The Great Noel Clarke mystery

[Colston36]

For 20 years apparently this man was being a beast to women

See External Link/Members Only

The point is, with him and many others, that everyone knew and nobody said anything. I assume that getting work mattered  more than anything else. All hypocrites.

This reminds me of the story about Nell Gwynne whose carriage was waylaid by people who thought she was Charles 11's French mistress.

"No, no, good folk" she protested. "I am the English whore."

I do love an honest whore. Especially a grubby one.

[sparkus]

I suspect of the 20, 10 could be genuine shocking harassment and 10 will be grievances about other stuff with this tacked on to make it stick.  But even if only 10 of those are genuine there's probably plenty more who haven't and won't come forward.  He's obviously entitled to his side of the story(s) but his carefully managed 'apology' doesn't really cut it.

It's pretty clueless to be working at that level and do anything like this but he would be mindful of the fact that many will tolerate or not speak out because of 'the nature of the industry' and also many of the incidents took place in a less social media speak out era.

Hardeep Singh Koli has been suspended by TV bosses numerous times (usually after warnings unheeded) and with multiple other accusations against him.  Yet he's still getting work.

[Chorley]

I was a bit gutted when I read this TBH. He's a talented guy and the Kidulthood films are really good. If it's true then he's a massive cunt in my book and deserves the book throwing at him. 

[sparkus]

I wasn't that well up on the details but surely the naked audition video sharing would be illegal and he should be expecting his collar felt?

[winkywanky]

The old saying no smoke without fire is not always but often, true. Multiply that by 20 different women, over a prolonged period of time, and there's obviously a real problem here.

Extremely disappointed to see his carefully-worded 'apology' was immediately prefixed by all his 'good works' in the acting field. Fed up with that bullshit.

If you fucked up, you fucked up. You fucked up bigtime, and you kept on fucking up. All the time while you were doing your 'good works' you were fucking up. Deal with what you did, anything else unrelated is immaterial .

I suspect his career is dead, for some time at least, and he only has himself to blame. As for being married all those years with three kids to show for it, well I guess the UKP perspective might be no-one's perfect (and none of us is) but to be so fucking blatant and entitled is almost beyond belief, actually doing some of this shit on set and in front of other people.

[Chorley]

The old saying no smoke without fire is not always but often, true. Multiply that by 20 different women, over a prolonged period of time, and there's obviously a real problem here.

Extremely disappointed to see his carefully-worded 'apology' was immediately prefixed by all his 'good works' in the acting field. Fed up with that bullshit.

If you fucked up, you fucked up. You fucked up bigtime, and you kept on fucking up. All the time while you were doing your 'good works' you were fucking up. Deal with what you did, anything else unrelated is immaterial .

I suspect his career is dead, for some time at least, and he only has himself to blame. As for being married all those years with three kids to show for it, well I guess the UKP perspective might be no-one's perfect (and none of us is) but to be so fucking blatant and entitled is almost beyond belief, actually doing some of this shit on set and in front of other people.

It beggars belief, doesn't it? 

[sparkus]

The old saying no smoke without fire is not always but often, true. Multiply that by 20 different women, over a prolonged period of time, and there's obviously a real problem here.

Extremely disappointed to see his carefully-worded 'apology' was immediately prefixed by all his 'good works' in the acting field. Fed up with that bullshit.

If you fucked up, you fucked up. You fucked up bigtime, and you kept on fucking up. All the time while you were doing your 'good works' you were fucking up. Deal with what you did, anything else unrelated is immaterial .

I suspect his career is dead, for some time at least, and he only has himself to blame. As for being married all those years with three kids to show for it, well I guess the UKP perspective might be no-one's perfect (and none of us is) but to be so fucking blatant and entitled is almost beyond belief, actually doing some of this shit on set and in front of other people.

The Post Office exec responsible for the Horizon scandal also used "good works" to deflect from her conduct.

