Trafficking of women

[David1970]

Scottish government wants us report if we think someone is being trafficked, has anyone her ever done that? There was a piece on the radio how girls from Romania are forced into the sex trade and trafficked.
I almost reported a girl once but was not 100% sure of my facts so did not, I feel guilty about it now.
I have never punted Romanians for 2 reasons, all the reports of the shit service and fear that they are trafficked. I wonder if the shit services is because they are forced to do it?
I noticed that 3 Romainan women pop up on AW in Glasgow, all in the same post code according to AW, could be the same flat. There profile was basically the same, could it be a brothel set up by a pimp/ trafficker?
Would you punt a lady you thought was trafficked, would you report it?

[somefun]

Might be difficult to tell.  Certainly would not knowingly punt a girl I knew was trafficked.  Would I report it - the easy answer is yes but I'd have to think / research the implications for the girl / me / the girl's family.  It could easily blow up and both the punter and the girl end up in a spot of bother.

[David1970]

Might be difficult to tell.  Certainly would not knowingly punt a girl I knew was trafficked.  Would I report it - the easy answer is yes but I'd have to think / research the implications for the girl / me / the girl's family.  It could easily blow up and both the punter and the girl end up in a spot of bother.

You correct it is not easy to report if you have suspicions, are you setting yourself up as a witness in court, what if you are wrong? I think you would have to be 100% sure before you did anything.
I still feel uneasy about seeing Romanian females, especialy if there were more than one in a flat, so I will stick to no Romanians.

[Mr Farkyhars]

are you setting yourself up as a witness in court

I think you can do it anonymously via Crimestoppers..

[Santiago]

Elephant in the room time !!

This has always been a subject which has given me cause for concern...

trafficking is a horrendous crime, for some on this forum they may never give a second thought, others could never deal with the anguish !!

Other than a very very few girls who are so sexually motivated, then the only primary reason is financial..whether that is to carve out a better life for themselves, pay off a debt or support family etc.

Oldest trade in the world that say...so who are the profiteers !!!

Personally the Romainan girls that I have seen are in two very different camps....

I truly believe some are totally independent, content in what they do, and have there own reasons for doing so, I have met these girls on a frequent occasion, wiling participants and wish to raise cash to better themselves, all good and well.

The other regular Romanian girls are regularly transferred from city to city, in comparison I have seen a couple, sad, bad attitude etc.....enough said, and I will avoid.


Not fair to anyone, most importantly and without a shadow of a doubt to those who have little or no choice....trafficking = abuse.

S

[Santiago]

Some of the independent Romanian girls are being exploited in in other ways....

When they arrive here, find obtaining accommodation in the UK extremely difficult, From what I have been told there are a some profiteering "landords" taking the absolute piss..

A shitty 2 bed flat costing £100 per day, which should otherwise be £650 a month....

Opportunity...market...profit

s

[David1970]

I always think of the Romanians and Moldovan's as basically the same, people.

Is it only Romanians and Moldovan's who get trafficked?

Has anyone suspected a girl be trafficked and done something about it?

[Santiago]

David 1970

Firstly thanks for raising the post....given yesterday's height of news stories...

Do I think it's only Romanian or Moldovan are the only girls trafficked and exploited ?

Absolutely NOT !!

s

[loser]

What is trafficking? Is Randstat employment agency a trafficker if they arrange work for a Polish plumber or nanny?

[The Man With No Name]

If you're reasonably sure a group of girls are being trafficked or treated badly by one of these scumbag-pimp entrails of shite, I'd say an anonymous call, giving the address of what you say you firmly believe to be a trafficked brothel, would be the best bet.

It would at least hopefully result in a raid, as chances are, you won't be the only one (i.e. neighbours also) making such calls. Given the amount of press this issue is getting at the moment, I'd imagine the cops would do their best to press any trafficking charges provided they had the adequate evidence.

[David1970]

What is trafficking? Is Randstat employment agency a trafficker if they arrange work for a Polish plumber or nanny?

I think the polish plumber is not being forced to to it against there will, unlike the trafficked sex worker, that is the difference.

[Harrymetsally]

I saw a program some years ago about romanian forced prostitution in Romania.  The journalist bought a girl who told him she was caged by a pimp and his wife and forced to have sex as a breaking in thing.  Meanwhile other girls said they wanted to go to uk with their pimp to make more money and would never leave their pimp.  So I guess sometimes it's voluntary from the romas.

From what I have seen on tv it's the brothel girls who are more likely to be trafficked and forced into it.   And I have seen a roma woman beating her man down the south side too so mahbe he was pimped haha.

