Life, the universe and everything

[catweazle]

I have been following the Mars Perseverance lander, and the mini helicopter due to go live shortly, with interest, as this is something I've always been interested in.

It did, however get me musing over the universe in general, and there are some areas I'm very curious about but cannot get my head around:

A) The 'Big Bang' theory.  If you accept that the universe started in one moment, with the so-called Big Bang what was there a half second before the Big Bang?

B) The 'Expanding Universe' theory. This holds that, since the Big Bang, the Universe is steadily expanding from wherever the Big Bang took place. If so, what is it expanding into? What lies 100 yards beyond the outer edge?

C) infinity. If the universe is infinite ( but this conflicts with the expansion theory) then, logically, there are 1) an infinite number of stars, surrounded by 2) an infinite numbers of world's, of which 3) an infinite number have life, and again, logically, 4) an infinite number are precisely and totally identical to this planet. 

These are just some of my musings on the bigger picture but which I find baffling.

(And before anyone says it, yes, maybe I DO have too much time on my hands at present)

[FLYING BLUE]

The very same things puzzle me as well.

I doubt there will be any answers anytime soon....

[CoolTiger]

Easy, the answer is

42

 

[FLYING BLUE]

Easy, the answer is

42

 

Indeed, according to a certain guidebook

[hendrix]

Regarding (A) as I understand it, time itself started with the big bang, so there was no "before" - just a singularity.

[timsussex]

we are 3 dimensional beings in a 4 (or more) dimensional universe try this thought process

You are 2 dimensional - you believe the world is flat so cannot comprehend that if you travel westwards you will arrive back at the same spot without finding an edge

So if you start at the top of the world with a very big  pot of imaginary paint and start to paint an ever increasing circle after a while you can no longer detect any curvature in the edge of your circle and indeed when you have covered half the earth and reached the equator it is a perfectly straight line and as you continue towards the south pole the edge becomes visibly curved but you are now on the inside eventually standing at the south pole with all of the earth painted without ever seeing an edge

That was covering a 3 dimensional object with 2 dimensional paint so lets try filing the 4 dimensional universe with 3 dimensional plasticine

You start with a small ball which gets larger and larger until you can stand on it (God knows where all this plasticine is coming from ) eventually the ball is so big that like the earth it appears flat and eventually it is flat and if you continue adding material you wll find yourself on the inside  of an ever decreasing sphere until you have filled the universe without ever coming to an edge

[JontyR]

what was there a half second before the Big Bang?

"eez extra baby"

[yandex]

Ah, science meets philosophy meets the sentient being!

Physics says that the universe started as a singularity and that it's meaningless to speculate what went 'before' the big bang. Ditto what is 'outside' the universe. Infinity is usually regarded as an error in the calculation/theory whenever it appears so, again, is meaningless in most contexts. Pretty difficult to accept for a lot of people, a cop out for some and a convenient way of ignoring something incomprehensible to others.

Fascinating subject, there are some excellent popular science books about cosmology but you can't beat Bill Bryson, A Short History of Nearly Everything, for the last word on the matter 

[hendrix]

Ah, science meets philosophy meets the sentient being!

Physics says that the universe started as a singularity and that it's meaningless to speculate what went 'before' the big bang. Ditto what is 'outside' the universe. Infinity is usually regarded as an error in the calculation/theory whenever it appears so, again, is meaningless in most contexts. Pretty difficult to accept for a lot of people, a cop out for some and a convenient way of ignoring something incomprehensible to others.

Fascinating subject, there are some excellent popular science books about cosmology but you can't beat Bill Bryson, A Short History of Nearly Everything, for the last word on the matter 

That is a great book!

[Ali Katt]

A) The 'Big Bang' theory.  If you accept that the universe started in one moment, with the so-called Big Bang what was there a half second before the Big Bang?

Young Sheldon.

[fisherofsouls]

I find the Science Asylum channel on YouTube absolutely excellent for this sort of topic.

External Link/Members Only as an example.

Host Nick Lucid is very geeky but also very engaging. I think he teaches community college so he is tuned in to a less academic but still keenly interested audience.

After watching one of his vids I feel none the wiser but nonetheless better informed

[fisherofsouls]

Fuck all that shit, where's the pussy?