I suspect one of the factors which accelerated his behaviour was the fact that as a 'star' you do get shedloads of women throwing themselves at you, either because of your status (which makes you more attractive than you would otherwise be) or because of some perceived industry advantage in their careers.

I'm wondering how many of us on here have been saints in the workplace though? I know I haven't and over the years whilst I have told myself that everything I did was 'consensual', I do wonder how many of those involved went along with it to shut me up or felt they had to because they'd lose their job or something.  It has kept me awake at night occasionally (I should add I've never had any complaints made against me and I always carefully read the signs before doing anything).

[winkywanky]

I suspect of the 20, 10 could be genuine shocking harassment and 10 will be grievances about other stuff with this tacked on to make it stick.  But even if only 10 of those are genuine there's probably plenty more who haven't and won't come forward.  He's obviously entitled to his side of the story(s) but his carefully managed 'apology' doesn't really cut it.

It's pretty clueless to be working at that level and do anything like this but he would be mindful of the fact that many will tolerate or not speak out because of 'the nature of the industry' and also many of the incidents took place in a less social media speak out era.

Hardeep Singh Koli has been suspended by TV bosses numerous times (usually after warnings unheeded) and with multiple other accusations against him.  Yet he's still getting work.

I think in Clarke's case the fact that he wasn't simply an actor - he was also a producer, director and had a Production Company too - meant that he wielded a fair amount of 'power' in the industry. In other words, just like Weinstein, he had the power to give employment and opportunities, and take them away. In essence, power corrupts.

I couldn't recall similar allegations against Kohli, but that apparently all came out 12yrs ago? I don't see much of him in my everyday viewing anyway, so I don't know whether he has 'rehabilitated' his career back to where it was?

For me, a big part of any possible rehabilitation is to do with the nature and timing of the apology. Obvs there may be legal ramifications to any apology, but notwithstanding that, just put your hands up and apologise unreservedly, and say you won't do it again. I must confess, another thing that does piss me off is the I'm a bonafide sex addict/I'll get treatment angle that is so often trotted out by perpetrators. I just find that to be 99% bollocks.

[NIK]

Made me laugh when ITV pulled his current prgramme with one episode to go. I had watched the first three and was halfway through the fourth. I had recorded them all as I never watch commercial tv programmes live for the obvious reason of avoiding the insufferable adverts. Instead of taking up an hour of your life recording commercial programmes saves you 15 minues per epidose so about an hour of a mini series. Anyway on hearing it had been pulled I thought no point in watching the rest of episode 4 and deleted my planned recording of 5. No sooner had I done that than as they announced the change they said it would be available on ITV hub, so I did finish it but had to endure the ads, fortunately not as many as live.

Now I had thought having invested in a series they aren't just going to scrap it before the last episode. So why could it be shown on hub but not live? Albeit it's only available for a couple of days which isn't the norm.

Now Clarke may be a knob and he was the lead role, but there were others in the programme, it wasn't just about him, and why should the audience who have invested their time in the programme be denied the ending because of political correctness?
Clarke's career was on a role, although personally I could take him or leave him, but he's probably fucked it now. On no account can you carry on like that these days.  Look at Kevin Spacey, once the toast of tinsletown, now persona non gratis.

You even have to be careful saying 'you look nice' to a woman these days. Probably safter to say 'you're an ugly cunt!' 

[sparkus]

I couldn't recall similar allegations against Kohli, but that apparently all came out 12yrs ago? I don't see much of him in my everyday viewing anyway, so I don't know whether he has 'rehabilitated' his career back to where it was?

The stuff I read was a lot more recent than 12 years ago: External Link/Members Only

I have absolutely no recollection of ever seeing him on anything other than by accident when clicking on The One Show then quickly changing channel.

[winkywanky]

The Post Office exec responsible for the Horizon scandal also used "good works" to deflect from her conduct.

I suspect one of the factors which accelerated his behaviour was the fact that as a 'star' you do get shedloads of women throwing themselves at you, either because of your status (which makes you more attractive than you would otherwise be) or because of some perceived industry advantage in their careers.