[Technicolour_trilby]

Have I had suspicions of trafficked women...yes.
Have I been with a trafficked women...not knowingly.
Have I walked from a suspicious meet...Often.
Would I report it...Doubtful (see next question)
Would I trust the police not to make things REALLY difficult for me...Not a chance in hell.

There is some evidence (although not conclusive) that crimestoppers is not quite as anonymous as the boys in blue would have you believe. I wouldn't put it past them to find you and turn up at the door..."Hello Mrs Trilby, we'd just like to talk to Mr trilby regarding trafficked prostitutes, is he in?"

...and before the inevitable cries of "paranoia!", "the police do a really great job you know", "police are brave heroes" etc.etc.

I have had 5 interactions with police in 60odd years and EVERY one without exception has left a really bad taste, I wouldn't trust them as far as I could kick them. I do acknowledge however that other experiences may be different, I can only go on my own.

[Mr Farkyhars]

There is some evidence (although not conclusive) that crimestoppers is not quite as anonymous as the boys in blue would have you believe

You're aware that Crimestoppers is not the police, but a separate body? And that you won't be asked to identify yourself? And that they also offer online contact?

[Technicolour_trilby]

You're aware that Crimestoppers is not the police, but a separate body? And that you won't be asked to identify yourself? And that they also offer online contact?

Aye right, in the same way that the Scottish Police Authority that deal with complaints is a "separate" and "independent" body.

Look, I'm not saying that Crimestoppers is PART of the police as such, I know they are a charity, and I'm fairly sure they would respect anonymity as far as the law allows but I have very good reason NOT to trust police. Sorry, just a fact.

[smiths]

Countless WGs choose to have a pimps so that's WGs who work at Agencies/Parlours/brothels and Parties for various reasons. I see it that there are 2 sorts of pimps, those where the WG voluntarily as far as I know works for the pimp, and ones where a woman is being forced. The latter once convicted should get mandatory life sentences in my view.

ANY WG COULD be being coerced/forced for all I would know as fact as I am not privy to a WGs private life, so the best I have got is my best judgement, I wouldn't knowingly punt with a forced WG but if I suspected one was I would anonymously ring Crimestoppers from a call box assuming I could find one that takes cash.

[smiths]

Have I had suspicions of trafficked women...yes.
Have I been with a trafficked women...not knowingly.
Have I walked from a suspicious meet...Often.
Would I report it...Doubtful (see next question)
Would I trust the police not to make things REALLY difficult for me...Not a chance in hell.

There is some evidence (although not conclusive) that crimestoppers is not quite as anonymous as the boys in blue would have you believe. I wouldn't put it past them to find you and turn up at the door..."Hello Mrs Trilby, we'd just like to talk to Mr trilby regarding trafficked prostitutes, is he in?"

...and before the inevitable cries of "paranoia!", "the police do a really great job you know", "police are brave heroes" etc.etc.

I have had 5 interactions with police in 60odd years and EVERY one without exception has left a really bad taste, I wouldn't trust them as far as I could kick them. I do acknowledge however that other experiences may be different, I can only go on my own.

As I posted above my advice would be phone Crimestoppers from a phone box using cash, your as anonymous then as you can be, and if that concerned use a phone box where there is no CCTV that your aware of.

I agree about not trusting the police, they look for easy nicks in many cases, a punter is an easy nick, the pimp/trafficker might involve some actual police work to catch red handed.

[Technicolour_trilby]

Aye, that would work.

Thing is, the police aren't even that concerned about the welfare of prostitutes. I bet most prossies have a tale to tell of being abused by some shithead client and the police being utterly uninterested.

[Mr Farkyhars]

assuming I could find one that takes cash

It's a long time since I've used a call box but from what I can gather, 0800 numbers are free from them too!

[The Man With No Name]

All good points. I agree with every one since my last, to a certain extent.

At least there does seem to be a loose consensus here that a call to the law in some form would be made by us punters, if real abuse was genuinely suspected. Good to see, and show, that at least some of us are not utter misogynistic bastards. 

[David1970]

If a pimp/trafficker has sex with the woman he is controlling against her will, that is rape.

If a punter pays to have sex with a woman who is trafficked against her will, is that rape?

There is a Romanian tourer in Glasgow at present (I will not use her name), is a Romanian being moved about the country set alarm bells off with any one else?

I never have and plan never to see a woman who is or I suspect to be Romanian. I know some punters will say and probably correctly that not all Romanians are pimp/trafficked, but I would not take the risk. If I had strong suspicion that a woman was being trafficked I would phone crime stoppers.

[Harrymetsally]

You can spot some of the hookers down Viccy Rd...they have all the best of gear on compared to the standard Romas.  So I'd say some of the Romanian girls are benefiting.

[loser]

I think the polish plumber is not being forced to to it against there will, unlike the trafficked sex worker, that is the difference.

