So now the Coronavirus is racist!

[David1970]

So anyone concerned with the obsession with finding ‘racism’ everywhere is a troll?

You were the one who brought up racism by starting this thread, or can’t you remember that?

[scutty brown]

So anyone concerned with the obsession with finding ‘racism’ everywhere is a troll?

But you are the one who raised the spectre of racism, no-one else did.
Its a simple fact that due to economic, environmental, genetic and other dispositions certain population groups are more likely to succomb. That doesn't make the disease racist, or those pointing out the difference racist. However those who attempt to deny those economic, environmental, or genetic factors may indeed be showing racist bias. Or  are just trolling for reaction

[Scotpunter]

In the USA there are higher infection rate among BAME people than the general population so nothing to do with Midlands of England & London.

External Link/Members Only

The link you give there gives me the impression that the virus is more prevalent in Black dominated areas. Unless the death rate to infection rate is being compared to a White dominated area of similar amount, the figures you will get will be innacurate.

You then have to look at household sizes and population per square metre. The higher densely populated, the higher risk of infection.

[Scotpunter]

But you are the one who raised the spectre of racism, no-one else did.
Its a simple fact that due to economic, environmental, genetic and other dispositions certain population groups are more likely to succomb. That doesn't make the disease racist, or those pointing out the difference racist. However those who attempt to deny those economic, environmental, or genetic factors may indeed be showing racist bias. Or  are just trolling for reaction

I was under the assumption the powers that be are looking at whether it is a genetic thing that makes non whites more susceptible.

[David1970]

The link you give there gives me the impression that the virus is more prevalent in Black dominated areas. Unless the death rate to infection rate is being compared to a White dominated area of similar amount, the figures you will get will be innacurate.

You then have to look at household sizes and population per square metre. The higher densely populated, the higher risk of infection.

My impression was that BAME people were getting the virus in a higher proportion to their numbers.

“Black people make up 22 percent of the population of New York City, but represent 28 percent of the deaths from the virus. Hispanics make up 29 percent of the city, but represent 34 percent of the deaths.” From the NYT article

So BAME people make up 51% of the population but are 62% of the people who die from the virus.
What would be interesting is  the figures showing who caught but survived the virus.

[scutty brown]

I was under the assumption the powers that be are looking at whether it is a genetic thing that makes non whites more susceptible.

They are, but you also have to look at factors such as housing, education, wealth which affect most diseases. In most western countries ethnic minorities experience rank lower on those scales and as a result have lower life expectancy

[freeze44]

My impression was that BAME people were getting the virus in a higher proportion to their numbers.

“Black people make up 22 percent of the population of New York City, but represent 28 percent of the deaths from the virus. Hispanics make up 29 percent of the city, but represent 34 percent of the deaths.” From the NYT article

So BAME people make up 51% of the population but are 62% of the people who die from the virus.
What would be interesting is  the figures showing who caught but survived the virus.

You mean by ethnic group? Suppose would need a range of figures to work out why BAME people suffering worse? Same with why men suffer more than women.

Mind you, the fact men die before women generally just sees to be accepted and don't see much action on that!

[joe diddley]

My impression was that BAME people were getting the virus in a higher proportion to their numbers.

“Black people make up 22 percent of the population of New York City, but represent 28 percent of the deaths from the virus. Hispanics make up 29 percent of the city, but represent 34 percent of the deaths.” From the NYT article

So BAME people make up 51% of the population but are 62% of the people who die from the virus.
What would be interesting is  the figures showing who caught but survived the virus.

Poor people in the US (and elsewhere) are more likely to have pre-existing health conditions, are more likely to not have health insurance and are therefore more likely to be adversely affected by Covid-19 and therefore die. People in these minorities are more likely to be poor. The virus isn't racist; it's our history that produced these inequalities that is.

[David1970]

Poor people in the US (and elsewhere) are more likely to have pre-existing health conditions, are more likely to not have health insurance and are therefore more likely to be adversely affected by Covid-19 and therefore die. People in these minorities are more likely to be poor. The virus isn't racist; it's our history that produced these inequalities that is.