I'm wondering how many of us on here have been saints in the workplace though? I know I haven't and over the years whilst I have told myself that everything I did was 'consensual', I do wonder how many of those involved went along with it to shut me up or felt they had to because they'd lose their job or something.  It has kept me awake at night occasionally (I should add I've never had any complaints made against me and I always carefully read the signs before doing anything).

Yes, and it's as invalid for her as it is for anyone else. I see that she has realised that and seems to have stood down from pretty well any public role she had? Of course her case is slightly different, in that she has a big wedge of money and she's of retirement age (or thereabouts). Beyond the realisation and perception by others of what she did, she has no worries as such.

Clarke will indeed have had some women throwing themselves at him, and perhaps some of these complaints are from women who didn't get what they wanted out of their dealings with him. But all the (at least 20) women who have come forward would indicate that Clarke was misbehaving on a pretty grand scale, and most of it was unsolicited and unwanted. They're certainly not all women scorned.

As for your own workplace peccadilloes, only you can have an idea of whether you really hurt anyone, and I think deep down most guys do. It's about reading signals, and sometimes flirting and even some physical contact is welcomed. To think otherwise would be naive. I think in the case of situations like Clarke and Weinstein though, by far the biggest aggravating factor is the position of power, that makes it toxic. The hire or fire thing (and not just on that gig, the potentially-missed gigs which might come out of that one), plus the fact that effectively there isn't an HR dept to go to to lodge a complaint.

Unless you were actually the HR manager sparkus, I feel sure that any advances you made were well researched and welcomed  .

[winkywanky]

Made me laugh when ITV pulled his current prgramme with one episode to go. I had watched the first three and was halfway through the fourth. I had recorded them all as I never watch commercial tv programmes live for the obvious reason of avoiding the insufferable adverts. Instead of taking up an hour of your life recording commercial programmes saves you 15 minues per epidose so about an hour of a mini series. Anyway on hearing it had been pulled I thought no point in watching the rest of episode 4 and deleted my planned recording of 5. No sooner had I done that than as they announced the change they said it would be available on ITV hub, so I did finish it but had to endure the ads, fortunately not as many as live.

Now I had thought having invested in a series they aren't just going to scrap it before the last episode. So why could it be shown on hub but not live? Albeit it's only available for a couple of days which isn't the norm.

Now Clarke may be a knob and he was the lead role, but there were others in the programme, it wasn't just about him, and why should the audience who have invested their time in the programme be denied the ending because of political correctness?
Clarke's career was on a role, although personally I could take him or leave him, but he's probably fucked it now. On no account can you carry on like that these days.  Look at Kevin Spacey, once the toast of tinsletown, now persona non gratis.

You even have to be careful saying 'you look nice' to a woman these days. Probably safter to say 'you're an ugly cunt!' 

I too found it slightly bizarre that they pulled it from the schedules, but that it was still available online on the ITVHub. All it means is that of the fans of the show who wanted to watch the final episode regardless, if you didn't have a smart TV or internet access, then tough shit  .

[Gordon Bennett]

The backdrop of silence or omerta about this sort of stuff came crumbling down in 2017 and since then there have been many blokes outed and bought to book/cancelled. Given this more receptive environment to such allegations, I do wonder why ladies didn't report Clarke's antics in these previous 3 years though. Maybe him not fitting the stereotypical view of a porky, sweaty, middle-aged privileged white man made it a bit harder I suppose?

[winkywanky]

The stuff I read was a lot more recent than 12 years ago: External Link/Members Only

I have absolutely no recollection of ever seeing him on anything other than by accident when clicking on The One Show then quickly changing channel.

I have no idea whether his misdemeanours were as serious and/or as frequent as Clarke's seem to be? CBB on C5 isn't really a barometer of whether someone has been rehabiltated, rather it would put them back in the public eye, and from that point it would be of interest to see whether they got major gigs on major channels afterwards.