Accelerating away from your frame of reference.

Bad luck, pal...

[mr.bluesky]

And Captain Kirk never did say "beam me up Scottie" in any episode of Star Trek.

[fudi_maar]

Fantastic idea for a thread. I've often wondered the same myself. And in fact, over the years, I have to consciously stop thinking about it cos at times I feel that I can drive myself literally insane by getting my mind all warped and twisted by these sorts of thoughts. Happens every time I am at the beach, and wonder "Where did all this sand come from?" "Where did all the atoms to create the sea in front of me come from?" "All this matter.....the sand, water, trees, rocks, mountains, earth.....from where?"

And then I just have to go and surf some internet porn to calm myself down.

[winkywanky]

I have been following the Mars Perseverance lander, and the mini helicopter due to go live shortly, with interest, as this is something I've always been interested in.

It did, however get me musing over the universe in general, and there are some areas I'm very curious about but cannot get my head around:

A) The 'Big Bang' theory.  If you accept that the universe started in one moment, with the so-called Big Bang what was there a half second before the Big Bang?

B) The 'Expanding Universe' theory. This holds that, since the Big Bang, the Universe is steadily expanding from wherever the Big Bang took place. If so, what is it expanding into? What lies 100 yards beyond the outer edge?

C) infinity. If the universe is infinite ( but this conflicts with the expansion theory) then, logically, there are 1) an infinite number of stars, surrounded by 2) an infinite numbers of world's, of which 3) an infinite number have life, and again, logically, 4) an infinite number are precisely and totally identical to this planet. 

These are just some of my musings on the bigger picture but which I find baffling.

(And before anyone says it, yes, maybe I DO have too much time on my hands at present)

A) Nothing. Get your head around that. Or perhaps...GOD 

B) Nothingness. Get your head around that.

C) Not really, you forgot the concept of time. It doesn't always go in the same direction. Perhaps the Big Bang was actually last Thursday? Maybe you don't even exist, I know I don't  Get your head around that.

The trouble with humans is they project their own little, insignificant lives and experiences onto the Universe. I mean, we do that with each other and that is futile, to do so with the whole fucking Universe is nothing short of arrogant in the extreme 

[winkywanky]

OP, may I suggest you watch the Bluray of Christopher Nolan's Interstellar, preferably on a large screen and with a good sound system.

Even if the film doesn't move you, the Hans Zimmer soundtrack will turn you into a blubbering wreck  .

[winkywanky]

Accelerating away from your frame of reference.

Bad luck, pal...

Well of course it's all relative 

[Thephoenix]

A) Nothing. Get your head around that. Or perhaps...GOD 

B) Nothingness. Get your head around that.

C) Not really, you forgot the concept of time. It doesn't always go in the same direction. Perhaps the Big Bang was actually last Thursday? Maybe you don't even exist, I know I don't  Get your head around that.

The trouble with humans is they project their own little, insignificant lives and experiences onto the Universe. I mean, we do that with each other and that is futile, to do so with the whole fucking Universe is nothing short of arrogant in the extreme 

Yes but what was there before nothing because there was no such word 🙄?....and what is nothing anyway?
What was there before God?

In my view it's never worth getting into an argument about creationist Adam and Eve versus evolution.
........ You're just comparing apples and origins..... drumroll 

[scutty brown]

Fuck all that shit, where's the pussy?

Ask Shroedinger, he knows all about that

[FLYING BLUE]

Regarding (A) as I understand it, time itself started with the big bang, so there was no "before" - just a singularity.

But, surely there had to be 'something' there...... something that created the very conditions that allowed an explosion, or big bang to take place?

[Straightsix]

Ask Shroedinger, he knows all about that

I did. It said 'all that bolloxs was way before my time'

[Straightsix]

But, surely there had to be 'something' there...... something that created the very conditions that allowed an explosion, or big bang to take place?

Been a while since I followed the subject but 'dark matter' plays a part somewhere although little is known.

[winkywanky]

Yes but what was there before nothing because there was no such word 🙄?....and what is nothing anyway?
What was there before God?