I didn’t claim the virus is racist. The post you quoted from was in reply to another post about the virus in the midland of England and London. It was about why the death rate was higher among BAME people.
If you want to talk about racism I suggest you message the OP, he is into racism.

[NIK]

I didn’t claim the virus is racist. The post you quoted from was in reply to another post about the virus in the midland of England and London. It was about why the death rate was higher among BAME people.
If you want to talk about racism I suggest you message the OP, he is into racism.

No. I'm not into racism. It's the liberal left who are obsessed with it.

[NIK]

But you are the one who raised the spectre of racism, no-one else did.
Its a simple fact that due to economic, environmental, genetic and other dispositions certain population groups are more likely to succomb. That doesn't make the disease racist, or those pointing out the difference racist. However those who attempt to deny those economic, environmental, or genetic factors may indeed be showing racist bias. Or  are just trolling for reaction

Tell you what. Why don't we take all the money from the evil white capitalists and give it to the BAME community (another nice new pc term!). Mind you, presumably the BAME doctors won't need it.

[scutty brown]

No. I'm not into racism. It's the liberal left who are obsessed with it.

So why do you mention it every chance you get????
You're obsessed

[scutty brown]

Tell you what. Why don't we take all the money from the evil white capitalists and give it to the BAME community (another nice new pc term!). Mind you, presumably the BAME doctors won't need it.

If you were suggesting a more equitable distribution of wealth  across all members of society then I'd agree, but that's not your point is it? You're trying to use rhetoric to make decent living standards for all appear as an undesirable aim

[Rehon]

.

It seems that some people only see BAME people in a negative light, I am sure there is a name for these people.

Sadly, so true. I wish the OP had instead just focused on the fact that so many poor souls had lost their lives. Is it burdensome carrying so much hatred around?

[David1970]

No. I'm not into racism. It's the liberal left who are obsessed with it.

You are obsessed by race and being a racists, you were the OP of this thread about racists, or have you forgotten?
Most people want to get on with there fellow citizens what ever their origins, but some like you want to make an issue out of it. The world has moved on since your youth in the 1950s, where signs saying no blacks was socially acceptable.

[Belgarion]

‘Oh dear how sad for you. Never mind’ as the great Sergeant Major Shuttup said in that terribly ‘racist’ programme ‘It Ain’t Half Hot Mum’.
Never mind, the BBC, in a perfect example of modern liberal ideology, have banished it.

You've got problems, wanted to suggest you go outside and enjoy the sunshine but there's a lockdown.

It is sad to see how you have regressed. Just goes to show that people who are capable of good things can also be saddos

[Belgarion]

So anyone concerned with the obsession with finding ‘racism’ everywhere is a troll?

You are the one that is obsessed with racism.

[NIK]

Sadly, so true. I wish the OP had instead just focused on the fact that so many poor souls had lost their lives. Is it burdensome carrying so much hatred around?

You mean like ‘socialist’ I Steve Hedley?

[NIK]

You are obsessed by race and being a racists, you were the OP of this thread about racists, or have you forgotten?
Most people want to get on with there fellow citizens what ever their origins, but some like you want to make an issue out of it. The world has moved on since your youth in the 1950s, where signs saying no blacks was socially acceptable.

You know nowt.
My youth was in the 1920s. I am 95. 

[Beamer]

You know nowt.
My youth was in the 1920s. I am 95. 

In that case you should know better 

[David1970]

You know nowt.
My youth was in the 1920s. I am 95. 

That explains the dementia.
But it does not explain the fact why you are a racist

[Rochelle]

In that case you should know better 

I would have said the opposite, that's why he doesn't know better.

That explains the dementia.
But it does not explain the fact why you are a racist

It does, he's too old to change his ways and is stuck in the past.

[Beamer]

I would have said the opposite, that's why he doesn't know better.
It does, he's too old to change his ways and is stuck in the past.

I would have hoped his age allowed him to see the problems over last 50 or so years and I don't subscribe to the view "he's too old to change" but perhaps I am seeing this through rose tinted glasses?

Just look at the way the vast majority of the nation have addressed the current situation.  .....and you cannot get a more ethnically diverse group than the NHS.

[David1970]

I would have hoped his age allowed him to see the problems over last 50 or so years and I don't subscribe to the view "he's too old to change" but perhaps I am seeing this through rose tinted glasses?

