Euros 2020 (21)

[martini2429]

Actually James Ward-Prowse could be another shout. Not as dynamic as TAA but quality on the ball and free kicks and corners just as good.

Will be interesting to see if GS goes for a direct defender or look further ahead. Apparently he wont decide untill after Sundays game against the Roms (egggstra baaaaybe)

My guess is he will bring in either Godfrey or White

 

[webpunter]

Really ?

My guess is he will bring in either Godfrey or White

 

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Ben White 

[Davey Dykes]

I'm more than happy Scotland have qualified, if we end with zero points or/and goals so be it.

But I expect we'll have some small crumb of comfort like Ally McCoist at WC98 or Archie Gemmil at 78.

[Davey Dykes]

Hmm, now thinking Ally missed WC and Euro 96 I'm thinking of. Cracking goal either way.

[HampshireLad]

You make an interesting point. I think this current generation of players is technically as close to its European and South American counterparts than any other recent generation. English players are not lacking in the physical and skill department but rather on the mental side. It's the ability, or rather inability, to handle pressure. I personally believe that one of the reasons why England have more often than not underperformed at major tournaments is due to repeatedly suffering 'paralysis from analysis.' The Euro 2016 exit v Iceland was a great example of this.

Why do other nations not suffer from this? Again, just my theory, but you tend to see the major European nations field strong teams for the U21 championships, whilst these same European nations, plus Brazil, Argentina, and even some African nations, pay great attention to the U17 and U20 World Cup tournaments. It's a case of them building up a mental resistance as well as developing an unwavering belief in their ability. There has been a recent change to this trend, with England having acheived success in the U17 and U20 World Cups, and it is the establishment of a winning mentality in the younger age groups that will be crucial to future success at the senior level.

Completely agree with this - while this tournament might come a bit too soon, England have the second youngest squad in the Euros and as more and more of those younger players who have experienced winning at age group level come through into the senior side, we're likely to be contenders for some years to come. Whether we can actually get over the line and win something might be a different matter, because teams like France are in an even stronger position in terms of depth of talent!

[mr.bluesky]

But the thing is Scotland's population is just under 5.5 Million so realistically how competitive can they expect to be  Counter that with England's population at almost 68 Million and really we should be there or there about, I mean London has more people than Scotland at 9.3 Million

A fair point. If going by a country's population as to the talent pool available to pick from then China should be the greatest football nation in the world  I remember back in the 60's , 70's and 80's Scotland had most of their players playing in the top division of England and those that weren't played for Celtic or Rangers. How many today play in the Premier league or play for Celtic and Rangers compared to then  . Scotland may only have a population of 5.5 million but how many are there living in this country or have sons of Scottish heritage  Not sure if this is still the case but didn't Scottish league  teams have to have a certain number of Scottish under 23 players named in their match day squads to give their players more experience. Having said that England's record in the Euros is pretty dismal. Even Greece has won it more times than we have  and as much as I like to think that this tournament will be our year it will probably end in the usual disappointment. 

[ulstersubbie]

I remember back in the 60's , 70's and 80's Scotland had most of their players playing in the top division of England and those that weren't played for Celtic or Rangers. How many today play in the Premier league or play for Celtic and Rangers compared to then 

Fair point, but even we had better footballers we still achieved nothing at world cups. I think it's psychological now, there is no belief that we will progress, this is the reality.

[Blackpool Rock]

Fair point, but even we had better footballers we still achieved nothing at world cups. I think it's psychological now, there is no belief that we will progress, this is the reality.

But the reality is that even when you did have belief Scotland still didn't progress 
Think i'm right in saying that Scotland have never got out of the group stage in either the Euros or the WC 

[mr.bluesky]

But the reality is that even when you did have belief Scotland still didn't progress 
Think i'm right in saying that Scotland have never got out of the group stage in either the Euros or the WC 

Yes I think you're right. They have never got out the group stage. Pretty sure in one of the past world cups they didn't loose a game in the group stage but failed to qualify on goal difference or goals scored

[Blackpool Rock]

Well this afternoons England starting line up bears no resemblance to the team that will start against Croatia, so as i've previously posted what's the fucking point of having a couple of warm up games   

[Blackpool Rock]

Southgate is a prick. Grealish and Eze should have been in his squads at least 18 months ago but due to playing in Championship they don't get a look in. Ivan Toney should be ahead of clapped out misfiring likes of Rashford/Greenwood too - he should be in the squad today due to his stellar season in Championship. I guarantee you Toney will be in next England squad in a few months even though he'll be exactly the same player as he is today. This crappy attitude of ignoring talent under his nose in EFL is causing unnecessary problems.

