Hi-fi buffs?

[Romeo Sensini]

Have we any on here?

I’m looking for a bit of advice on a new or s/h cd set up.

Currently I’ve a load of cds and nothing to play them on. Haven’t the time, money or inclination to follow the vinyl trend.

I’m assuming separates is the way to go so cd player, amp, speakers but I’ve no real clue.

Can anyone point me in the right direction please (or correct my assumption above).

Cheers

[maxQ]

Is it just CDs you want to listen to ?

You might not need the amp, buy a good quality bluetooth speaker with optical and RCA inputs, then you can listen to CDs and something like Spotifi

[timsussex]

IMHO times have changed
The traditional advice was to spend most of your budget on the source - after all if your basic signal is bad its difficult to improve and better components down the line will only amplify the faults

However now the electronics are so well sorted and so cheap I'd invest most in the speakers

A £10 USB cd computer drive needs to deliver 100% accuracy or the program wont work. Reading Audio from a cd is a piece of cake and the electronics to convert it to an analogue signal are made in their thousands in China  It is now a science while 20 tears ago it was an art

Lots of cheap quality wifi separates on Ebay Look for  good names

[cunningman]

IMHO times have changed
The traditional advice was to spend most of your budget on the source - after all if your basic signal is bad its difficult to improve and better components down the line will only amplify the faults

However now the electronics are so well sorted and so cheap I'd invest most in the speakers

A £10 USB cd computer drive needs to deliver 100% accuracy or the program wont work. Reading Audio from a cd is a piece of cake and the electronics to convert it to an analogue signal are made in their thousands in China  It is now a science while 20 tears ago it was an art

Lots of cheap quality wifi separates on Ebay Look for  good names

I completely agree - if your computer has a CD drive then use it to rip the disks, use EAC or AccurateRip.

Then you can play the music direct through a DAC to old-skool stuff.  Or let a modern streamer play it from your hard drive over the network - and most will also stream from network services or your phone too.  All of this will likely be better than a CD player of almost any vintage and budget, and much more convenient in replay.

If you have a smart TV with e-ARC then you might just use that as a front end from the PC drive (or even a USB drive).

Modern cheap class-D amps can be remarkably good value even compared to second hand stuff if the PSU is sized right.  Which leaves speakers - and stands.  (Having said that I have a bunch of Fosi Mono's on my main system, but my desk system uses a 20-something year old Cyrus Power - it good enough and still works)

What sort of budget do you have - and what sort of room?

You don't sound like a hifi gear head - is this a 'buy once and just be happy' gig?

[Mr Garmin]

I remember a debate about gold plated speaker cables many years ago, specifically about listening to BBC R3.  A mate who worked for the national broadcaster said "you want to see the state of the cables that it goes through before it gets to the modulator"

We have a number of members on here who have a dog in this fight.

My opinion, if you like how it sounds, then go with it.

[timsussex]

Like (I suspect many of us)  I have a £1k+ Hifi system which I rarely use (and probably the same invested in a decent arm &  turntable and tape decks which are  in the attic)

90% of my listening is done in the car and perhaps 10% from my PC 

[Stevelondon]

Jeez……….. it’s something else I’ve got stacks of. CD’s and bloody DVD’s.
I’ve a study full of them.

Yes yes I know. I’ve got a study. Get over it I’m posh. 

[Mr Garmin]

Yes yes I know. I’ve got a study. Get over it I’m posh. 

Of course you're posh, you call the spare room the study 

[advent2016]

Have you considered Spotify. Huge library and you can download to play offline.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

You can spend quite a lot on decent audio systems but there a point called diminishing returns.

It amazes me to see what some people pay these days, tens of thousands of pounds. No real need. I'd avoid USB gubbins go for more conventional equipment in that field there is some every good British audio around even the venerable QUAD 33/303 got one here made in 1968 yes 58 years old and still works fine and to spec. Drives a couple of Spendor LS3/5A's their fetching silly money these days around a grand but very  good units. In the living room QUAD Electrostatics extremely accurate driven by QUAD 520's modified anyway enough re that.

