy access 3%, a clear transmission of the bank rate would more quickly act to withdraw money supply from the economy by encouraging savings. It is in the transmission speed of policy where we could see major changes, IMO.

2 - I would be more interested if we get some form of currency revaluation with the introduction of a CBDC, this is much more the thing to look out for imo, you use the hype and distraction of a CBDC to actually run a devaluation and readjustment to the current currency and thereby all the debt within the economy. My economic view is very clear and i've stated around these parts before. We and many western economies have replaced a lack of productivity and growth by turning to debt to maintain our quality of lives. This debt is unsustainable in many ways and the CBDC offers a way out to policy makers and a way that we all wake up less well off than when we went to bed the day before it.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2023, 07:19:08 am by estats »

Offline puntingking

my view is that this will work alongside physical cash but by 2028-2029 cash will become obsolete. The public will be brainwashed into thinking there is no need for physical cash because everyone will be used to the new digital money that will be brought out. 


Offline RandomGuy99

To will an electronic currency mean that every transaction is tracking and the tax authorities will automatically know every penny we've earned?

How will we anonymously pay for a shag?

Will sales of retail gift cards go suddenly through the roof

I think it'll be 2040 before cash disappears.

Offline sparkus

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A few years later than Johnny predicted in Mike Leigh's Naked in any case.

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« Last Edit: February 07, 2023, 07:47:07 pm by sparkus »

Offline myothernameis


I think it'll be 2040 before cash disappears.

Seen a new story, which the Gov has were aiming for a cashless society by 2050

Offline sparkus

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Seen a new story, which the Gov has were aiming for a cashless society by 2050

Link?

Great news for net zero conspiracy theorists that.

Offline PepeMAGA

Sunak has said that he wants the currency to be programmable, China already have this with their equivalent.
It allows control over what is purchased, it can also have an expiry date, meaning you have to spend it in a set time frame

Offline bigden40

Sunak has said that he wants the currency to be programmable, China already have this with their equivalent.
It allows control over what is purchased, it can also have an expiry date, meaning you have to spend it in a set time frame

He needs to be told to get to fuck.

Offline puntingking

Sunak has said that he wants the currency to be programmable, China already have this with their equivalent.
It allows control over what is purchased, it can also have an expiry date, meaning you have to spend it in a set time frame

so far over a million of chinese people cant even catch the train because their social credit score is not high enough.

welcome to the end of freedom folks when digital currency is here. We can expect government to dictate what we spend our money on and if we have been a bad "boy" or "girl" we can expect the govenment to stop access to our bank accounts in the future once cash is obsolete.   :dash:

Bad in the government eyes may mean we eaten too much meat this week so we will not be aloud to have meat the following week, or we spoke out about the system they are seeking to create then they will punish us by closing our accounts for a period of time. 
« Last Edit: February 08, 2023, 11:16:03 am by puntingking »

Offline anyfucker

To will an electronic currency mean that every transaction is tracking and the tax authorities will automatically know every penny we've earned?

How will we anonymously pay for a shag?

Will sales of retail gift cards go suddenly through the roof

I think it'll be 2040 before cash disappears.
Yes earned and spent
We won't be able to
They might well be removed so we can't use them
?? predicting with times is difficult

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Offline badsin

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Seems cash is making a bit of a comeback, as folk's find it easier to budget with :hi:

Offline puntingking

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Seems cash is making a bit of a comeback, as folk's find it easier to budget with :hi:

Hallelujah  :thumbsup:

Offline PepeMAGA

Thing is, is completely possible to go cashless with our existing currency system, most people are already for most transactions... So why the focus on a digital currency?
Because it has functionality that they want to exploit.

Offline puntingking

Thing is, is completely possible to go cashless with our existing currency system, most people are already for most transactions... So why the focus on a digital currency?
Because it has functionality that they want to exploit.

the negative thing about cashless society is it will remove the option to use physical cash. some may argue that "most people don't use cash no more". But everyone will miss cash when it no longer here.

lets keep cash alive.

Offline Blackpool Rock

the negative thing about cashless society is it will remove the option to use physical cash. some may argue that "most people don't use cash no more". But everyone will miss cash when it no longer here.

lets keep cash alive.
It will be like people going back to vinyl  :drinks:

Offline badsin

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Nigeria, Africa's highest populated country, has recently pushed for the whole population to return all cash to the banks. Seemingly to issue new notes, and push more of population towards digital currency/ payment.
Government and the banks have been unable to issue cash as required, as many don't want to use modern payment methods and have been trying to withdraw cash.
Seemingly markets are running low of food and produce as the movement of cash / payments has massively declined.
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I'll always like to have a cash option :hi:

Offline Collingwood

Lots of reasons given to be very concerned about this. One more is this..
Once cash has gone the bank's will be able to charge you whatever they can get away with to provide you with money "management services"  The banks will be allowed to do this because they have government by the follies ( qv 2008) and the FSA will never have the resources to enforce whatever feeble powers it is given by the banks. Oops - sorry given by government.

