The Great Noel Clarke mystery

[Colston36]

Peel claimed the 15 year old he was having sex then married lied about her age he thought she was 16. He admitted having sex with girls even younger than his 15 year old wife. Always find it amazing that people defend Peels actions because they see him as some kind of national treasure and not a sexual predator of young girls that he was.

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I always thought he was an A1 cunt with his whispery voice. Anyhow I've nevr understood what's so great about having a minor talent - for spotting real talent in others. 

[King Nuts]

I find the rush to judgment quite disturbing. I read the Guardian piece in its entirety, and while these allegations are pretty odious, I'm not convinced beyond reasonable doubt that any law was broken.

The mood in the media these days is pretty febrile. 'Racist'. 'Sexist'. 'Fascist'. 'Climate Change Denier'... all get flung around, usually by people who seem unable to comprehend any subtlety to an argument or point of view. Sadly for them, it's not against the law to be a cunt, or to leer at women, or take photos of one's own dick.

I don't know Mr Clarke and I don't know much about him. But I do know that virulently leftwing and intolerant thinking dominates pretty much the entire world of news, television drama and entertainment these days, so even if it turns out he didn't do anything illegal, his chances of rehabilitation are close to zero.

[Malvolio]

Innocent until proven guilty anyone?

[Chooser]

Noel who??

[CoolTiger]

First came across him in Auf Wiedersehen Pet, as Wayne's son (Gary Holt).

[sir wanksalot]

Her mum was all for it!  Great play was made of the fact that it was kind of OK because of her mum. Just fucking weird!

Wyman started with her when she was 13 IIRC? Damned right it wouldn't be tolerated today (and it turned my stomach when I read about it all those years ago, so no, I'm not personally a hypocrite).

They were indeed different times, if that had been today both Wyman and Smith's mum would have gone to jail.

It baffles me why he was never done for historic sex abuse. It should go without saying that women should be respected and not be subject to any form of sexual harassment yet it is the media who largely shape that moral discussion to a certain extent. We all know what is right and wrong but the media will put their spin on it e.g. heavy flirting and suggestive language by a male to a woman in the workplace is grounds for dismissal yet 30 years ago it was considered acceptable.

The media are portraying Noel Clarke as a predator yet were happy to ignore the impact of Wyman's dalliance with a child and even to this day turn a blind eye to it

[Ali Katt]

It baffles me why he was never done for historic sex abuse. It should go without saying that women should be respected and not be subject to any form of sexual harassment yet it is the media who largely shape that moral discussion to a certain extent. We all know what is right and wrong but the media will put their spin on it e.g. heavy flirting and suggestive language by a male to a woman in the workplace is grounds for dismissal yet 30 years ago it was considered acceptable.

The media are portraying Noel Clarke as a predator yet were happy to ignore the impact of Wyman's dalliance with a child and even to this day turn a blind eye to it

The thing is Hollywood and TV, as well as the music industry have always been sleazy. Marilyn Monroe spoke about what she had to do in the 60s or the high profile BBC cases. The thing is as I say people only speak out once they are famous: Gwyneth Paltrow or whoever, they're not going to say anything when they are getting bit parts in sitcoms. And I'm sure it goes higher than Noel Clarke.

[smiths]

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

Yes at the time it was seen by the media as a jolly jape and good luck to Wyman,  :rolleyes:Smith was known as a "wild child" up all night partying off her box. Her being underage wasn't that relevant to the media back then. It would be a huge scandal nowadays of course.

John Peel was defended on this forum in the past for being a nonce, mind you the same poster defended a number of convicted nonces like Stuart Hall saying there should be a statute of limitations on crimes committed. Whereas for me IF it was a crime at the time of the offence which noncing was then the time passed since the offence/s occurred is irrelevant IF a conviction is the end result. Hall initially held a press conference castigating his accusers only to plead guilty at the last minute.

As to Clarke get him charged and then in court and we will see if he is guilty or not on the evidence provided, if what I have read is true there must be plenty of people to get the required evidence from.

[winkywanky]

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Hardly any surprise at all, there's clearly a longstanding pattern here with Clarke (sleazy, entitled little shit).

However, I would make a distinction between being a female actor on a Clarke production (he being the writer, producer or director), and shooting alongside him on the Doctor Who set. With the former he is in a position of power and abusing it (akin to Weinstein). With the latter, he's on the same level as you, you're both fulfilling an acting gig...so if he says on the sly he'd love to fuck you, or perhaps he puts his grubby little hands all over your arse, then why the fuck say zilch at the time, and then choose to say it 12yrs later?  All you've done is reinforce his behaviour, and emboldened him to do it some more, perhaps leading to a serious sexual assault on a fellow actress at a later date.