I'd suggest a conventionl CD player look in what hi-fi for reviews a good secondhand one will be fine whatever you choose. As to the Amplifier one that's still great and versatile is the Audiolab 8000A series around 70 ish watts per channel out, good  input selectors can be had for around 250 quids and get the one or version that had conventional treble and bass controls.

Speakers are the next awkward choice depends if you want to loud and proud floor standers or bookshelf ones again have a gander in what hi-fi for older previews and check out whats around on e-bay most British makes like mission and spendor are very good.

No need to silly expensive interconnect cables CPC up o in Preston are online there are fine there are absolute silly buggers like Russ Andrews who do cable for silly money the mains cables that can charge around 1500 quids for one but that's just from you amp  the wall socket never mind what connected it to the consumer unit!.

One thing that's very worthwhile of a radio tuner BBC radio 3 is an excellent station get a decent Denon FM one they are some around with DAB versatile radio programming but DAB isn't hi-fi but has its uses

If you must have a gramophone or disc player the Audiolab amp has inputs for Moving magnet and moving coils are excellent and they will match any modern fancy gubbins. Some like the could of vinyl but ts just a colored audio like valves and the like.

Finally if you wan to play tracks of your PC the audio out on most pc's is pretty poor an external c soundcard unit is a very good idea there are someone around a for a few hundred quids of less i've got a Digigram one fully pro bit overkill but its good can hear the differences betwixt MP3 and Linear PCM it will show any deficiencies up but that's what a good system will do!..

Have fun..

[Mr Garmin]

I knew Watts wouldn't let us down

[cunningman]

I knew Watts wouldn't let us down

Except that advice to use a CD player is arguably bollocks given that even inexpensive chifi DACs available like the Fosi ZD3 are much better than you'd get in a conventional CD player, and the USB feed is jitter free with the clock in the DAC, unlike any add-on DAc via SPDIF or coax, which will need to reclock.  Even R2R is attainable now.  If you like having to do the old ceremony for finding the disk and loading and selecting and skipping tracks etc then fine - but having an ability to run playlists and flip around on a UI is pretty handy.

Its certainly diminishing returns - very very quickly these days, and much more about the room and the speakers.

And for reference - I have an 8000C in a cupboard and used to have an 8000P to go with it - but it blew up.  That old stuff is just old.  I used to drive a pair of consumer ATC SCM50-alikes with audiolabs but its all overpriced even second hand now, and I'm over trying to afford something with that dome midrange: there are better solutions.

Personally I would rather make loudspeakers now - it curbs my gearhead spending by adding laziness and latency.  I probably have 40 drivers still in boxes.  I really must make something. Retirement projects loom.  Its cheaper than shagging, or churning through second hand gear. ;-)

[Mr Garmin]

Except that advice to use a CD player is arguably bollocks given that even inexpensive chifi DACs available like the Fosi ZD3 are much better than you'd get in a conventional CD player, and the USB feed is jitter free with the clock in the DAC, unlike any add-on DAc via SPDIF or coax, which will need to reclock.  Even R2R is attainable now.  If you like having to do the old ceremony for finding the disk and loading and selecting and skipping tracks etc then fine - but having an ability to run playlists and flip around on a UI is pretty handy.

Its certainly diminishing returns - very very quickly these days, and much more about the room and the speakers.

And for reference - I have an 8000C in a cupboard and used to have an 8000P to go with it - but it blew up.  That old stuff is just old.  I used to drive a pair of consumer ATC SCM50-alikes with audiolabs but its all overpriced even second hand now, and I'm over trying to afford something with that dome midrange: there are better solutions.

Personally I would rather make loudspeakers now - it curbs my gearhead spending by adding laziness and latency.  I probably have 40 drivers still in boxes.  I really must make something. Retirement projects loom.  Its cheaper than shagging, or churning through second hand gear. ;-)

You're Watts twin brother and I claim my £10

[PilotMan]

All the advice is great, but I think we should wait for @Romeo Sensini to tell us his budget. A nifty, a monkey, a gunder, or more?

I've got a Cyrus 1 Amp, Cyrus tuner and a Rega Planar 2 turntable; I think I even have a Nakamichi tape deck.

