Author Topic: Off Topic was bought back because of lack of punting. Whats your views  (Read 41989 times)

Offline Head1

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Off-Topic was bought back because of a lack of punting.
Should Off-Topic stay or go or be further restricted topic wise or have no restrictions at all?

Offline tesla

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I would vote stay but with restrictions, however I realise that would be hard to police, in which case probably better if it went when reviews start to come in again.

Offline David1970

I would keep it with the restrictions on racism and religion but bin it once punting takes off again, when ever that will be.

Offline AnthG

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oldadmin used to have it where you needed to make a certain number of posts before you could even see the offtopic board. This was the best time for offtopic in my opinion.

So if a person needed at least 1000 posts on the regular forum to see it. This would mean less arguments would develop.
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Offline Beamer

I would vote stay but with restrictions, however I realise that would be hard to police, in which case probably better if it went when reviews start to come in again.

IMO, the current Off-Topic has become dominated by a minority with typically minority or often extreme views. This does not sit well with  the UKP reputation of being the best punters website.
As soon as punting and reviews are back in volume in my opinion Off-Topic should either go completely, or be limited to only approved topics.
I know this may be argued that this adds to our Moderators workload but if topics were approved before going public maybe the mods would not have to check individual posts so much?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 07:58:27 pm by Beamer »

Offline Payyourwaymate

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Off topic has provided an outlet to those who would have otherwise been completely isolated from any sort of normal social interaction in these times. Although it has lead to some odd threads, I think it should stay till everything is back to as close to normal as it can get. Otherwise, I reckon non-punting related topics will just seep into threads that are only punting related, like when every thread was derailed into a COVID-19 discussion when this all started to get out of hand back in feb-march times.  I think the off topic thread should be ok with the restrictions put in place.

Offline Kev40ish

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I personally think anyone who doesn’t like off topics have a really easy option..

Don’t read or post on it...

When Old Admin has it he had a lot more Mods who could freeze accounts and hide posts. This meant it was easier to police. Obviously this was needed as there were new members joining.

I suppose it depends on how much effort you and your Mods want to put in policing it.

Offline ulstersubbie

I would vote stay but with restrictions, however I realise that would be hard to police, in which case probably better if it went when reviews start to come in again.

+1

Online daviemac

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I personally think anyone who doesn’t like off topics have a really easy option..

Don’t read or post on it...

When Old Admin has it he had a lot more Mods who could freeze accounts and hide posts. This meant it was easier to police. Obviously this was needed as there were new members joining.

I suppose it depends on how much effort you and your Mods want to put in policing it.
They were forum helpers that OldAdmin had. He had to remove the extra powers he gave them and put it back to what it is now.   :hi: 

Offline winkywanky

Off-Topic was bought back because of a lack of punting.
Should Off-Topic stay or go or be further restricted topic wise or have no restrictions at all?


For me personally, I was very happy at the return of Off-Topic. I liked having it before the current situation anyway, and I hope it will stay after punting normality resumes.

Easy for me to say of course, because I don't have to Mod the bloody thing  :rolleyes:.

Joking aside though, I do feel it's an asset to the site. I also feel that if you're going to have Off-Topic, it should be without restriction of topics discussed.

So, keeping it civil...difficult one. The quality of Modding I do feel is excellent here. It's about as even-handed as it can be. Regarding sanctions for breaking the rules, perhaps a tiered system of punishments, ending with permanent ban if offending is persistent?

Perhaps as a rough idea:

One verbal warning per 7-day period allowed.

Break that, and a 3-day ban. Then it resets to 'zero'.

Two 3-day bans in any 14-day period results in a 7-day ban. Then it resets to zero.

Three bans of any length within a 30-day period and a permanent ban ensues.

Serious infractions result in an immediate permanent ban.

That's maybe a bit complicated, but in essence, some kind of tiered system?

Is it possible to build a system into the software so to speak, to make it easier to enforce, and even to make it transparent?

(These are the ramblings of someone who knows shit about IT, as if that wasn't already apparent).