In my view it's never worth getting into an argument about creationist Adam and Eve versus evolution.
........ You're just comparing apples and origins..... drumroll 

B'dum Tsch! 

[Thephoenix]

I knew there was a logical answer......

External Link/Members Only

[hendrix]

The thing about "nothing" is that it seems increasing likely to be full of stuff.."quantum soup"...So not really"nothing' by our usual definition's.

In other words, there was always "something"/the god argument

[winkywanky]

The thing about "nothing" is that it seems increasing likely to be full of stuff.."quantum soup"...So not really"nothing' by our usual definition's.

In other words, there was always "something"/the god argument

The old saying the more we find out, the less we know is true. But it's fun trying, it's human to be trying.

I think the deeper we get into things like this, the more it becomes apparent that we simply cannot apply normal logic or even Physics, certainly as we 'know' it.

[Thephoenix]

Hidden Image/Members Only

[hendrix]

The old saying the more we find out, the less we know is true. But it's fun trying, it's human to be trying.

I think the deeper we get into things like this, the more it becomes apparent that we simply cannot apply normal logic or even Physics, certainly as we 'know' it.

Yep, physics as we know it literally started with the big bang so anything else will require... something else.

[Jomoore]

Regarding (A) as I understand it, time itself started with the big bang, so there was no "before" - just a singularity.

That's what I understood too, just as the answer to "what is it expanding into" is also nothing, the expansion creates the space.  I'm also gobsmacked by the revelation that, whereas nothing can travel faster than light, the rate of expansion is now faster than light!    How does that work?  I'm starting to see why scientists are losing faith in the Standard Model, and accept that there's a massive amount they don't understand.  And may never understand.

[winkywanky]

Hidden Image/Members Only

   

I'm sure that Einstein once said: the Universe is just one big hot tub. It was just one of his little sayings that never caught on 

[pewpewpew]

I would like to sound like a pretentious twat by pointing out that the  big bang wasn't a bang as there was no medium for sound to travel in. It is more accurately called the primordial expansion 

[PatMacGroin]

Easy, the answer is

42

 

Huge fan of the man and the books.   

However, I hate to say that he may have got that answer a bit wrong. Maybe for simplicity he decided to round it up to the nearest integer. 

[winkywanky]

Huge fan of the man and the books.   

However, I hate to say that he may have got that answer a bit wrong. Maybe for simplicity he decided to round it up to the nearest integer. 

Nah, apparently it was the size of his then gf's tits (in inches mind, the fucker couldn't even be bothered to convert into Systeme Internationale units  ).

[PatMacGroin]

we are 3 dimensional beings in a 4 (or more) dimensional universe try this thought process

You are 2 dimensional - you believe the world is flat so cannot comprehend that if you travel westwards you will arrive back at the same spot without finding an edge

So if you start at the top of the world with a very big  pot of imaginary paint and start to paint an ever increasing circle after a while you can no longer detect any curvature in the edge of your circle and indeed when you have covered half the earth and reached the equator it is a perfectly straight line and as you continue towards the south pole the edge becomes visibly curved but you are now on the inside eventually standing at the south pole with all of the earth painted without ever seeing an edge

That was covering a 3 dimensional object with 2 dimensional paint so lets try filing the 4 dimensional universe with 3 dimensional plasticine

You start with a small ball which gets larger and larger until you can stand on it (God knows where all this plasticine is coming from ) eventually the ball is so big that like the earth it appears flat and eventually it is flat and if you continue adding material you wll find yourself on the inside  of an ever decreasing sphere until you have filled the universe without ever coming to an edge

Great answer, never heard it explained like that before.

There is one thought which twists the plasticine ball explanation into another difficult loop. Which is directed at the highlighted, where did all the plasticine come from comment. The initial "tiny" plasticine ball is actually "hollow". Then the conservation of mass versus energy in the race towards entropy comes into play.

Which makes the universe seem more like a rubber balloon. We observe it from some point within the thin skein of rubber said balloon is made from. Is this "universe balloon" expanding as...

a) That original big bang "breath" of energy enters it? (If so will it all come rushing out again in a big shrinkage?)
b) Or is what we experience, including the passage of time, a side effect of all that energy being used up in some way? Dependant on where you observe the universe from, in relation to it's "big bang" origin point, it's quite likely that all the rules and constants many scientists take for granted could operate very differently (the key one being the passage of time).