[winkywanky]

The backdrop of silence or omerta about this sort of stuff came crumbling down in 2017 and since then there have been many blokes outed and bought to book/cancelled. Given this more receptive environment to such allegations, I do wonder why ladies didn't report Clarke's antics in these previous 3 years though. Maybe him not fitting the stereotypical view of a porky, sweaty, middle-aged privileged white man made it a bit harder I suppose?

It was presumably the distaste/disgust at his recent Bafta Lifetime Achievement award and other accolades, as an industry 'good-egg'? Plus the domino effect, once someone has come forward then others also feel able to.

[Ali Katt]

Usually it goes deeper. Either he knows something or he's covering for others.

[sparkus]

Yes, and it's as invalid for her as it is for anyone else. I see that she has realised that and seems to have stood down from pretty well any public role she had? Of course her case is slightly different, in that she has a big wedge of money and she's of retirement age (or thereabouts). Beyond the realisation and perception by others of what she did, she has no worries as such.

Clarke will indeed have had some women throwing themselves at him, and perhaps some of these complaints are from women who didn't get what they wanted out of their dealings with him. But all the (at least 20) women who have come forward would indicate that Clarke was misbehaving on a pretty grand scale, and most of it was unsolicited and unwanted. They're certainly not all women scorned.

As for your own workplace peccadilloes, only you can have an idea of whether you really hurt anyone, and I think deep down most guys do. It's about reading signals, and sometimes flirting and even some physical contact is welcomed. To think otherwise would be naive. I think in the case of situations like Clarke and Weinstein though, by far the biggest aggravating factor is the position of power, that makes it toxic. The hire or fire thing (and not just on that gig, the potentially-missed gigs which might come out of that one), plus the fact that effectively there isn't an HR dept to go to to lodge a complaint.

Unless you were actually the HR manager sparkus, I feel sure that any advances you made were well researched and welcomed  .

I suppose one of the motivatory factors, again, would the women who didn't throw themselves at him but he cloaked himself in a belief that as some did then he was invincible.  I can only comment on what I have seen at the very Z list end of the industry, but a friend works in PR and I've lost count the number of times I've seen him skulk off to toilets at dismal events to be sucked off by someone who think it will either lead to a glittering career in showbusiness or it will get them access to the stars ("Of course you can have Olly Murs' phone number!")

I have since university worked in office environments where anything of that sort would be instant dismissal (though had several flings as a consequence of work nights out etc.) but when I did work in and later manage pubs then sex was on tap, the first few times with divorced landladies who regarded it as some kind of perk of theirs.  On two occasions my opening gambit to move things along after weeks of flirting was to grope from behind (both Italians, funnily enough).  On the HR front I did once fire someone for groping a girl on her first day, I was actually bollocked by the regional manager as he said she was probably illegal so I should have fired her instead if it was causing friction

I once worked at a record label (really shit dance one) where a very dim PA was told off by the office manager for her revealing dress, I of course used it as fair game to comment on the size of what it contained and managed to get this to lead from one thing to another over coming weeks.  After fucking her several times she came out with a line about not her minding that much but her boyfriend might not approve etc.

Anyway, I'll shut up about what's on my chest or Hardeep thingybloke as Noel Clarke is clearly a cunt.

[winkywanky]

I suppose one of the motivatory factors, again, would the women who didn't throw themselves at him but he cloaked himself in a belief that as some did then he was invincible.  I can only comment on what I have seen at the very Z list end of the industry, but a friend works in PR and I've lost count the number of times I've seen him skulk off to toilets at dismal events to be sucked off by someone who think it will either lead to a glittering career in showbusiness or it will get them access to the stars ("Of course you can have Olly Murs' phone number!")