There are people his age who are not racists, it not his age but his beliefs that make him a racists.

[Rehon]

You mean like ‘socialist’ I Steve Hedley?

Gosh, reverting to whataboutery is a desperate sign. The Steve Headley situation has nothing to do with this conversation. This is about your hatred. Focus on the topic in hand and stop deflecting.

[Rehon]

I'm never quite sure what to do with racist trolls (yes, I'm calling it as I see it). Do you just ban and block them, or do you engage and hope they eventually see the folly of their bigotry?

I've found that what people mean when they complain about "PC" is that they have a desire to be unkind and offensive to others, but are frustrated that they might be stopped.. I can almost write the OP's response myself. Let's look out for it.

[Beamer]

I'm never quite sure what to do with racist trolls (yes, I'm calling it as I see it). Do you just ban and block them, or do you engage and hope they eventually see the folly of their bigotry?

I've found that what people mean when they complain about "PC" is that they have a desire to be unkind and offensive to others, but are frustrated that they might be stopped.. I can almost write the OP's response myself. Let's look out for it.

Agreed

[cotton]

That explains the dementia.
But it does not explain the fact why you are a racist

Reading the OPs opening post it seems to me that he is saying people are wrong to attribute the disproportionately high death rate of BAME  people to "'racist' attitudes towards care and prevention". But it rather reflects issues other than racism at work such as social deprivation and diet etc.
Id agree that NIK might come across as being "obsessed" with racism and going on about it too much but that dosnt necessarily equate to or warrant being called racist himself.
What justification do you have for repeatedly calling him a racist , that is a serious accusation.

[Jerk Chicken]

Reading the OPs opening post it seems to me that he is saying people are wrong to attribute the disproportionately high death rate of BAME  people to "'racist' attitudes towards care and prevention". But it rather reflects issues other than racism at work such as social deprivation and diet etc.
Id agree that NIK might come across as being "obsessed" with racism and going on about it too much but that dosnt necessarily equate to or warrant being called racist himself.
What justification do you have for repeatedly calling him a racist , that is a serious accusation.

Are you NIK's Spin Doctor or Reputational Damage Consultant ? 

[NIK]

I'm never quite sure what to do with racist trolls (yes, I'm calling it as I see it). Do you just ban and block them, or do you engage and hope they eventually see the folly of their bigotry?

I've found that what people mean when they complain about "PC" is that they have a desire to be unkind and offensive to others, but are frustrated that they might be stopped.. I can almost write the OP's response myself. Let's look out for it.

So calling me a ‘racist troll’ is not being ‘unkind’ then? 
Liberal hypocrisy at its finest! 

[Jerk Chicken]

So calling me a ‘racist troll’ is not being ‘unkind’ then? 
Liberal hypocrisy at its finest! 

When I saw you punctuate your post with the PC mantra and go on about "ethnic minority" -v- "minority ethnic" you conjured up an image in my mind. You followed this up my suggesting the media briefs were crying racism when they have neither implied or stated that. They simply pointed out the facts and it is a cause for concern.

It is sad that some individuals cry the "here we go again now" phrase and not realise the message they are peddling. Yes freedom of speech is your right but in multi cultural Britain it cannot be a surprise to you political views that shif too far to the right will receive short thrift be it on a punting forum or most other platforms for that matter.

[cotton]

Are you NIK's Spin Doctor or Reputational Damage Consultant ?

Not at all , just seems ridiculous and unwarranted that this topic has devolved into accusations of racism when as far as i can see nobodys said anything racist.
Obviously its an emotive topic but nevertheless just yelling racist to win an argument on the internet seems wrong to me , we all have a responsibility to use language responsibly , we are all punters and we should try and share the forum in a considerate responsible fashion , and that includes curbing ones desire to just throw insults cos you dont agree with someone.

[Jerk Chicken]

Not at all , just seems ridiculous and unwarranted that this topic has devolved into accusations of racism when as far as i can see nobodys said anything racist.
Obviously its an emotive topic but nevertheless just yelling racist to win an argument on the internet seems wrong to me , we all have a responsibility to use language responsibly , we are all punters and we should try and share the forum in a considerate responsible fashion , and that includes curbing ones desire to just throw insults cos you dont agree with someone.