[mr.bluesky]

I would like to sound like a pretentious twat by pointing out that the  big bang wasn't a bang as there was no medium for sound to travel in. It is more accurately called the primordial expansion 

The tag line for the film Alien was " in space no one can hear you scream" which is true as space is almost a perfect vacuum there would be no air to carry the sound waves. All sci fi films which show loud explosions in space just wouldn't happen but I guess a silent explosion doesn't have the same impact.

[Xtro]

I called my girlfriend ‘Miss Universe’ last night.
“Is it because I’m so beautiful?” she asked.
“No, it’s ’cause you’re constantly expanding you fat bitch!”    

[sir wanksalot]

A) Nothing. Get your head around that. Or perhaps...GOD 

B) Nothingness. Get your head around that.

C) Not really, you forgot the concept of time. It doesn't always go in the same direction. Perhaps the Big Bang was actually last Thursday? Maybe you don't even exist, I know I don't  Get your head around that.

The trouble with humans is they project their own little, insignificant lives and experiences onto the Universe. I mean, we do that with each other and that is futile, to do so with the whole fucking Universe is nothing short of arrogant in the extreme 

Ah but for nothing to "exist" doesn't there need to be some things around it to define the nothingness?

Completely agree with you about the futility of attaching importance to our lives compared to the grand scale of the Universe but I guess that is how we get a grip on our existence.

My mind explodes when I see videos like this on YouTube

External Link/Members Only

[winkywanky]

The tag line for the film Alien was " in space no one can hear you scream" which is true as space is almost a perfect vacuum there would be no air to carry the sound waves. All sci fi films which show loud explosions in space just wouldn't happen but I guess a silent explosion doesn't have the same impact.

I would challenge that assertion, my mate's ageing labrador would let off silent explosions which would instantly clear the room 

[winkywanky]

I called my girlfriend ‘Miss Universe’ last night.
“Is it because I’m so beautiful?” she asked.
“No, it’s ’cause you’re constantly expanding you fat bitch!”   

Did you ever do her up her Black Hole?

[Thephoenix]

What a fantastic source of information is UKP.

Where else on the internet can you learn such things as the beginning of the universe and how to shave your hairy bum hole, all on one website?

[mr.bluesky]

I would challenge that assertion, my mate's ageing labrador would let off silent explosions which would instantly clear the room 

  hence the expression " silent but deadly"

[Xtro]

Did you ever do her up her Black Hole?

Is that what it's called?.....  I would only ask her, "Darling, can I do you up Ur anus?"   

[winkywanky]

Is that what it's called?.....  I would only ask her, "Darling, can I do you up Ur anus?"   

   I'll set 'em up, you knock 'em in 

[wombat]

42 replies!!   Oh shit....

[Xtro]

42 replies!!   Oh shit....

You had to go and ruin it!       

[SamOmar]

I've been into planetary science and the study of the universe since I was young, although just as a hobby, I lack any formal scientific qualifications. I personally subscribe to a multiverse theory as there is a continuous rate of universe's being born and dyeing. I think they can merge and the observable universe is only a tiny fraction of ours. This size, scale and timeframe is mind boggling but what fascinates me further is life outside the earth as I believe it is quite common across various star systems.
 

[Malvolio]

So are there an infinite number of UKPuntings in these multiverses?

[SamOmar]

So are there an infinite number of UKPuntings in these multiverses?

Multiverse as in many different unique universes, not like parallel ones. I think this site is one of a kind

[mr.bluesky]

So are there an infinite number of UKPuntings in these multiverses?

Perhaps in one of these multiverses Romanian's always provide a good service and the ladys on viva street post true photo's of themselves.  Naah on second thoughts this is probably a multi universe phenomenon. 

[Hotpocket]

The thing that could pickle your mind about "expanding universe" is not that the universe is expanding but why is it expanding away from the earth ? Meaning the earth must be the central point of the universe ? 
If you want a real mindbender youtube about can black holes swallow other black holes, this really fries my brain because basically they end up saying time travel is possible by travelling around one of the black holes