Never mind Rashford being dropped from the squad he's tonight's captain 

Gordon Bennett he cries   

[JontyR]

I know what you mean, and from a fans perspective it does look pointless. Players though love to play. A constant training camp without games can become very grim - especially with the press looking at battering them if they did step outside of any bubble restrictions.  Especially if you may not actually get much of a look in in the tournament unless injuries and suspensions come in. This game could be beneficial for someone who we may need in 3 weeks time.

[mr.bluesky]

Why are England wearing their blue away kit when they are the home team.  a ploy by the kit makers to sell more shirts

[Matrix]

Yes I think you're right. They have never got out the group stage. Pretty sure in one of the past world cups they didn't loose a game in the group stage but failed to qualify on goal difference or goals scored

74.

First team to be undefeated and not win the trophy.

[WARSZAWA16]

Godfrey joins Walker (Kyle), Pike (Thelwell), Jones (Phil), Wilson (Charles Plumpton) and Fraser (Forster) among Dad's Army characters to win an England cap. Only Mainwaring to go.

[martini2429]

Why are England wearing their blue away kit when they are the home team.  a ploy by the kit makers to sell more shirts

Yes

 

[Rick2468]

I'm really not feeling excited about the upcoming Euros. I can't seem to warm to the players and Southgate doesn't half give the most boring and straight laced interviews despite being a legend. I got so bored of the match yesterday I stopped 5 minutes into the second half and went for a stroll. I'm hoping a couple of good performances will stir my interest and I will get into it like I did at the 2018 WC.

Does anyone listen to the Quickly Kevin podcast? It has Josh Widdicombe and a couple of other guys and they talk about 90s football. I really enjoy it and I got an email that they were broadcasting a live watch of the game yesterday. Sounded like it could have been interesting.

[Blackpool Rock]

Well this afternoons England starting line up bears no resemblance to the team that will start against Croatia, so as i've previously posted what's the fucking point of having a couple of warm up games   

What was it something like 9 changes and OK we did hit the woodwork a couple of times but a 1-0 win over a struggling Romanian side that hasn't qualified for the Euros and I believe almost certainly won't qualify for the 22 WC either.

Even then our only goal came from a fucking penalty, piss poor performance and I only hope to god we are vastly better when the big guns are back, I know on the other thread I was slated for saying I thought Kane was over rated but we needed him yesterday though I understand why he didn't play either of the last 2 games

[The Film Director]

I got so bored of the match yesterday

Ditto .... England and cricket. 

[JontyR]

Why are England wearing their blue away kit when they are the home team.  a ploy by the kit makers to sell more shirts

Was walking behind some chap this morning wearing one, I don't know if it was a market knock off but it looked really cheap and nasty.

[mr.bluesky]

Was walking behind some chap this morning wearing one, I don't know if it was a market knock off but it looked really cheap and nasty.

I think most modern football shirts look cheap and nasty. Even England's Rugby Union shirts are now supplied by Umbro. They look just like a cheap football shirt 

[mr.bluesky]

What was it something like 9 changes and OK we did hit the woodwork a couple of times but a 1-0 win over a struggling Romanian side that hasn't qualified for the Euros and I believe almost certainly won't qualify for the 22 WC either.

Even then our only goal came from a fucking penalty, piss poor performance and I only hope to god we are vastly better when the big guns are back, I know on the other thread I was slated for saying I thought Kane was over rated but we needed him yesterday though I understand why he didn't play either of the last 2 games

As long as they don't let Jordan Henderson take any penalties  I think on recent performances we are going to need to " up" our game quite considerably to beat Croatia on Sunday.

[WARSZAWA16]

Sorry, but I have never really "got" this whole replica shirt thing. As one of my mates said - "I don't walk around dressed up as a fireman, so why would I want to walk around dressed up as a footballer"..........

[chrishornx]

Sorry, but I have never really "got" this whole replica shirt thing. As one of my mates said - "I don't walk around dressed up as a fireman, so why would I want to walk around dressed up as a footballer"..........

totally agree

[mr.bluesky]

Sorry, but I have never really "got" this whole replica shirt thing. As one of my mates said - "I don't walk around dressed up as a fireman, so why would I want to walk around dressed up as a footballer"..........