I have a shed load of Vinyl that I'm keeping, I doubt that I'll ever play it though. I haven't used any of it in years. However, for my normal everyday listening I just stream it from Spotify Android Auto in the car, or Spotify through an Amazon Echo at home.

I've got a huge box full of CD's that I never listen too, because Spotify makes it too easy. I need to clear the CD's out; any suggestions on what to do with them?

BTW Stevelondon, I've got a library and a study, so I'm considerably more posher than yeow (said in a brummy accent, if anyone remembers that)

[Romeo Sensini]

All the advice is great, but I think we should wait for @Romeo Sensini to tell us his budget. A nifty, a monkey, a gunder, or more?

I've got a Cyrus 1 Amp, Cyrus tuner and a Rega Planar 2 turntable; I think I even have a Nakamichi tape deck.

I have a shed load of Vinyl that I'm keeping, I doubt that I'll ever play it though. I haven't used any of it in years. However, for my normal everyday listening I just stream it from Spotify Android Auto in the car, or Spotify through an Amazon Echo at home.

I've got a huge box full of CD's that I never listen too, because Spotify makes it too easy. I need to clear the CD's out; any suggestions on what to do with them?

BTW Stevelondon, I've got a library and a study, so I'm considerably more posher than yeow (said in a brummy accent, if anyone remembers that)

Thanks everyone so far, plenty of food for thought. As for budget I’m a notorious tight-arse so was thinking about £300. As for Spotify etc, I don’t really want to pay again for something I’ve already got. I suppose go the route of ripping on the PC if I could apply myself..

[Dogbreath]

I’d rip all your CDs to flac files on your PC, then you’ll have a home music server.

[Matrix]

Have we any on here?

I’m looking for a bit of advice on a new or s/h cd set up.

Currently I’ve a load of cds and nothing to play them on. Haven’t the time, money or inclination to follow the vinyl trend.

I’m assuming separates is the way to go so cd player, amp, speakers but I’ve no real clue.

Can anyone point me in the right direction please (or correct my assumption above).

Cheers

If you want to preserve sound quality stay wired. Bluetooth is Absolute garbage. Most modern Tv's will act as a decoder to whatever player you have attached or just feed it a pc. Simply buy a bar or speakers to hook up to the tv. All in one solution.

[mr.bluesky]

Of course you're posh, you call the spare room the study 

It's his attic really 

[catweazle]

Years ago,  a friend spent, literally, two or three thousand on a hifi system.   I went round to his place to take a look.

He put a vinyl LP on; yes it sounded good, but every 10 or 15 seconds he'd jump up, study one of the myriad dials and gauges, and tweak one of the knobs a mere millimetre or so, then sit back down.

He wasn't happy when I commented that  he only knew how good it sounded by looking at the dials, instead of sitting back and enjoying the music.

( his wife did remark that he constantly adjusts the knobs and dials,  and he'd never sat through a whole LP)

[timsussex]

Thanks everyone so far, plenty of food for thought. As for budget I’m a notorious tight-arse so was thinking about £300. As for Spotify etc, I don’t really want to pay again for something I’ve already got. I suppose go the route of ripping on the PC if I could apply myself..

If your budget is £300 dont ask a HiFi Buff   

Its a bit like asking a Rolls Royce owner about your rusty mini !

[Romeo Sensini]

If your budget is £300 dont ask a HiFi Buff   

Its a bit like asking a Rolls Royce owner about your rusty mini !

How did you know I’ve got a rusty Mini 

[cunningman]

I've got a huge box full of CD's that I never listen too, because Spotify makes it too easy. I need to clear the CD's out; any suggestions on what to do with them?

Charity shop?  I regularly trawl them.  Doesn't bother me if its stuff I wouldn't listen too - guests might like it.  I draw the line at Susan Boyle or RAP/Gangsta of any type.  Do do even accidentally listen to Girls Aloud while scrolling around.  The problem is trying to remember what I already have.

Interesting what you don't find - a bit like those wartime studies of bombers with holes in.  Lots of Dido, Robbie Williams, Oasis.  Never seen any Pink Floyd, Genesis, Rush, Yes - even Mike Oldfield, JMJ etc.  Not that I would need any.  Precious little Jazz apart from mag cover collections, which I would quite like.