Online scutty brown

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oldadmin used to have it where you needed to make a certain number of posts before you could even see the offtopic board. This was the best time for offtopic in my opinion.

So if a person needed at least 1000 posts on the regular forum to see it. This would mean less arguments would develop.
And that turned it into an old cronies club for bullies and extremists which he couldn't control. Thats why he deleted it.

My view is the forum is a happier and better place without it: the main contributors are disruptive influences who drag down the site and its reputation, and who seem to want to return to the chaos evident under Oldadmins reign

It should go, and the sooner the better

Online scutty brown

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They were forum helpers that OldAdmin had. He had to remove the extra powers he gave them and put it back to what it is now.   :hi:

some of the helpers got a little power crazy............

Online daviemac

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some of the helpers got a little power crazy............
Exactly.  I think overseeing the helpers got to be as bad as modding the site.

Offline AnthG

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And that turned it into an old cronies club for bullies and extremists which he couldn't control. Thats why he deleted it.

I never seen any bullying or extremist comments on there, ever. This place people generally act courteously to each other.
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Offline Kev40ish

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And that turned it into an old cronies club for bullies and extremists which he couldn't control. Thats why he deleted it.

My view is the forum is a happier and better place without it: the main contributors are disruptive influences who drag down the site and its reputation, and who seem to want to return to the chaos evident under Oldadmins reign

It should go, and the sooner the better

Says a person who has regularly posted in off topics.... That’s what I meant people too fucking stupid to ignore it..

Offline houseboot

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It has served a purpose for the last few months but most of it is the usual suspects posting the usual nonsense.

When life returns to normal, maybe I can avoid the temptation to have a look. I certainly wouldn't miss it if it wasn't there.

Online scutty brown

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They were forum helpers that OldAdmin had. He had to remove the extra powers he gave them and put it back to what it is now.   :hi:

some of the helpers got a little power crazy............

Offline Kev40ish

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some of the helpers got a little power crazy............

There were too many helpers..

Offline smiths

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IF the modding of Off-Topic is too much hassle bin it, if it isn't then I would like to see it stay.

I enjoy reading and maybe posting on non controversial topics mainly but I do find the constant right wing/left wing stuff extremely boring, but I can always not engage with it which is very easy to do.

O/T on here has always had some posters with strong or very strong political views, and other strong views on other subjects, and some people hold totally opposing views on those subjects and wish to post so. And some express their views in a very forthright manner.

Overall I do like a place where non punting subjects can be posted about but for me it wouldn't be the end of the world if it were deleted, I will support whatever decision you and your team make. :thumbsup:

Offline winkywanky

Says a person who has regularly posted in off topics.... That’s what I meant people too fucking stupid to ignore it..

 :lol:

Offline Blackpool Rock

IMO, the current Off-Topic has become dominated by a minority with typically minority or often extreme views. This does not sit well with  the UKP reputation of being the best punters website.
As soon as punting and reviews are back in volume in my opinion Off-Topic should either go completely, or be limited to only approved topics.
I know this may be argued that this adds to our Moderators workload but if topics were approved before going public maybe the mods would not have to check individual posts so much?
I'd agree with this, just look at the number of deleted "Controversial" threads every day that were all being started by the same handful of posters and the other threads that were hijacked.

Off topic itself isn't the problem but the toxicity of some posts is, I have previously stated that I was glad OT was removed as it had become a cesspit which created conflict however when it came back everything was fine until a few weeks ago when there was a marked increase in discord.

