Escort Accommodation in Edinburgh

[S.X. MacHine]

Edinburgh City Clowncil, has, in its infinite unwisdom, introduced draconian obligations on the owners of short term lets, including expensive registration and an obligation to obtain full planning consent.
This should, pretty much, kill off the availability of AirBnB flats in the city. Apparently, very few short term renters have applied for permission. The October deadline looms.
If I am right in thinking that sex workers mostly use these premises, where will they work from in the near future? Saunas and hotels come to mind as an alternative, but I suspect these will not be suitable in many cases.
Should we be worried?

[willie loman]

Edinburgh City Clowncil, has, in its infinite unwisdom, introduced draconian obligations on the owners of short term lets, including expensive registration and an obligation to obtain full planning consent.
This should, pretty much, kill off the availability of AirBnB flats in the city. Apparently, very few short term renters have applied for permission. The October deadline looms.
If I am right in thinking that sex workers mostly use these premises, where will they work from in the near future? Saunas and hotels come to mind as an alternative, but I suspect these will not be suitable in many cases.
Should we be worried?

There was  a legal challenge, the council lost, it was the snps idea in the first place, so there will be plenty of accomodation for those who like brasilians and romanians being shuffled around the country.

[big-al93]

Not really, many areas have had similar requirements for years, I'm surprised that such a scheme isn't already operating.

These are normally (I have no details of the edinburgh scheme in particular) more aimed at ensuring that accomodation is up to scratch and safe. Unless there is something specific in the details to make it difficult to let to sex workers it won't have much impact, except adding a couple of quid per night to cover additional costs.

If anything it may improve the standard of accomodation available to touring SP's. (More fluffy towels  )

[willie loman]

Not really, many areas have had similar requirements for years, I'm surprised that such a scheme isn't already operating.

These are normally (I have no details of the edinburgh scheme in particular) more aimed at ensuring that accomodation is up to scratch and safe. Unless there is something specific in the details to make it difficult to let to sex workers it won't have much impact, except adding a couple of quid per night to cover additional costs.

If anything it may improve the standard of accomodation available to touring SP's. (More fluffy towels  )

i dont think you have followed this issue, its a country wide crackdown on holiday lets for ideological reasons, led by the snp, google is your friend.

[big-al93]

I wouldn't say it's a crackdown. As I said it's primarily focused on safety and regulation, bringing short term (holiday)lets into line with the regulatory burdens already placed on traditional landlords for years now. The mention of Edinburgh council threw me, as opposed to being the whole of Scotland. This will make next to no difference to the vast majority of people letting decent accomodation. Only those with substandard properties will be affected to any great extent. I wouldn't worry about a lack of uptake in licences, what is likely to happen is that the councils will be flooded with applications in the last few days, which the council will be under prepared for (situation normal with any gov organisation of any persuasion) and will allow all those that have applied to continue until the backlog is cleared. After all the deadline is only for those that were already letting a property before Oct 2022, any new properties/operators since then are already licensed. A friend of my sister did this for her property recently and it's not that onerus, just another level of officialdom to navigate.

[Massagetugga]

Big-al93 it seems most of the current airbnbs simply won’t get the necessary permissions. Mainly planning permission. Anything with a shared entrance and in residential areas rather than commercial (ie most flats) won’t meet the criteria.

We all know a lot of flats are regular WG haunts. I think a lot of these flats fly under the radar anyway. Got to be a good income for the landlords with week to week back to back bookings. Hardly any low occupancy weeks or month
I was just chatting to a Thai recently during Edinburg festival just now. Basically £100 a day but that was probably lower than it would be just now. The flat seems to be a new regular WG flat. Not bad for the landlord if getting about £2800 a month almost all year round.

[Name Not Found]

There was  a legal challenge, the council lost, it was the snps idea in the first place, so there will be plenty of accomodation for those who like brasilians and romanians being shuffled around the country.

The council 'lost' only in a very limited way in that the presumption that a shared entrance was an absolute bar to short-term rental was deemed to be invalid. The did not 'lose' on a wider scale.