I was not being facetious, maybe I am thick but I do not really know the meaning of trafficking in this context. I take it to mean the facilitation of transport, which could be morally neutral, even though any subsequent exploitation would be immoral. Advocates of the criminalisation of prostitution related activity between consenting adults suggest that all prostitutes are trafficked and coerced and like to deliberately confuse the public by using the words prostitution and trafficking interchangeably.

[loser]

Scottish government wants us report if we think someone is being trafficked, has anyone her ever done that? There was a piece on the radio how girls from Romania are forced into the sex trade and trafficked.
I almost reported a girl once but was not 100% sure of my facts so did not, I feel guilty about it now.
I have never punted Romanians for 2 reasons, all the reports of the shit service and fear that they are trafficked. I wonder if the shit services is because they are forced to do it?
I noticed that 3 Romainan women pop up on AW in Glasgow, all in the same post code according to AW, could be the same flat. There profile was basically the same, could it be a brothel set up by a pimp/ trafficker?
Would you punt a lady you thought was trafficked, would you report it?

Standard practice for almost all new Romanians is a shared flat with 2-4 girls. The commonly found shit service is probably because the pimp (often a woman) takes 50% of the earnings and usually mismanages the imposed profile so she is either over or underworked and has to fend off requests for services she does not know the meaning of. Therefore there is no motivation to give good service and anyway they are only here short term. They either move around the country once they have exhausted all the local mugs or go back home. The rare exceptions are the ones who have been through the system and are now independent. They have lived here for a few years, speak English and are fully assimilated. Curiously this later group tend to give a really good service, probably better than native Britons on average.

[David1970]

Standard practice for almost all new Romanians is a shared flat with 2-4 girls. The commonly found shit service is probably because the pimp (often a woman) takes 50% of the earnings and usually mismanages the imposed profile so she is either over or underworked and has to fend off requests for services she does not know the meaning of. Therefore there is no motivation to give good service and anyway they are only here short term. They either move around the country once they have exhausted all the local mugs or go back home. The rare exceptions are the ones who have been through the system and are now independent. They have lived here for a few years, speak English and are fully assimilated. Curiously this later group tend to give a really good service, probably better than native Britons on average.

I am being thick, but are you saying the ones who are pimped are trafficked or not?

[randydandy2013]

You're aware that Crimestoppers is not the police, but a separate body? And that you won't be asked to identify yourself? And that they also offer online contact?

If you used your PAYG punting phone that isn't registered to you and withheld your number, surely that would keep you anonymous?

[Technicolour_trilby]

I am being thick, but are you saying the ones who are pimped are trafficked or not?

A fair question, and it demonstrates how media fervour which insists on using emotive, sensationalist terms doesn't really help.

I suppose we all have our definitions, mine would be...

Woman travels from Romania via EU free movement rules, gets in touch with someone who deals with accommodation, profiles, client etc. for a cut (usually a sizeable one) = PIMPED.

Woman travels against her will under threat of harm in the first place, doesn't really matter what happens beyond that = TRAFFICKED.

Both practices are pretty horrible in my view, I've yet to hear of a 'good' pimp.

[fed24]

Aye right, in the same way that the Scottish Police Authority that deal with complaints is a "separate" and "independent" body.

Look, I'm not saying that Crimestoppers is PART of the police as such, I know they are a charity, and I'm fairly sure they would respect anonymity as far as the law allows but I have very good reason NOT to trust police. Sorry, just a fact.

The Police love members of the public who are "Just being helpful..." they are so helpful they often incriminate themselves giving an easy collar to put on the stats!

[David1970]

The Police love members of the public who are "Just being helpful..." they are so helpful they often incriminate themselves giving an easy collar to put on the stats!

So if I get you, you would not report if you knew a female was being trafficked/pimped, being forced to have sex with you?

[Technicolour_trilby]

He didn't say that, I suspect he would be like me, report it but with caution taken to preserve anonymity, what's wrong with that?

[loser]

See also the thread in the UK board: https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=115075.25
Co-workers might not be happy about being rescued. If you are going to report all pimping activities then you would have to report every sauna and every escort agency.

[David1970]

This thread title is " Trafficking of Women", that's women who have been brought to this country and forced to work at prostitutes, against there will. Not women who want to work as prostitutes of there own free will.

I am sure there a men who do not give a shit if the women is forced, through threats of violence to themselves or family. I don't think a trafficked woman will see the differences between being raped by the trafficker and being fucked by a punter.

As stated before in this thread you can phone Crimestoppers without giving your details.

[gorgie tony]

BBC Scotland News tonight was reporting that 2 people in Gorgie have been arrested for trafficking women for prostitution.

[auldie63]

Aw you Embra guys must be shitting yersells.