I agree with everything you have just posted.

However many posters can read the salient points of @NIK posts and more so his defiant responses that just add fuel to the simmering fire.

Covert rasism is what many punters are implying here and frankly so far @NIK has done very little if anything to dispel that train of thought from the majority of the Punting community that have contributed to this thread.

[cotton]

I agree with everything you have just posted.

However many posters can read the salient points of @NIK posts and more so his defiant responses that just add fuel to the simmering fire.

Covert rasism is what many punters are implying here and frankly so far @NIK has done very little if anything to dispel that train of thought from the majority of the Punting community that have contributed to this thread.

Ok glad were not falling out 

[NIK]

It is the default position of the liberal left to cry racism at every turn. It is a term they cannot do without. While ever they do this, rather than try to debate or to find out why people who don’t subscribe to their world view think the way they do, the left will never gain political power again.
You only have to view the Tommy Robinson videos to see this. Women screaming shame on you and racist at him then running away saying I am not talking to you you’re a racist when he tries to debate with them.
Of course I know the name Tommy Robinson itself is anathema to the majority on here who like those women have had their views about him formulated for them without even listening to him and making up their own minds.
By the way I accept Robinson, like Trump, can frequently be a boorish individual.

[freeze44]

It is the default position of the liberal left to cry racism at every turn. It is a term they cannot do without. While ever they do this, rather than try to debate or to find out why people who don’t subscribe to their world view think the way they do, the left will never gain political power again.
You only have to view the Tommy Robinson videos to see this. Women screaming shame on you and racist at him then running away saying I am not talking to you you’re a racist when he tries to debate with them.
Of course I know the name Tommy Robinson itself is anathema to the majority on here who like those women have had their views about him formulated for them without even listening to him and making up their own minds.
By the way I accept Robinson, like Trump, can frequently be a boorish individual.

Nik- my colours to the mast so to speak- A liberal leftie.   

What I don't recognise is your description of me in your post.

I would agree the 'loud voices' often get heard the most but would suggest the majority are not so keen to carry on the agenda you describe but just normal folk who want to see some more life chances for those without often getting the chance.

Call me a wet lettuce and that fine but not an extremist.

[GreyDave]

They are, but you also have to look at factors such as housing, education, wealth which affect most diseases. In most western countries ethnic minorities experience rank lower on those scales and as a result have lower life expectancy

If so then why has this affected Drs and Nurses and the Judge and a few other very well paid memembers of the BAEM community?

Its worring for them and for all others in the at risk group ...yes about the only group that can change their chances is the overweight group ( when I was a school 40 years ago with about 900 kids I can still recall the 3 fat lads all from good homes driven to school in A40 and minors ) .....It affects us all diffrently as we are all diffrent 

I can see why the off topic was removed 

[RedKettle]

It is the default position of the liberal left to cry racism at every turn. It is a term they cannot do without. While ever they do this, rather than try to debate or to find out why people who don’t subscribe to their world view think the way they do, the left will never gain political power again.
You only have to view the Tommy Robinson videos to see this. Women screaming shame on you and racist at him then running away saying I am not talking to you you’re a racist when he tries to debate with them.
Of course I know the name Tommy Robinson itself is anathema to the majority on here who like those women have had their views about him formulated for them without even listening to him and making up their own minds.
By the way I accept Robinson, like Trump, can frequently be a boorish individual.

It is ironic that you do not see how what you say applies to you.  As soon as any mention of something impacting for example BAME community you simply shout liberal left PC bollocks rather than actually understanding the issue. This tends to lead most of us to assume a racist outlook or agenda.

By the way I have formed my own opinion of Tommy, he is a self serving piece of shit.

[Hobbit]

In that case you should know better 

I guess some people grow old and don't mature or become wiser with experience. Hate and dislike is a very isolating and lonely place to be. I think the OP has misunderstood what social distancing meant.

[Rehon]

So calling me a ‘racist troll’ is not being ‘unkind’ then? 
Liberal hypocrisy at its finest! 