I have total sympathy with women who feel they have little choice but to put up with this shit because the perpetrator has real power over them and their careers, but I have little or no sympathy with women who simply refuse to speak up because they don't have the balls to at the time. Girls, step up to the plate. Stop whingeing about there aren't enough opportunities for women because you are downtrodden by men, when you can't even go and have a quiet word with the producer on a well-known BBC show, where they will fall over themselves to do the right thing. This was before the Savile business came out, but 2009 wasn't very different times from now, where sexual harrassment was already very frowned upon in a very PC, publicly funded broadcaster.

Anyway, on-time or after the event, all these cases will simply serve to fuck up Clarke's shit, and a good job too  .

[willie loman]

cant remember the media condoning bill wyman, if anything they did a service bringing it to the open, have never understood why he wasnt charged.

[JontyR]

With the latter, he's on the same level as you, you're both fulfilling an acting gig...so if he says on the sly he'd love to fuck you, or perhaps he puts his grubby little hands all over your arse, then why the fuck say zilch at the time, and then choose to say it 12yrs later?  All you've done is reinforce his behaviour, and emboldened him to do it some more, perhaps leading to a serious sexual assault on a fellow actress at a later date.

I have total sympathy with women who feel they have little choice but to put up with this shit because the perpetrator has real power over them and their careers, but I have little or no sympathy with women who simply refuse to speak up because they don't have the balls to at the time.

I know the point you are making WW and I widely concur but we don't know the situation with these women. If you are a contracted actor and the other is an extra then there is still a power differential. A good word here. or possibly more importantly the threat of a bad one, the building of a reputation of "being difficult" or that the whole thing is a lot more prevalent than we'd like to think. They also may even have only been on set for one day and they aren't going to keep someone like that on over the guy who is in the next 10/20/30 episodes of a (much sold overseas) show with significant merchandising tie-ins. 

[willie loman]

I know the point you are making WW and I widely concur but we don't know the situation with these women. If you are a contracted actor and the other is an extra then there is still a power differential. A good word here. or possibly more importantly the threat of a bad one, the building of a reputation of "being difficult" or that the whole thing is a lot more prevalent than we'd like to think. They also may even have only been on set for one day and they aren't going to keep someone like that on over the guy who is in the next 10/20/30 episodes of a (much sold overseas) show with significant merchandising tie-ins.

good points, no one wants to rock the boat, and most of us understand the difference between making a move, and being a complete arse, and its nothing to do with being left wing and politically correct

[winkywanky]

I know the point you are making WW and I widely concur but we don't know the situation with these women. If you are a contracted actor and the other is an extra then there is still a power differential. A good word here. or possibly more importantly the threat of a bad one, the building of a reputation of "being difficult" or that the whole thing is a lot more prevalent than we'd like to think. They also may even have only been on set for one day and they aren't going to keep someone like that on over the guy who is in the next 10/20/30 episodes of a (much sold overseas) show with significant merchandising tie-ins.

You are right, some could have been Extras and that would have changed the interpersonal dynamic as you suggest. But I bet they weren't all Extras. I guess we'll never know the fine detail because unless women come forward openly we'll never know who they are. I do hope that with these large numbers becoming apparent now, they'll feel able to do so.

[winkywanky]

good points, no one wants to rock the boat, and most of us understand the difference between making a move, and being a complete arse, and its nothing to do with being left wing and politically correct

True. And that distinction is often dismissed these days because there is general hysteria about this whole issue.

Perfect example is Barrowman getting his cock out. He's a complete dick for doing so (pun intended) but the impression we get is that women don't feel intimidated by it because there isn't sexual intent as such. He may also have a really small willy of course  Doing it to blokes would be another matter though, and Spacey hit the fan for this very reason.

[willie loman]

True. And that distinction is often dismissed these days because there is general hysteria about this whole issue.

Perfect example is Barrowman getting his cock out. He's a complete dick for doing so (pun intended) but the impression we get is that women don't feel intimidated by it because there isn't sexual intent as such. He may also have a really small willy of course  Doing it to blokes would be another matter though, and Spacey hit the fan for this very reason.

bowie was keen on showing his dick to all and sundry, its all context , no one objected, its in debbie harrys autobiography i believe