I had a Cyrus 1 - and a CS505 and Mission 700s.  Back when hifi wasn't ludicrous, even chifi.  Not surprising the dealers all went bust - I don't recall ever seeing a queue of people at a til.  Dreamers and klingons there for free coffee and a natter.

[PilotMan]

I had a Cyrus 1 - and a CS505 and Mission 700s. 

I've still got my Mission 770's - they work a treat as my front L/R speakers on my Cinema System.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Mr Cunningman Sir!  well the OP did say he wanted something to play his CD's on so i know that Fosi do a dinky CD player but I'd have thought a ordinary CD player would be fine but now seeing his limited budget maybe not..

Pity you had your Audiolab units give up on you their not difficult  to fix. I have a set only thing that was done to them was replacement of the main and a few other caps like l most all gear they do benefit from new electro's. And the Old Audiolabs can deliver serious currents into low complex impedance speaker loads.

Interesting DAC units might treat me olde Sony 557ESD unit to something a bit more modern, but its a hell of a player solid copper chassis weights about the same as sack of cement!

Pity but the FOSI unit doesn't have an analogue input for the old but brilliant Yamaha CT-7000 FM tuner its been great on the proms last few months..

Nice to see their adoption of balanced line working it never took on with domestic gear and to think a cartridge would be well matched with a balanced input like most all pro mic's

i do note they have a valve unit for that well, eer richer sound-U-like;?

And what the feck are you doing with 44 bloody drive units and where are all the finished speaker units going to go then;?..

[Mr Garmin]

Not surprising the dealers all went bust - I don't recall ever seeing a queue of people at a til.  Dreamers and klingons there for free coffee and a natter.

↑ ↑ ↑ This ↑ ↑ ↑

They'd spend hours discussing the merits of RMS v Peak and at the end they might buy a phono lead, or perhaps go away to research it before deciding.  Mind you, the shop owners were just a geeky. 

There was one shop on Victoria Road in Cambridge where I bought a pair of Wharfdale speakers.  I walked in and pointed at them and said "I'd like those please" deal done I walked out, they must have thought I was really weird.

[PilotMan]

Sevenoaks still have a shop in Cambridge and quite a few around the country.

I used to buy all my stuff from AT Labs in Gants Hill.

[Collingwood]

If your budget is tight consider a second hand BrennanB2. It’s basically a CD jukebox. You rip your CDs into it ( a doddle to do) and then you have instant access to every album / artist/track you’ve ripped. There is a phone app to control it but it’s pants on modern phones . Use an old Android spare and it’s ok . It’s like Spotify for your own CD collection.Includes a nice class D amp and you can get them with matching Brennan speakers. Sounds pretty good IMO
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[daviemac]

Thanks everyone so far, plenty of food for thought. As for budget I’m a notorious tight-arse so was thinking about £300. As for Spotify etc, I don’t really want to pay again for something I’ve already got. I suppose go the route of ripping on the PC if I could apply myself..

If you've got a desktop how about adding a solid state hard drive just for your music and investing in some decent speakers to play it through, or with decent speakers you could just play your cd's from the disc drive.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Yes well 7oaks, but if yore really possessed theres this lot ....

Not soo bad..

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And the real pros who will take you to the cleaners !,

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[superchamp]

I have considered updating my 25 year old hi-fi (Rega/Marantz/Mission), then realised that my 68 year old ears are beyond updating.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

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[maxQ]

He put a vinyl LP on; yes it sounded good, but every 10 or 15 seconds he'd jump up, study one of the myriad dials and gauges, and tweak one of the knobs a mere millimetre or so, then sit back down.

Lads like this (its always men) don't like music, he just likes listening to his Hi-Fi

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Spending all that money just to listen to the best of Queen

[PilotMan]

If your budget is tight consider a second hand BrennanB2. It’s basically a CD jukebox. You rip your CDs into it ( a doddle to do) and then you have instant access to every album / artist/track you’ve ripped. There is a phone app to control it but it’s pants on modern phones . Use an old Android spare and it’s ok . It’s like Spotify for your own CD collection.Includes a nice class D amp and you can get them with matching Brennan speakers. Sounds pretty good IMO
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That looks like a decent idea, I can RIP all my old CD's, I've got a few hundred. I seems like it will work alongside a WIIM streamer and be able link in to my whole house multi-media system I'm planning.