No, it isn't. The scenario has been created by you, and what you're seeing is the reaction.
By the way, I see my self in the Liberal left of centre. Liberal just means I don't seek to dictate or offend where possible, and that I believe in the state supporting those who are in greatest need. I know you're trying to use the term as an insult, but we don't live in Trump's world. As Britons we have a great tradition of left liberalism. Heard of the NHS?
Citing Yaxley-Lennon is not helping your cause, unless you're trying to wear your racism badge with pride. Time to come clean?

[Rehon]

Not at all , just seems ridiculous and unwarranted that this topic has devolved into accusations of racism when as far as i can see nobodys said anything racist.
Obviously its an emotive topic but nevertheless just yelling racist to win an argument on the internet seems wrong to me , we all have a responsibility to use language responsibly , we are all punters and we should try and share the forum in a considerate responsible fashion , and that includes curbing ones desire to just throw insults cos you dont agree with someone.

It didn't devolve. The OP's post was itself racist, so perhaps criticise the disease and not the medicine. What you're seeing is a set of reactions to an incendiary post.
Anti-anti-racism is itself racism. And by the way in the fight against racism there are no neutrals, mediators or bystanders. You're on one side or the other.

[Jerk Chicken]

It is the default position of the liberal left to cry racism at every turn. It is a term they cannot do without. While ever they do this, rather than try to debate or to find out why people who don’t subscribe to their world view think the way they do, the left will never gain political power again.
You only have to view the Tommy Robinson videos to see this. Women screaming shame on you and racist at him then running away saying I am not talking to you you’re a racist when he tries to debate with them.
Of course I know the name Tommy Robinson itself is anathema to the majority on here who like those women have had their views about him formulated for them without even listening to him and making up their own minds.
By the way I accept Robinson, like Trump, can frequently be a boorish individual.

I recall more than a few of your ilk said that before Tony Blair popped up. We all know what happened next

[David1970]

In the original post Nick manages to get the word racists in to the title and twice into the body of his hate filled rant and also the word racism. He has throughout this thread been against anyone who objects to racism. To add fuel to the fire he brings up Yaxley-Lennon, to support his case.

[NIK]

Ironic. All these liberal 'hope not haters' spouting their hate filled bile at me. And upsetting and offending me by labelling me a 'racist'. The worst insult of all.     Maybe I need to report a hate crime?

[Jerk Chicken]

Ironic. All these liberal 'hope not haters' spouting their hate filled bile at me. And upsetting and offending me by labelling me a 'racist'. The worst insult of all.     Maybe I need to report a hate crime?

What's the saying ... if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen. Close the door behind you bro

[David1970]

Ironic. All these liberal 'hope not haters' spouting their hate filled bile at me. And upsetting and offending me by labelling me a 'racist'. The worst insult of all.     Maybe I need to report a hate crime?

No one is spouting hate against you Nik, just pointing out you are a racists and racism is wrong, a thing you cannot accept.
To make light of hate crime, as you have done in your last post shows why members find your vile beliefs unacceptable.

[Chorley]

I see the reintroduction of "Off Topic's" going well?
 

[Rehon]

Ironic. All these liberal 'hope not haters' spouting their hate filled bile at me. And upsetting and offending me by labelling me a 'racist'. The worst insult of all.     Maybe I need to report a hate crime?

Wow, you're playing all the hits. Do you have a checklist? "Liberal" doesn't work as an insult, as we live in Britain not Trump land, so thank you. Proud to be liberal.
So suddenly YOU'RE the victim? You should be on the stage, son!

[hillingdonpete]

Liberals are traitors.

They hate themselves, their country, their history and their own race.

They despise everything that is good about their heritage.

Liberals and foreigners have and need a symbiotic relationship.

Liberals to show their hate of their kind and foreigners to reinforce the liberal and in their need to help gain some acceptance from the indigenous people (usually liberals)
The foreigner will never cease in its attempts to undermine the indigenous people.

The foreigner constantly forgets that they are a guest.

The children of foreigners, usually born in their host country have identity issues.

[Jerk Chicken]

I see the reintroduction of "Off Topic's" going well?
 

Perhaps time to close it me thinks ... some weird fuckers are popping out of the sewer!