Offline PepeMAGA

It will be like people going back to vinyl  :drinks:
Could be, literally might end up creating a new physical currency.
Or trading in physical gold.

Offline j4247

How would you pay for anything where there is no Wi-Fi or 4G?

What happens when the system has a wobbly and stops working for a few hours (or longer)

Another fucking stupid idea by the morons that rule us.

Offline Bobbyplastic

Start date of 2025, to run alongside coins and notes for the time being.
This was presented by King Charles no less.
Your data will be visible to the 'entity' that runs the system, not the Bank of England.

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Offline puntingking

Start date of 2025, to run alongside coins and notes for the time being.
This was presented by King Charles no less.
Your data will be visible to the 'entity' that runs the system, not the Bank of England.

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so maybe early 2030s will physical cash be obsolete.  :unknown:

Offline puntingking

i also heard that queens banknote will not be disappearing for a good few years after the king banknote is issued. sensible decision as it was not long ago before they issued new notes.


Offline Jonestown

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A digital currency is going to make the drugs trade a tad difficult, bad news for Colombia.

Offline Blackpool Rock

A digital currency is going to make the drugs trade a tad difficult, bad news for Colombia.
Physical money won't disappear for a good many years (if ever) and in any case if the £ was to go then they would probably start accepting € or $ instead

Offline puntingking

Physical money will have to stay for a good few more years yet as it is the prefered method of payment for plumbers, electricians, decorators, service providers, punters and barbers.

Offline Jonestown

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Physical money won't disappear for a good many years (if ever) and in any case if the £ was to go then they would probably start accepting € or $ instead

Ah, but when this digital currency regime kicks in would it be legal to have in your possession € or $ ?

Offline Jonestown

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Physical money will have to stay for a good few more years yet as it is the prefered method of payment for plumbers, electricians, decorators, service providers, punters and barbers.

Yes, all occupations high up on the government’s priority listings, no doubt.   :dancegirl:

Offline mills_and_bhuna

To will an electronic currency mean that every transaction is tracking and the tax authorities will automatically know every penny we've earned?

How will we anonymously pay for a shag?

Will sales of retail gift cards go suddenly through the roof

I think it'll be 2040 before cash disappears.
I think we should protest this.
Oh wait a minute.
They're trying to criminalise that.

Offline puntingking

I think we should protest this.
Oh wait a minute.
They're trying to criminalise that.

don't worry. we will still have cash available for a few more years after the launch. After that, who knows, let's not panic just yet  ;)

Offline mills_and_bhuna

Just a thought.
What if you're homeless.
It's not as if houses are cheap.
To buy or heat up.
Another benefit of unfettered Capitalism.
Are homeless shelters going digital?

Offline radioman33

Going To bet at the Races needs cash,if you win you want cash straight away to bet on the next race.

Offline PilotMan

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 My British friend runs quite a few businesses in Sweden, I remember being at one of them circa 2010 and he had a little machine by the side of the cash register. He explained that the device recorded all cash transactions to the tax authorities, and that the authorities occasionally did mystery purchases to make sure you were recording everything.

Sweden are in quite an advanced stage of going cashless. It also fits part of the Swedish social psyche, which may well be different to how its Brits think.
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It might be later than Sweden, but cashless is going to come to the UK, whether we like it or not.

Offline standardpostage

Physical cash / coins will never disappear, because; chefs and cooks need it ! ! !

On one of the recipes I use it says, "Roll the pastry out to the thickness of a £1 coin"  :D

Only joking.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2023, 11:24:53 am by standardpostage »

Offline radioman33

I’ve seen protests about this,it will happen as using cash isn’t the norm anymore.Similar to using a paper machine for a Credit Card transaction.

Offline David1970

Physical money will have to stay for a good few more years yet as it is the prefered method of payment for plumbers, electricians, decorators, service providers, punters and barbers.

You forgot local councillors and MPs, they need cash in the brown envelopes they get.

Offline puntingking

My British friend runs quite a few businesses in Sweden, I remember being at one of them circa 2010 and he had a little machine by the side of the cash register. He explained that the device recorded all cash transactions to the tax authorities, and that the authorities occasionally did mystery purchases to make sure you were recording everything.

Sweden are in quite an advanced stage of going cashless. It also fits part of the Swedish social psyche, which may well be different to how its Brits think.
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It might be later than Sweden, but cashless is going to come to the UK, whether we like it or not.

It won't if there is still a need for cash. In middle europe there is a saying "Cash is king". I say we are about ten years behind sweden.