Especially as clubs bring out new shirts every season without fail at £60 / £70 they ain't cheap. Perhaps I should walk round dressed as a fireman. They say women are attracted to a man in uniform. It might improve my pulling chances   

[smiths]

I will watch the England games, the first 1 on BBC1 which is infinitely better for me than ITV with its incessant adverts. But I never like the disruption to the TV schedule all the other games cause. Good luck to England.

[Blackpool Rock]

As long as they don't let Jordan Henderson take any penalties  I think on recent performances we are going to need to " up" our game quite considerably to beat Croatia on Sunday.

Yeah well the commentator said that someone else had picked the ball up to take the penalty but Henderson took it off him and decided to take the penalty himself, presumably he pulled rank as he was Captain after Gashford was subbed.

Then the commentator came out with a statistic along the lines of Jordan Henderson is 1 of only 6 (I think) England outfield players to have more than 50 caps and to have never scored for England.

I just looked at the TV and exclaimed "He's going to fucking miss"  And a few seconds later the commentator added "And he still hasn't" 

[ulstersubbie]

Look lads, England will win the group without having to play especially well. They are playing poor teams (my lot being a prime example). England very rarely fail to make it out of the group stage (88 was the last time I think).

[The0neAnd0nly]

Look lads, England will win the group without having to play especially well. They are playing poor teams (my lot being a prime example). England very rarely fail to make it out of the group stage (88 was the last time I think).

I think Euro 2000 when Phil Neville fouled a Romanian and we were eliminated?

[Blackpool Rock]

I think Euro 2000 when Phil Neville fouled a Romanian and we were eliminated?

Yeah 2000 for the Euros, in fact our record is awful in that competition, got 3rd in 96 when we hosted but went out at the group stage in the 3 previous competitions that we qualified for 
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Brazil 2014 World cup we went out at the group stage so even worse than the shite we were in South Africa 2010 when we at least made it to the last 16
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[The0neAnd0nly]

I remember every England debacle since Euro 96 all the heartbreak and penalty misses. In 2018 I had absolutely 0 hopes so thoroughly enjoyed our run to the Semis which included a penalty shoot out win that I was certain we were going to lose (ever when Dier-bolical stepped up.) To lose to a average Croatia said it all really and of course we lost to Belgium twice so we were lucky to get that far but you do need luck.

I do understand the pessimism especially amongst our older peers. If you've lived through Mexico 86 and Italia 90 even more reason to think we are the most under performing "big" nation ever.

I think a Final by hook or crook is the bare minimum now really. Yes luck plays a part to a extent but we have to make progress at some point and really with the players we've got it's only France and Portugal that rivals our squad.
If we dont even get to the final for whatever reason (VAR, injuries, red cards, goal line technology, alien invasion whatever) then we have to assume 1966 will remain our only triumph for at least another 60 years.

[mr.bluesky]

Look lads, England will win the group without having to play especially well. They are playing poor teams (my lot being a prime example). England very rarely fail to make it out of the group stage (88 was the last time I think).

I hope you leave our goalposts intact this time when you leave Wembley.   Scotland will be "up for it" as they always are when they play the auld enemy so an England win is not a home banker. I just hope we don't go into the last game with the Czech Republic needing a win 

[Blackpool Rock]

I remember every England debacle since Euro 96 all the heartbreak and penalty misses. In 2018 I had absolutely 0 hopes so thoroughly enjoyed our run to the Semis which included a penalty shoot out win that I was certain we were going to lose (ever when Dier-bolical stepped up.) To lose to a average Croatia said it all really and of course we lost to Belgium twice so we were lucky to get that far but you do need luck.

I do understand the pessimism especially amongst our older peers. If you've lived through Mexico 86 and Italia 90 even more reason to think we are the most under performing "big" nation ever.

I think a Final by hook or crook is the bare minimum now really. Yes luck plays a part to a extent but we have to make progress at some point and really with the players we've got it's only France and Portugal that rivals our squad.
If we dont even get to the final for whatever reason (VAR, injuries, red cards, goal line technology, alien invasion whatever) then we have to assume 1966 will remain our only triumph for at least another 60 years.