I have since university worked in office environments where anything of that sort would be instant dismissal (though had several flings as a consequence of work nights out etc.) but when I did work in and later manage pubs then sex was on tap, the first few times with divorced landladies who regarded it as some kind of perk of theirs.  On two occasions my opening gambit to move things along after weeks of flirting was to grope from behind (both Italians, funnily enough).  On the HR front I did once fire someone for groping a girl on her first day, I was actually bollocked by the regional manager as he said she was probably illegal so I should have fired her instead if it was causing friction

I once worked at a record label (really shit dance one) where a very dim PA was told off by the office manager for her revealing dress, I of course used it as fair game to comment on the size of what it contained and managed to get this to lead from one thing to another over coming weeks.  After fucking her several times she came out with a line about not her minding that much but her boyfriend might not approve etc.

Anyway, I'll shut up about what's on my chest or Hardeep thingybloke as Noel Clarke is clearly a cunt.

You are clearly nowhere near a Noel Clarke sparkus, so thank you for reinforcing my view of you as a tits and arse man who simply loves women who possess them, and is like a boy in a sweetshop with winning ways. Big difference.

Shocked to hear you were in a hire & fire role though, and could easily have turned that situation to your own advantage after sacking the groper...or infact, did you? 

[sparkus]

You are clearly nowhere near a Noel Clarke sparkus, so thank you for reinforcing my view of you as a tits and arse man who simply loves women who possess them, and is like a boy in a sweetshop with winning ways. Big difference.

Shocked to hear you were in a hire & fire role though, and could easily have turned that situation to your own advantage after sacking the groper...or infact, did you? 

If anything I've always been too cautious and wary of being slapped across the face.

On the HR point, me and the regional manager didn't see eye to eye on much and I didn't stay much longer so I probably only worked about three more shifts with the girl who owned the 'Spanish ID card'.  She was definitely out of my league anyway.

[Dickled]

I find him pretty odious here....

External Link/Members Only

[Rack Admirer]

There were similar allegations against Alex Salmond and they were all rejected in a court of law. The rejection implied a conspiracy amongst his accusers. Could something similar be happening to Noel?

[sparkus]

I find him pretty odious here....

External Link/Members Only

Christ.

John Barrowman was notorious for his penis 'tricks' on cast and crew though, did anything ever happen to him?

[winkywanky]

There were similar accusations against Alex Salmond and they were all rejected in a court of law. The rejection implied a conspiracy amongst his accusers. Could something similar be happening to Noel?

Possibly, but in the case of Salmond the whole scenario became politicised, which infact may have done him a favour. There was I believe, proven communication between the various accusers too, as well as Sturgeon not following the letter of the law in dealing with it.

In the case of Clarke it seems to be more a case of the Weinstein/Savile 'effect', where victims didn't know each other, but felt encouraged to come forward after others had, with no coordination at all..

[winkywanky]

Christ.

John Barrowman was notorious for his penis 'tricks' on cast and crew though, did anything ever happen to him?

Despite Clarke's frankly weird and over the top behaviour in that video (in itself a little intimidatory I think), he does make a valid point. Gay guys often do behave outrageously with women. Two reasons I think, they are often overtly sexual in their behaviour anyway, plus with women it can be 'laughed off' as non-intimidating because nothing sexual will happen. Or at least many gay guys think that, and I think women feel they have to 'allow' it to be seen as right on.

To me, that behaviour just always comes across as uncomfortable, certainly when taken to those extremes (getting your dick out all the time FFS  ). Athough I guess you'd have to take into consideration the relationship between the 'giver' and the receiver, many gay guys do have close relationships with women where it can all just be a good laugh. But I wouldn't mind betting many women just find it utterly naff, especially in a work situation.

[sparkus]

Despite Clarke's frankly weird and over the top behaviour in that video (in itself a little intimidatory I think), he does make a valid point. Gay guys often do behave outrageously with women. Two reasons I think, they are often overtly sexual in their behaviour anyway, plus with women it can be 'laughed off' as non-intimidating because nothing sexual will happen. Or at least many gay guys think that, and I think women feel they have to 'allow' it to be seen as right on.