[Name Not Found]

I wouldn't say it's a crackdown. As I said it's primarily focused on safety and regulation, bringing short term (holiday)lets into line with the regulatory burdens already placed on traditional landlords for years now. The mention of Edinburgh council threw me, as opposed to being the whole of Scotland. This will make next to no difference to the vast majority of people letting decent accomodation. Only those with substandard properties will be affected to any great extent. I wouldn't worry about a lack of uptake in licences, what is likely to happen is that the councils will be flooded with applications in the last few days, which the council will be under prepared for (situation normal with any gov organisation of any persuasion) and will allow all those that have applied to continue until the backlog is cleared. After all the deadline is only for those that were already letting a property before Oct 2022, any new properties/operators since then are already licensed. A friend of my sister did this for her property recently and it's not that onerus, just another level of officialdom to navigate.

Thousands of short-term renters would disagree with you about it being a 'crackdown'. I'm both a landlord and a short-term renter and I can assure you it is extremely onerous and in no way comparable with the requirements of landlords. I also participate in many forums for short-term lets and the amount of people who have chosen to leave the market due to the increased bureaucracy and cost is alarming. There may be a bump in applications on the last day, but the impact will still be huge, and all because the SNP perceived a problem in Edinburgh, so everybody else has to suffer 

[globewindsailor]

I suppose they make it easier for escorts to find a low-key place to work with the owner less fussed and if enough flats clumped together less neighbours causing a fuss. Social menace short term lets in my opinion and never thought of them as useful in esorting circles so an added bonus for the anti prossie brigade. It will reduce the market for a bit, but it will adjust. I think one or two escorts might get very affected by this.

[Name Not Found]

I suppose they make it easier for escorts to find a low-key place to work with the owner less fussed and if enough flats clumped together less neighbours causing a fuss. Social menace short term lets in my opinion and never thought of them as useful in esorting circles so an added bonus for the anti prossie brigade. It will reduce the market for a bit, but it will adjust. I think one or two escorts might get very affected by this.

Do get in touch again once you've learned to write in coherent sentences 

[auldie63]

Typical SNP behaviour, they go on about greater devolution but are constantly removing control of things from local authority control, first the Police then the Fire Brigade, the more you see of them the more they resemble another Nationalist party in central Europe in the 1930s. 

[Problem Child]

Wow, this thread went from zero to Godwin’s Law in record time..

[Name Not Found]

Wow, this thread went from zero to Godwin’s Law in record time..

It's well known the Nazis were quite strict on short-term-lets. I think they may have been worried about having too many foreign visitors... 

[S.X. MacHine]

Wow, this thread went from zero to Godwin’s Law in record time..
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There’s an article on STV news about the topic which gives some relevant insights. The Edinburgh Clowncil’s draconian attitude will, in my opinion, affect not only sex workers but also visitors and performers at the Fringe.

[globewindsailor]

Do get in touch again once you've learned to write in coherent sentences 

It's the way I am I am afraid. You could put me on ignore?

[Problem Child]

@sxmachine- I can’t quote your answer coz the quote thing is all fucked.

Oh yeah, from the landlord’s pov, this seems like a fucking nightmare. I was just talking to one earlier this week and she was having a massive headache, jiggling her properties around from short to long term and vice versa to try and get her short terms to pass these new regulations.

[john1960]

Typical SNP behaviour, they go on about greater devolution but are constantly removing control of things from local authority control, first the Police then the Fire Brigade, the more you see of them the more they resemble another Nationalist party in central Europe in the 1930s. 

What incoherent drivel.

[S.X. MacHine]

@sxmachine- I can’t quote your answer coz the quote thing is all fucked.

Oh yeah, from the landlord’s pov, this seems like a fucking nightmare. I was just talking to one earlier this week and she was having a massive headache, jiggling her properties around from short to long term and vice versa to try and get her short terms to pass these new regulations.

My apologies.
The Council could not have been more heavy handed in dealing with the issue. Apparently it was in response to complaints from some flat dwellers regarding anti social behaviour by AirBnB users.
The new rules will even apply to any property owner wishing to take in a flat mate. Utter lunacy but, hey, Edinburgh Council.

