Could Liverpool of 1980's beat Barcelona of 2010 onwards?

[king tarzan]

very very difficult this one, as both teams passing and possession was impeccable..
Liverpool back 4 were awesome... so was Barcelona.. difficult one this one.

[Blackpool Rock]

I'm surprised at your choice of teams as on the other "how to end the prem season" thread you confessed to being a Man Utd fan.

By definition you are basically saying that Liverpool of the 80's was better than Man Utd of the 90's and 00's 

[Davey Dykes]

Is there any particular season you are thinking of or do we cherry picker from said teams over the course of the decade?

[ratedj]

Will always be near impossibe to compare teams/players from different eras, but for me it's Barca 2010. Best team I've seen in my lifetime. That team also produced the greatest football performance I've witnessed.

[Malvolio]

If the game was played under 1980s refereeing, where defenders got away with a hell of a lot more than they do now, I'd back Liverpool.

If the game was played now, Graeme Souness would be sent off after 20 minutes and Barca would win easily.

[hillingdonpete]

We can put this thread to bed by saying neither teams could lace to the boot's of the Milan team of the 90's.

[ulstersubbie]

If the game was played under 1980s refereeing, where defenders got away with a hell of a lot more than they do now, I'd back Liverpool.

If the game was played now, Graeme Souness would be sent off after 20 minutes and Barca would win easily.

If played in the 80's Liverpool would have triumphed. Bob Paisley understood that playing in Europe meant playing a different way, under him Liverpool won four European Cups. People forget just how good the great Liverpool teams were back in the day, in that era you had to win your national championship to enter the European Cup.

[ulstersubbie]

We can put this thread to bed by saying neither teams could lace to the boot's of the Milan team of the 90's.

Those AC Milan teams were wonderful to watch, Van Basten, Gullit, etc, still think Liverpool would have given them a game.

[king tarzan]

I'm surprised at your choice of teams as on the other "how to end the prem season" thread you confessed to being a Man Utd fan.

By definition you are basically saying that Liverpool of the 80's was better than Man Utd of the 90's and 00's 

To be honest probably yes... Alan Hansen, Phil Neale, Graeme Souness, Kenny Dalglish.. the possession of the ball.... the team spirit and unity.. i enjoyed watching them as a kid, and yes they always beat Man Utd apart from the F.A. cup competitions of course..

[ratedj]

We can put this thread to bed by saying neither teams could lace to the boot's of the Milan team of the 90's.

I actually thought that Milan/Barca would be a better comparison. It's a shame to see how far removed the current Milan side is from that iteration. Before Real Madrid did the threepeat (lovely American term) Milan were the last side to go back to back in the
European Cup/Champions League.

[ratedj]

To be honest probably yes... Alan Hansen, Phil Neale, Graeme Souness, Kenny Dalglish.. the possession of the ball.... the team spirit and unity.. i enjoyed watching them as a kid, and yes they always beat Man Utd apart from the F.A. cup competitions of course..

In that case you'll need to pinpoint one team (I imagine that you'll refer to the 83/84 team) becasue as a fellow United fan I take issue with your summation lol.

[Jerk Chicken]

That's a tough one ... but got to back Liverpool on this one on the basis that the team of the 80s had a much better defence than Barca at their pomp.

Both teams could pass you to death, had outstanding individuals as well as a great team work ethic. However the Barca back 5 always gave you one or two chances per game it was jus a question if you could take them. The Liverpool team of that era you rarely got a sniff.

If it was say a hypothetical series of 3 games one at Anfield, one at Camp Nou and one at a nuetral venue I would say Liverpool to win at Anfield (2-0), win at the nuetral venue (2-1) but loose in Camp Nou (1-2)

[mr.bluesky]

We can put this thread to bed by saying neither teams could lace to the boot's of the Milan team of the 90's.

Or the Ajax teams of the Cruyff era's. Total football

[ratedj]

That's a tough one ... but got to back Liverpool on this one on the basis that the team of the 80s had a much better defence than Barca at their pomp.

Both teams could pass you to death, had outstanding individuals as well as a great team work ethic. However the Barca back 5 always gave you one or two chances per game it was jus a question if you could take them. The Liverpool team of that era you rarely got a sniff.