To me, that behaviour just always comes across as uncomfortable, certainly when taken to those extremes (getting your dick out all the time FFS  ). Athough I guess you'd have to take into consideration the relationship between the 'giver' and the receiver, many gay guys do have close relationships with women where it can all just be a good laugh. But I wouldn't mind betting many women just find it utterly naff, especially in a work situation.

That's the thing, people like Clarke hide in plain sight and deflect by using others' behaviour as a cloak for their own transgressions.

Barrowman's routine was quite gross and to be honest worthy of criminal charges.  He used to put a ball in his foreskin then throw it at crew members to 'catch'.

I have worked with one or two rugger bugger type blokes who think it's the height of humour to show your dick or pubes in a pub

[Chorley]

I find him pretty odious here....

External Link/Members Only

That was creepy and awkward without the context of the allegations.With them it makes him look like awful. 

[sir wanksalot]

All hypocrites.

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

[Chorley]

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

Don't  forget Jimmy Paige and his under age flings. 

[David1970]

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

People forget John Peel marrying a 15 year old

[winkywanky]

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

Her mum was all for it!  Great play was made of the fact that it was kind of OK because of her mum. Just fucking weird!

Wyman started with her when she was 13 IIRC? Damned right it wouldn't be tolerated today (and it turned my stomach when I read about it all those years ago, so no, I'm not personally a hypocrite).

They were indeed different times, if that had been today both Wyman and Smith's mum would have gone to jail.

[sparkus]

We're ALL hypocrites. You may not be old enough to remember the very public relationship of Bill Wyman and Mandy Smith.

The media seemed happy enough to smile at the nudge nudge wink wink nature of it. Even to this day no criminal proceedings were brought against him.

Can't wait for the response to this one.

As I recall, another Clark (Alan, MP), took up with his wife when she was 14 and he was 28, marrying two years later.  Though it's not relevant to these recent revelations

[winkywanky]

People forget John Peel marrying a 15 year old

Rather like Jerry Lee Lewis marrying his own young cousin,however distasteful most people might find it, was that not legal in the US State in which it happened?

[winkywanky]

Can't wait for the response to this one.

As I recall, another Clark (Alan, MP), took up with his wife when she was 14 and he was 28, marrying two years later.  Though it's not relevant to these recent revelations

He was a nasty, randy old dog. Didn't he fuck a mother and daughter from the high class set? It might even have been a threesome.

[winkywanky]

By the way, I should state I have no actual specific interest in this shit, just that my old man used to get the NoTW all those years ago    .

[sparkus]

He was a nasty, randy old dog. Didn't he fuck a mother and daughter from the high class set? It might even have been a threesome.

In theory I'd have no objections to a similar arrangement provided all were comfortable with it.

[winkywanky]

...so anyway, I wonder how long it will take for Barrowman to issue a statement regarding his (and other) behaviour(s), some of which were highlighted in that Youtube clip of Clarke? I should imagine he's wringing his hands as we speak, and perhaps consulting with his Agent and Lawyer.

[David1970]

Rather like Jerry Lee Lewis marrying his own young cousin,however distasteful most people might find it, was that not legal in the US State in which it happened?

John Peel was 10 years older than her, he was 25 and she was 15 years old. The age of consent in Texas is 17. The minimum age is 14 with an age differential of 3 years; thus, those who are at least 14 years of age can legally have sex with those less than 3 years older.
Always amazed me why people defend Peel because they liked the music he played, he had sex with a minor FFS.

External Link/Members Only

[winkywanky]

In theory I'd have no objections to a similar arrangement provided all were comfortable with it.

In that case the girl might have been of legal age 

Apparently he was hung like a horse and with a silver tongue to match. A bit of a legend for some, within House of Commons circles by all accounts.

[winkywanky]

John Peel was 10 years older than her, he was 25 and she was 15 years old. The age of consent in Texas is 17. The minimum age is 14 with an age differential of 3 years; thus, those who are at least 14 years of age can legally have sex with those less than 3 years older.
Always amazed me why people defend Peel because they liked the music he played, he had sex with a minor FFS.