Yeah I think reality had seen off the optimism for me by about 2006 or 2008

There have been other sides who never really did anything but have come good in the last 20-30 years, i'm mainly thinking Spain and France who even back in 98 when they won the WC I always just though "Surely they aren't actually that good" but they did kick on and win the Euros 2 years later in 00

[ulstersubbie]

I hope you leave our goalposts intact this time when you leave Wembley.   Scotland will be "up for it" as they always are when they play the auld enemy so an England win is not a home banker.

Cheeky  your goalposts will remain intact this time round. England to win 3-0, we might pinch a goal if we're lucky!

[Gordon Bennett]

Sorry, but I have never really "got" this whole replica shirt thing. As one of my mates said - "I don't walk around dressed up as a fireman, so why would I want to walk around dressed up as a footballer"..........

I quite liked the reversible England one they bought out a couple of decades ago. It was full proper red 3 lions away and a navy blue shirt with a generic  "England" badge when worn inside-out. I bought one off ebay for £3 about 5 years back but never took to it cos it was too thick. I think £3 was about the right price.
I view footy shirts as something comfy to loaf about in or go jogging in. I normally have a current(ish) home shirt for my club side in case we get to Wembley but that only happens every once in a blue moon. I feel its a bit ropey to go to Wembley in civvy clothing - should make some effort.

[ratedj]

Sorry, but I have never really "got" this whole replica shirt thing. As one of my mates said - "I don't walk around dressed up as a fireman, so why would I want to walk around dressed up as a footballer"..........

You'd be surprised at how fashionable kits, and retro kits in particular, have become.

[mr.bluesky]

You'd be surprised at how fashionable kits, and retro kits in particular, have become.

I have a couple of retro football shirts from Toffs ( The old fashion football shirt ) company which I prefer to wear mainly because they are made from cotton not from this horrible polyester material and don't have sponsors names plastered all over the front. The only England shirt I have is the red 1966 world cup retro shirt with no. 6 on the back

[Blackpool Rock]

You'd be surprised at how fashionable kits, and retro kits in particular, have become.

Yeah I quite like some of the retro shirts, still got an England shirt from around 99/00 with the polo neck which i still think looks a good shirt, not worn it for years as unfortunately it's a bit sweat stained from the gym, big problem that and why I don't buy white sports kit anymore 

It's really as if wearing a shirt that's a few years out of date can be seen as a bit shit however hang onto it for 20 years and it's a talking point and seen as a bit cool.
I've been in Tesco / Sainsbury before just after England's exit from a competition and all the stuff like flags and mugs etc are reduced, got a big flag for 20p once which they wanted £5 for a week earlier.
I did think at the time for an entrepreneur who had a small shop or even someone who sold shit on car boot sales they could buy a shit load of this discounted stuff and hang onto it for a couple of years then make a really good mark up on it 

Not sure if some of this stuff is new but some of the really expensive shirts do say they have been worn by players, big money some of these
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[Gordon Bennett]

I just had a proper look at my Euros wallchart that came in one of the papers over the weekend. Fucking hell its complicated with some perverse routes into quarterfinals.
Basically, only EIGHT teams are getting dropped from the group stages.

If England win their group they play 2nd team in group F: France Portugal Germany Hungary

If England 2nd in group they play 2nd team in group E: Sweden Poland Slovakia Spain

If England 3rd..... I can't make head nor tail of my chart but it seems like we'd play a winner of one of the other groups

My general impression is that finishing second in the group is hugely advantageous and finishing first or third will probably result in getting spanked in first knock out round.

All moot as I don't see us winning any of the group games.

[webpunter]

Wallchart - quality.  Is it on the wall ?  Somewhere prominent i hope !
A stringent elimination process with eight teams being dropped 

I just had a proper look at my Euros wallchart that came in one of the papers over the weekend. Fucking hell its complicated with some perverse routes into quarterfinals.
Basically, only EIGHT teams are getting dropped from the group stages.

If England win their group they play 2nd team in group F: France Portugal Germany Hungary

If England 2nd in group they play 2nd team in group E: Sweden Poland Slovakia Spain

If England 3rd..... I can't make head nor tail of my chart but it seems like we'd play a winner of one of the other groups

My general impression is that finishing second in the group is hugely advantageous and finishing first or third will probably result in getting spanked in first knock out round.

All moot as I don't see us winning any of the group games.

[paper7]

Well this afternoons England starting line up bears no resemblance to the team that will start against Croatia, so as i've previously posted what's the fucking point of having a couple of warm up games   

None whatsoever.  They were scheduled to taken money from football fans, as always.