If it was say a hypothetical series of 3 games one at Anfield, one at Camp Nou and one at a nuetral venue I would say Liverpool to win at Anfield (2-0), win at the nuetral venue (2-1) but loose in Camp Nou (1-2)

In the interest of fairness I'll pinpoint the Barca 2010/11 side and suggest that it had a far superior side. At this point in time Tika Taka had reached its nadir and this team was manipulating the ball in a manner not seen before and I'd argue not seen since. Plus, that's not even accounting for Messi, which just made it unfair at times.  The closest team I've seen to football perfection. 

[hillingdonpete]

At this point in time Tika Taka had reached its nadir

Maybe you mean Zenith

[ratedj]

Maybe you mean Zenith

Indeed haha, wrong way round!

[hillingdonpete]

I was'nt sure    Not being a fan of that ticky tacky football club.

[Thephoenix]

Of course they would........ and just because I've been a Liverpool fan since they were in the second division,  doesn't necessarily mean I'm bias

[peter purves]

No! I think

The team of 1981 was taken to the cleaners by Flamenco Zico et al.

However, I have heard various explanation why Liverpool performed poorly then.

[ratedj]

I was'nt sure    Not being a fan of that ticky tacky football club.

Well, there was a period of time where Chelsea and Barcelona did make for good dance partners!

[Kool Keef]

To be honest probably yes... Alan Hansen, Phil Neale, Graeme Souness, Kenny Dalglish.. the possession of the ball.... the team spirit and unity.. i enjoyed watching them as a kid, and yes they always beat Man Utd apart from the F.A. cup competitions of course..

No true United fan 'enjoyed' watching Liverpool in the 80s, just like no true Liverpool fan enjoyed watching United dominating under Fergie.
The rivalry is too deep, strong & ingrained.
You can grudgingly admire a great rival but you can't 'enjoy' watching them if your club is truly in your blood imo.

That Barca team from 2009 to 2011 was the greatest team I've ever seen, they spanked my team in 2 CL finals unfortunately.

[Thephoenix]

When I was a youngster watching Liverpool in the 2nd division before Shankly arrived,  apart from Billy Liddle, they didn't have many players to admire as role models.
However watching the Busby Babes, with the likes of Duncan Edwards and Tommy Taylor gave me inspiration as a young player.
I was devastated when the tragic Munich air crash occurred.
Some years later I became a semi professional playing in Australia.
On returning to UK in the seventies I noticed the mood of rival supporters had changed, and friendly rivalry had turned into bitter and abusive confrontation.
I'm a Liverpool fan, but also a football fan, and I admire good football wherever it's played.
Obviously, I don't want our main rivals to do well, but that hasn't stopped me from begrudgingly admiring the football played by Fergie'sUnited.

[mr.bluesky]

Maybe you mean Zenith

What Zenith St Petersburg  I don't think they have ever been that great 

[cotton]

We can put this thread to bed by saying neither teams could lace to the boot's of the Milan team of the 90's.

Agreed , always remember the Milan team of 1994 with dejan savicevic that gave Barcelona a 4-0 hiding in the 1994 European Cup final.

[WARSZAWA16]

Agreed , always remember the Milan team of 1994 with dejan savicevic that gave Barcelona a 4-0 hiding in the 1994 European Cup final.

Also, in 1989 when they beat Real Madrid 5-0. What a performance that was. Some illustrious names among the goalscorers too:

External Link/Members Only

[ratedj]

Also, in 1989 when they beat Real Madrid 5-0. What a performance that was. Some illustrious names among the goalscorers too:

External Link/Members Only

Yeah, those 88/89 and 89/90 teams were something else. The 1994 team did not have as much flair, though its performacne in the final v Barcelona ranks alongside Real Madrid's 7-3 victory over Eintracht Frankfurt as the greatest performance in a European Cup/Champions League final.

[Happylad]

In view of the enormous changes in the rules of soccer in the last 30 odd years, styles of play, and physical fitness, it is impossible to be able to draw any meaningful comparison between the two teams. Once dominant centre halves found their defending abilities somewhat reduced by rule changes 3 or 4 years ago and became less dominant, some very clever players who in the 1980s would have been kicked off the pitch are now sufficiently protected to allow their cleverness to shine, whilst others whose effectiveness resulted more from brute force than brilliance had their powers restricted.

Any comparison is simply a no-brainer - you might just as well ask whether the army of Henry V at Agincourt would have defeated the Roman Legions of Julius Ceasar.