In that case it was illegal then. Did he effectively do a runner or something? Trying to remember...

[sparkus]

What always struck me as utterly bizarre about Noel Clarke was that his first acting role was as the replacement for Gary Holton's character Wayne in Auf Weidershen Pet, playing his 'son'.

[winkywanky]

What always struck me as utterly bizarre about Noel Clarke was that his first acting role was as the replacement for Gary Holton's character Wayne in Auf Weidershen Pet, playing his 'son'.

Ah, I never saw the later Eps.

So obvs this was after the very sad death of Holton? I guess the age would have been about right. I don't know whether Clarke is mixed race, but he's quite light-skinned so Holton's character could easily have had a Black gf?

[sparkus]

John Peel was 10 years older than her, he was 25 and she was 15 years old. The age of consent in Texas is 17. The minimum age is 14 with an age differential of 3 years; thus, those who are at least 14 years of age can legally have sex with those less than 3 years older.
Always amazed me why people defend Peel because they liked the music he played, he had sex with a minor FFS.

External Link/Members Only

As I recall Peel had a very chequered past of under-age sex, which he even boasted about in his autobiography (copping BJs from teenage groupies out the back of that Texan radio station) and post-Savile the Beeb were at pains to delete anything positive or tribute-laden to him.  Though he still got a blue plaque in 2018 according to his chequered past-free Wikipedia entry.

[sparkus]

Ah, I never saw the later Eps.

So obvs this was after the very sad death of Holton? I guess the age would have been about right. I don't know whether Clarke is mixed race, but he's quite light-skinned so Holton's character could easily have had a Black gf?

Holton died in 1985.  It's very plausible that 'Wayne' would have been putting it around in 1975, yeah.

The mixed race backstory of the producers stacks up but personally I don't think Clarke looks anything other than the son of the two Trinidadians that he is.

[winkywanky]

Holton died in 1985.  It's very plausible that 'Wayne' would have been putting it around in 1975, yeah.

The mixed race backstory of the producers stacks up but personally I don't think Clarke looks anything other than the son of the two Trinidadians that he is.

Most ignorant White folk like me wouldn't know that though  . It's a bit like on EastEnders, if they want to have an Asian family on the show there generally aren't enough actors around/available who all look the part, so you end up with a mix of Pakistani and Indian which must leave many Asian viewers watching in utter disbelief (albeit at the same time, grateful for the on-screen family being on there in the first place, especially if the scripts are any good).

[Ali Katt]

Don't  forget Jimmy Paige and his under age flings. 

And Sir Paul McCartney.

[JontyR]

I'm guessing there was some pretty quick legal opinions taken at ITV and contracts with key advertisers / sponsors scrutinized and some quick consultations with them made.

Not being part of the that world or mindset it's all a bit alien to me. Obviously there is the comparison with Weinstein and that does make me wonder, do these kind of folks have something in their mindset that means the same reason why they abuse their position actually drives them forward in their career?

Not saying the motivation is to abuse the position for sexual gratification, just that they have a single-mindedness or sense of entitlement that manifests itself both in reaching positions of influence and being a lecherous wotsit. 

[sparkus]

Most ignorant White folk like me wouldn't know that though  . It's a bit like on EastEnders, if they want to have an Asian family on the show there generally aren't enough actors around/available who all look the part, so you end up with a mix of Pakistani and Indian which must leave many Asian viewers watching in utter disbelief (albeit at the same time, grateful for the on-screen family being on there in the first place, especially if the scripts are any good).

Yes, there was that family on there before which was a one family caliphate.

That later series of AWP was rubbish anyway, the dynamic between the characters and regionality/adversity was lost and it just wasn't the same watching Lewis and Spender on screen compared to when they were all unknown actors (and a wrestler).

[snaitram99]

John Peel was 10 years older than her, he was 25 and she was 15 years old. The age of consent in Texas is 17. The minimum age is 14 with an age differential of 3 years; thus, those who are at least 14 years of age can legally have sex with those less than 3 years older.
Always amazed me why people defend Peel because they liked the music he played, he had sex with a minor FFS.