[Blackpool Rock]

I just had a proper look at my Euros wallchart that came in one of the papers over the weekend. Fucking hell its complicated with some perverse routes into quarterfinals.
Basically, only EIGHT teams are getting dropped from the group stages.

If England win their group they play 2nd team in group F: France Portugal Germany Hungary

If England 2nd in group they play 2nd team in group E: Sweden Poland Slovakia Spain

If England 3rd..... I can't make head nor tail of my chart but it seems like we'd play a winner of one of the other groups

My general impression is that finishing second in the group is hugely advantageous and finishing first or third will probably result in getting spanked in first knock out round.

All moot as I don't see us winning any of the group games.

Yeah we don't want to be coming up against a team from the group F "Group of death", obviously that's unless Spain finish 2nd in group E 

So now we enter all the press conferences and interviews where people point out to Southgate that we would perhaps be better off finishing 2nd in the group and him sitting there saying we are aiming to win every game and the group 

Imagine if he went off script and said we will aim to win the 1st 2 games then throw the 3rd 

[Blackpool Rock]

Wallchart - quality.  Is it on the wall ?  Somewhere prominent i hope !
A stringent elimination process with eight teams being dropped 

Yeah with 4 of the 6 3rd place teams still going through to the next round Scotland may actually make history and get out of the group stage for the 1st time ever 

[mr.bluesky]

Wallchart - quality.  Is it on the wall ?  Somewhere prominent i hope !
A stringent elimination process with eight teams being dropped 

It's crazy having 24 teams and only 8 teams eliminated from the group stages. You could win only 1 game and loose the other 2 and still make it through to the knockout stage. Ridiculous  why not have it as a 16 team tournament like the past and the top 2 qualifying from each group. The  world cup to be staged in the USA, Canada and Mexico will also be bigger with 48 teams in it.

[Blackpool Rock]

It's crazy having 24 teams and only 8 teams eliminated from the group stages. You could win only 1 game and loose the other 2 and still make it through to the knockout stage. Ridiculous  why not have it as a 16 team tournament like the past and the top 2 qualifying from each group. The  world cup to be staged in the USA, Canada and Mexico will also be bigger with 48 teams in it.

I think the plan was to expand it so that more countries who wouldn't normally qualify could have fans actually go and watch their teams in the finals of a competition........................ 

I'm sure it has nothing to do with more games and more TV revenue 

[mr.bluesky]

I think the plan was to expand it so that more countries who wouldn't normally qualify could have fans actually go and watch their teams in the finals of a competition........................ 

I'm sure it has nothing to do with more games and more TV revenue 

No heaven forbid. I bet making more money from the competition was the last thing on their mind 

[JontyR]

It's crazy having 24 teams and only 8 teams eliminated from the group stages. You could win only 1 game and loose the other 2 and still make it through to the knockout stage. Ridiculous  why not have it as a 16 team tournament like the past and the top 2 qualifying from each group. The  world cup to be staged in the USA, Canada and Mexico will also be bigger with 48 teams in it.

They had this system in the world cups in 1986 & 1990. In 1986 two teams progressed that had drawn two and lost one of their 3 games.

[CoolTiger]

I just had a proper look at my Euros wallchart that came in one of the papers over the weekend. Fucking hell its complicated with some perverse routes into quarterfinals.

Wallchart - quality.  Is it on the wall ?  Somewhere prominent i hope !
A stringent elimination process with eight teams being dropped 

For those still without a wall chart, BBC has prepared one for this tournament that you can print off.
It has been modified to accommodate each of the home nations taking part.

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[mr.bluesky]

On Itv tonight at 11:40 England v Netherlands from Euro 96. Apart from the 1966 final probably England's finest performance in the finals of a major tournament 

[mh]

I just had a proper look at my Euros wallchart that came in one of the papers over the weekend. Fucking hell its complicated with some perverse routes into quarterfinals.
Basically, only EIGHT teams are getting dropped from the group stages.

Well yes getting from 24 at the group stage to 16 for a knockout stage so lose 8 teams when there are 6 groups isn't a straight "n from each group qualify".

World Cup 1982 had 24 teams and 'solved' this with a second group stage before the Semis but that's cumbersome. Also with groups of 3 and only 2 matches for each team at that stage there's a higher chance of equal records in a group for 2 teams leading to drawing of lots. They only did this for one year it seems - in the next tournament with 24 teams they used a scheme like this year's Euros.