[NIK]

Totally agree comparisons between eras are impossible and pretty pointless. Still a fascinating exercise though which people will always continue to practice.
Certainly players are fitter in the modern era. But as they say a great player would be a great player in any era. He’d probably have to work harder though. Going back well before the 80’s to the Stanley Matthews era (before my time) it makes me smile when you see clips of him waltzing past defenders. I doubt he would find it so easy today. In fact the art of the dribbling winger beating players and getting to the byline is largely lost today. The winger seems to have been displaced by the dynamic wing back who is expected to attack and defend.

Perhaps a better example than football to show how competitors have improved is tennis. The power and speed of players maybe from Sampras onwards far surpasses that of players in the past.

[jeanphillipe]

Totally agree comparisons between eras are impossible and pretty pointless. Still a fascinating exercise though which people will always continue to practice.
Certainly players are fitter in the modern era. But as they say a great player would be a great player in any era. He’d probably have to work harder though. Going back well before the 80’s to the Stanley Matthews era (before my time) it makes me smile when you see clips of him waltzing past defenders. I doubt he would find it so easy today. In fact the art of the dribbling winger beating players and getting to the byline is largely lost today. The winger seems to have been displaced by the dynamic wing back who is expected to attack and defend.

Perhaps a better example than football to show how competitors have improved is tennis. The power and speed of players maybe from Sampras onwards far surpasses that of players in the past.

its not just the level of fitness that has vastly improved with best of the best tennis players, equipment has improved too.

[mr.bluesky]

Totally agree comparisons between eras are impossible and pretty pointless. Still a fascinating exercise though which people will always continue to practice.
Certainly players are fitter in the modern era. But as they say a great player would be a great player in any era. He’d probably have to work harder though. Going back well before the 80’s to the Stanley Matthews era (before my time) it makes me smile when you see clips of him waltzing past defenders. I doubt he would find it so easy today. In fact the art of the dribbling winger beating players and getting to the byline is largely lost today.

Probably the last players capable of beating defenders with ease would be George Best or Christiano Ronaldo (but with those annoying step overs )

[Thephoenix]

Totally agree comparisons between eras are impossible and pretty pointless. Still a fascinating exercise though which people will always continue to practice.
Certainly players are fitter in the modern era. But as they say a great player would be a great player in any era. He’d probably have to work harder though. Going back well before the 80’s to the Stanley Matthews era (before my time) it makes me smile when you see clips of him waltzing past defenders. I doubt he would find it so easy today. In fact the art of the dribbling winger beating players and getting to the byline is largely lost today. The winger seems to have been displaced by the dynamic wing back who is expected to attack and defend.

Perhaps a better example than football to show how competitors have improved is tennis. The power and speed of players maybe from Sampras onwards far surpasses that of players in the past.

Most of the full backs in those days were just strong crunching tacklers.
Tom Finney was as good as Mathews. I remember watching him play in the Billy Liddle testimonial game.
He was playing against Ronny Moran, who was still playing for Liverpool. Finney was retired but he still ran rings around Moran.
Mathews mainly just did the same dribble every time... Body swerve left, then run to the byline and pull it back.
It was his speed from standing that beat the fullbacks.
Can't imagine those wingers running back to defend like they do now.... Or the fullbacks running forward as 2nd wingers.
Mathews would just stay out on wing and wait for the ball.
I think Jimmy Armfield was the first attacking fullback.

[boardyhell]

the liverpool team of the eighties relied on passing back to the goalie to quieten down the fans in the away games.
great team with a scottish spine of hansen souness and dalglish
played under 80s referee liverpool win
messi doesn't beat 5 players with a dead leg

[Chorley]

I reckon the Liverpool team of 87/88 would've given them a run for their money. Barnes, Beardsley, Aldridge all in their pomp slicing through defences, McMahon, Houghton and Whelan bossing the midfield and an ultra reliable back four to protect the occasionally error prone Grobelaar.
 Ironically , I think the European ban affected them the most as I'm sure they'd have won at least one European Cup with that side. The only team that could've stopped them in that era IMHO was the great AC MIlan side of Van Basten, Gullitt and  Rijkaard

[Blackpool Rock]

the liverpool team of the eighties relied on passing back to the goalie to quieten down the fans in the away games.
great team with a scottish spine of hansen souness and dalglish
played under 80s referee liverpool win
messi doesn't beat 5 players with a dead leg

Yes so long as you have a good defence and players who can keep the ball and pass then it's quite a good strategy, not necessarily the most entertaining games to watch but it can get results.
I remember about 25 years ago a similar conversation about football and how many games and especially away games Arsenal won 1-0 with Ian wright scoring, like you say pass it around and keep the ball, kill the game and the home crowd off then jump on any chance you get.