[willie loman]

My apologies.
The Council could not have been more heavy handed in dealing with the issue. Apparently it was in response to complaints from some flat dwellers regarding anti social behaviour by AirBnB users.
The new rules will even apply to any property owner wishing to take in a flat mate. Utter lunacy but, hey, Edinburgh Council.

there was more than one reason for bringing in the legislation, tosh about communities losing their sense of community, housing shortages for "ordinary folk", curious failure to grasp that airbnb money stays in scotland, hotel money goes to a tax shelter in jersey, plus airbnb actually attracts visitors who wouldnt normally come to scotland, and yes quite a few of them are sex workers.

[Massagetugga]

I agree they’ve gone heavy handed. You have to remember that there have been quite a lot of bigger flats that accommodate larger parties like Stag’s and Hen’s and these can be disruptive.

I know people in traditional tenements affected. Some tenements have had almost half the flats gone over to airbnb. We’ve all seen half a dozen or more key boxes outside. It isn’t great for long term owner occupiers. The “guests” tend to come and go at odd hours the likes of from late or delayed flights. It is also unsettling for someone above or below an airbnb. You’re not sure if the property is occupied or not and when you might get noise.

There is a severe shortage of longer term rented accommodation in Edinburgh which could do with being addressed.

It is a tricky situation. Airbnb is a recent phenomenon that rocketed a bit too much for it’s own good IMO. It did of course start out as renting your spare room and then morphed into people buying flats with the sole purpose of using the accommodation like your own mini hotel.

[S.X. MacHine]

Massagetugga, I accept there’s been an issue with partying but the Clowncil has overreacted; massively, some would say.
The national housing shortage is in large part a result of councils’ own restrictive planning policies. The answer is to build more housing, not inflict damage on the rented sector.

[Massagetugga]

Some sort of happy medium would be best, I agree.

[windowlicker]

The SNP have made it a nightmare for landlords.

I know a lot of folk who had flats for longer term and student lets that worked perfectly well. Then the SNP changed the rules in favour of the tenant. They put in rent controls and importantly restricted the lease to 1 month. This will often not the suit landlord as if a tenant can give 1 month notice there is significant additional cost.

Much easier to stick the property on AirBnb and make more money.

[Name Not Found]

The SNP have made it a nightmare for landlords.

I spoke to a guy who is the Chief Exec of the largest landlord's association in Scotland a few weeks ago. From years of interaction with them, he believes there is an ingrained anti-landlord culture in the Scottish Government that drives everything they do in this sector. Their simplistic view is 'renters good - landlords bad'. He was very careful not to make a party-political point of it; it's just the attitude that he encounters all the time.

[daviemac]

What incoherent drivel.

He has 45 reviews, where are your's, it is a requirement to post reviews in order to maintain membership.

[S.X. MacHine]

I spoke to a guy who is the Chief Exec of the largest landlord's association in Scotland a few weeks ago. From years of interaction with them, he believes there is an ingrained anti-landlord culture in the Scottish Government that drives everything they do in this sector. Their simplistic view is 'renters good - landlords bad'. He was very careful not to make a party-political point of it; it's just the attitude that he encounters all the time.

The UK government is pursuing similar policies with the result that many landlords, on both sides of the border, are leaving the sector. Fewer available rented properties imply greater demand for those remaining, with an inevitable increase in rents.
What’s not to understand?
Now the Scottish government, or what passes for one, is set to eliminate short term rentals with dire consequences for tourism and the leisure industry. I include our punting activities in the latter.

[Massagetugga]

Yes the Scottish Government seems to just see landlords as greedy fat cats and seem to think they deserve to be penalised and treated with contempt. The truth is that through current legislation most provide an excellent standard of much needed rental accommodation.

End result is just losing rental property with new legislation coming soon making life even harder for the landlord. The bottom line is losing control of your own property if setting rent caps, needing to use tribunals if eviction is required, no minimum tenancy periods etc all combined with the burden of certification on everything.

It even looks like things looming like not even being able to rent a property if it doesn’t meet energy performance standards. No surprise people are getting out of it.