External Link/Members Only

I think the Jerry Lee Lewis marriage was legal at the time it happened. So presumably was the John Peel one if it was a proper marriage, don't know the details. I think many US States have increased the age of consent and marriage in recent years. It used to be possible to get married at 12 in some states.

In the UK the age of consent was raised to 16 in 1885, but 15 was considered earlier in the parliamentary debates. Interestingly, the minimum age for marriage, then 14 for males and 12 for females  (!) was not raised to 16 until 1929. I don't know if being married was a defence to under age sex.

(I am not a lawyer) 

[David1970]

I think the Jerry Lee Lewis marriage was legal at the time it happened. So presumably was the John Peel one if it was a proper marriage, don't know the details. I think many US States have increased the age of consent and marriage in recent years. It used to be possible to get married at 12 in some states.

In the UK the age of consent was raised to 16 in 1885, but 15 was considered earlier in the parliamentary debates. Interestingly, the minimum age for marriage, then 14 for males and 12 for females  (!) was not raised to 16 until 1929. I don't know if being married was a defence to under age sex.

(I am not a lawyer) 

Peel claimed the 15 year old he was having sex then married lied about her age he thought she was 16. He admitted having sex with girls even younger than his 15 year old wife. Always find it amazing that people defend Peels actions because they see him as some kind of national treasure and not a sexual predator of young girls that he was.

External Link/Members Only

[winkywanky]

Peel claimed the 15 year old he was having sex then married lied about her age he thought she was 16. He admitted having sex with girls even younger than his 15 year old wife. Always find it amazing that people defend Peels actions because they see him as some kind of national treasure and not a sexual predator of young girls that he was.

External Link/Members Only

Interesting piece, and in many ways typical of the Daily Mail: whilst I would in no way condone the activities of any of these abusers involved in showbiz (and that went across the board, not just at the BBC and not just in TV per se, but right across the entertainment industry), and whilst the article does fairly draw a distinction between the activities of a piece of shit like Savile, and those of Peel, it simply cannot resist having a snide dig about Leveson.

The fact remains that Leveson left the newspaper industry pretty well untouched, and they still self-regulate. Unlike TV Broadcast News, which is (quite correctly IMO) tightly controlled by Ofcom in terms of taste and impartiality. Newspapers bleat endlessly about their ability to be 'fearless and free' and how outside regulation would have ruined that, but there is absolutely no reason whatsoever why they couldn't conduct any amount of bonafide investigative journalism with complete morally-justified impunity, in exactly the same way that the BBC, ITV, Sky News and C4 has to do. What outside regulation would have meant though, is that the tawdry titlte-tattle which accounts for most of their sales would have been much-curtailed, and in a world of falling newspaper sales (which is actually sad), everyone knew that.

The fact of the matter is, although a desirable and indeed necessary part of a modern democratic society is a healthy newspaper press, it is essentially boring informational content with big effrots made to spruce it up into something exciting. That is up to the skill of the journalist and editor. But you won't in a million years get groupies hanging around outside their offices, waiting to give their favourite journalist a blowjob. They are by and large, fucking boring.

Contrast that with TV, where real celebrities appear on your screen live, gyrating their bodies in a sexual way and singing risqué lyrics for example (that's Rock & Roll folks!), inflaming the passions of adolescent teens with raging hormones. For newspapers such as the Mail to set themselves up as being in some way morally superior is bollocks. Without wishing to appear unkind to skilled and capable print journalists, the life of a newspaper hack ain't half as glamorous as being Jon Sopel having a (totally impartial, you understand) laugh at Trump's expense on his home turf, live On Air.

It's jealousy, plain and simple, as their readership goes slowly down the pan. And as for that famous NoTW phrase: as the madame of the house was about to offer her sexual services to us, we made our excuses and left, does anyone actually believe that?