As for Messi having a dead leg he'd be hoping that was the least of it playing against Souness 

[Matrix]

I actually thought that Milan/Barca would be a better comparison. It's a shame to see how far removed the current Milan side is from that iteration. Before Real Madrid did the threepeat (lovely American term) Milan were the last side to go back to back in the
European Cup/Champions League.

Real Madrid won 3 on the bounce, only a few years ago.

[ratedj]

Real Madrid won 3 on the bounce, only a few years ago.

I think you may need to read my comment again lol.

[JonasG]

With the backpass rule in place, 80s Liverpool wouldn't stand a chance vs Pep's Barca imo.

[Matrix]

I think you may need to read my comment again lol.

 

Sorry, early and on the phone.

[NIK]

I reckon the Liverpool team of 87/88 would've given them a run for their money. Barnes, Beardsley, Aldridge all in their pomp slicing through defences, McMahon, Houghton and Whelan bossing the midfield and an ultra reliable back four to protect the occasionally error prone Grobelaar.
 Ironically , I think the European ban affected them the most as I'm sure they'd have won at least one European Cup with that side. The only team that could've stopped them in that era IMHO was the great AC MIlan side of Van Basten, Gullitt and  Rijkaard

Good as that Liverpool side was I don't think it was anywhere near the earlier Liverpool side. For example, that midfield while very good, none of them were as good as Souness, whilst Aldridge was certainly no Rush. Good as Beardsley was (very clever player) you would never take him over Dalglish, whilst Barnes was inconsistent, although I believe he played far better for Liverpool than he did for England.  Indeed there is a very long list of players who were great for club but crap for country.

[ratedj]

Sorry, early and on the phone.

Haha, no problem 

[hornyguylondon]

The Wimbledon FA cup winning team of 1988 had the classy midfield of Vinnie Jones, Dennis Wise with the silky touch of  John Fashanu up front. Love to have seen them against Barcelona 

[Chorley]

The Wimbledon FA cup winning team of 1988 had the classy midfield of Vinnie Jones, Dennis Wise with the silky touch of  John Fashanu up front. Love to have seen them against Barcelona 

I think the closest you'll ever get to that is Don Revie's great Leeds side kicking the shit out of Johan Cruyff and Co at the Nou Camp in the mid 70's. 

[sparkus]

If they drink lots of milk then yes External Link/Members Only

[Rock123]

I'm a Liverpool supporter but I'll attempt to take my bias aside!!

I agree with Nik that the early 80's LFC team was superior to the latter 80's team though the latter 80's team played football closer to what we see in today's game. Though at club level Nik I wouldn't have called Barnes inconsistent indeed from 84-90 he was probably the best player in England. I also feel like the other poster mentioned I'd have loved to have seen that 87/88 team up against Milan team of that era, what a match that would have been.

But the 79/80 and 82-84 LFC teams were better because it have Clemence in goal for the first couple of years, a stronger back 4, Souness and Dalglish in the team.

That Barca team of 2009-2012 was magnificent and is easily amongst the best club sides of all time, plus had players integral to Spanish dominance in international tournaments. That midfield of Busquets-Xavi-Iniesta is probably the greatest of all time with Puyol and Pique at the back, Alves and Alba as the wide creators and Messi up front with a mixture of others, brilliant.


Fitness and conditions being equal i.e. take Barca back to the 80s or Liverpool to 2009-11 it would be a very good game.

Who would win? in a 2 legged game I'd back Liverpool but in a one off game I think Barca would win and I say that because I think our team would slightly better navigate a 2 legged game. Take Munich away in 81 as an example. But in a one off game Barca would edge it.

[boardyhell]

Yes so long as you have a good defence and players who can keep the ball and pass then it's quite a good strategy, not necessarily the most entertaining games to watch but it can get results.
I remember about 25 years ago a similar conversation about football and how many games and especially away games Arsenal won 1-0 with Ian wright scoring, like you say pass it around and keep the ball, kill the game and the home crowd off then jump on any chance you get.

As for Messi having a dead leg he'd be hoping that was the least of it playing against Souness 

[boardyhell]

met rodney marsh and asked him who was the hardest player he played against
chopper
how would messi do in your day
big smile
we would have kicked the shit out of him
almost said with relish
best played on mud,drunk as a skunk and kicked to pieces with a bucket and sponge physio
that said i take nothing away from messi ,a genius
if anyone remembers pele 1966 kicked out of the tournament being helped off the pitch
football has changed