[Collingwood]

If you’re into streaming take a look at the Brennan B3
More expensive but I think it has a built in dac/streamer
I believe both work well with Sonos

[fredhiggins]

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Or one of the Roberts or Pure bit of kit that play CDs?

Maybe get to John Lewis or Richer sounds. Or an indie.

[advent2016]

If you've got a desktop how about adding a solid state hard drive just for your music and investing in some decent speakers to play it through, or with decent speakers you could just play your cd's from the disc drive.

Now isn't the time to buy a SSD. recent years they have doubled  although like punting where 30 mins was £100 we have gotten used to paying £200

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[CaptainCosmic]

I’d strongly recommend checking out a second hand Denon rcd-m39dab mini hifi system.

The Denon rcd-m39dab is a DAB/FM receiver with CD and MP3 player. The Denon receiver is compact and has been highly recommended in hifi magazines for years.

The latest Denon model (rcd-m41DAB) costs around £400 new, but the older m39DAB model can usually be obtained on ebay/facebook etc for around £80 - £100.

Apparently, the Denon SC-N41 speakers which typically come with the system aren’t recommended so highly. I’d recommend looking for some Q Acoustics 2010i speakers (around £80 - £90 second hand) or Dali Zensor 1 speakers (around £100 - £120 second hand). If bought together, the Denon and Q Acoustics can usually be picked up for around £130 - £150.

As background, a friend who’s a hifi buff recommended the system to me about 18 months ago. I’ve been so impressed with the sound quality for such a small and relatively inexpensive system that I’ve now bought 4 them for different rooms in my home.

Hope the advice is helpful.

[Romeo Sensini]

I’d strongly recommend checking out a second hand Denon rcd-m39dab mini hifi system.

The Denon rcd-m39dab is a DAB/FM receiver with CD and MP3 player. The Denon receiver is compact and has been highly recommended in hifi magazines for years.

The latest Denon model (rcd-m41DAB) costs around £400 new, but the older m39DAB model can usually be obtained on ebay/facebook etc for around £80 - £100.

Apparently, the Denon SC-N41 speakers which typically come with the system aren’t recommended so highly. I’d recommend looking for some Q Acoustics 2010i speakers (around £80 - £90 second hand) or Dali Zensor 1 speakers (around £100 - £120 second hand). If bought together, the Denon and Q Acoustics can usually be picked up for around £130 - £150.

As background, a friend who’s a hifi buff recommended the system to me about 18 months ago. I’ve been so impressed with the sound quality for such a small and relatively inexpensive system that I’ve now bought 4 them for different rooms in my home.

Hope the advice is helpful.

Thanks Captain, this sounds like just the thing!

[timsussex]

Probably too late but this Denon system just popped up on ebay charity site

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[cunningman]

And what the feck are you doing with 44 bloody drive units and where are all the finished speaker units going to go then;?..

I don't have a plan with finished speakers - but its an excuse to amuse myself in retirement with 3d printing and CNC routing.

I have some DSP preamps from miniDSP and CoLinear that make it fun.  Giving away completed units will require dealing with passive crossover design but its a challenge.

FWIW my current speakers are the WAW/FAST design by XRK (details on DiyAudio) and they are very engaging - a full range and a woofer below, no tweeter.  I can understand how people like full-range designs, even if they look ragged on paper.

I have the as-designed crossovers but they do not have baffle-step correction as far as I can tell and sound a bit thin - I'm running them active with Fosi monoblocks.

Its rather more than OP wants to spend (the drivers are both of £200 a side) but drivers, amps, DSP crossover - all reusable and can be repurposed.

I figure this deals with a temptation for upgraditis - there's a limit to how quickly I can make new things and absolutely no excuse for me to buy anything other than music (well, and maybe some better amps when I can justify top end class-D kits).