I'd like to see OT stay now even with all subjects open for discussion IF people could discuss them sensibly however that's probably wishful thinking.
Alternatively perhaps those who can't refrain from posting racism etc should be banned from OT then the rest can have a proper exchange of views

Another observation is that some who rock the boat most don't appear to have added anything positive in terms of reviews; comments; punting advise etc for years so apart from stirring up OT i'm not sure why they are here now 

Online Chorley

When Admin mooted a comeback I rather flippantly suggested that it'd be the same as last time............ and it pretty much has been.  :rolleyes:
I think it was quite predictable that any subjects pertaining to race, religion and politics would be contentious and I think it was starting to become a bit if a nightmare to moderate the topics.
I decided to step back from these debates and concentrate on the more lighthearted OT threads instead, which were much more enjoyable.   :thumbsup: Maybe we could keep these threads?  :unknown:

Offline Head1

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Feel free to actually vote as well. It is anonymous  :lol:

Offline Kev40ish

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Feel free to actually vote as well. It is anonymous  :lol:

And anyone who votes to get rid of of it can have their access to it revoked  :lol: :lol: simple...

Offline winkywanky

Instant democracy, like it  :thumbsup:  :D

Offline AnthG

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Crazy off the wall idea. Don't know how workable it would be though, but, have one offtopic for lefties, and one off-topic for cool people.

No arguments will occur ever. Nobody will ever get offended as everyone will be with similar thinking people?
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Offline Beamer

Crazy off the wall idea. Don't know how workable it would be though, but, have one offtopic for lefties, and one off-topic for cool people.

No arguments will occur ever. Nobody will ever get offended as everyone will be with similar thinking people?

Ridiculous idea. Assume this is supposed to be a bit of a joke??

Who decides who is a leftie and who is cool?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 09:39:40 pm by Beamer »

Offline AnthG

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Who decides who is a leftie and who is cool?

The person, simple request for which one you get access to.

It would instantaneously remove all work for the mods. As nobody would argue or get offended. It's an outside the box thinking idea.
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Online 90125

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As it was my idea to bring back the Off Topic Board here is my take.

With no FR's being made Forum activity would have started to dry up and we would have had a constant battle moderating threads not related to Punting or members pushing their luck. When punting returns there shouldn't be a need for it and the focus of the Forum should be on FR's. Aren't there plenty of other social media platforms to discus the price of fish.

Further, do we really need members whose only contribution is in the Off Topic Board.

Online Chorley

As it was my idea to bring back the Off Topic Board here is my take.

With no FR's being made Forum activity would have started to dry up and we would have had a constant battle moderating threads not related to Punting or members pushing their luck. When punting returns there shouldn't be a need for it and the focus of the Forum should be on FR's. Aren't there plenty of other social media platforms to discus the price of fish.

Further, do we really need members whose only contribution is in the Off Topic Board.
This  :thumbsup:

Offline Kev40ish

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As it was my idea to bring back the Off Topic Board here is my take.

With no FR's being made Forum activity would have started to dry up and we would have had a constant battle moderating threads not related to Punting or members pushing their luck. When punting returns there shouldn't be a need for it and the focus of the Forum should be on FR's. Aren't there plenty of other social media platforms to discus the price of fish.

Further, do we really need members whose only contribution is in the Off Topic Board.

Lucky it’s Head1 who has the final decision, it appears you’ve already decided..
Your access to it is revoked 😂
If we are not going to get new members I don’t really think we want to get rid of many more  :unknown:

Even if people aren’t actively punting at the moment it would be a shame to lose that wealth of past experience..
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:04:10 pm by Kev40ish »

Offline Beamer

As it was my idea to bring back the Off Topic Board here is my take.

With no FR's being made Forum activity would have started to dry up and we would have had a constant battle moderating threads not related to Punting or members pushing their luck. When punting returns there shouldn't be a need for it and the focus of the Forum should be on FR's. Aren't there plenty of other social media platforms to discus the price of fish.

Further, do we really need members whose only contribution is in the Off Topic Board.

Bullseye!
You have a great product based primarily around reviews. Add the SP information and discussion threads and UKP is clearly in the dominant market position.
Obviously, Coronavirus dictated that you needed Off-Topic. 
But it's not unique, any benefit is
being negated by a minority with extreme views and IMO living in a different world.
Once "punting is back" reviews will again be the leading vehicle for UKP.
Members who do not review do not offer any benefit to UKP.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:06:27 pm by Beamer »

Offline GingerNuts

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Even if people aren’t actively punting at the moment it would be a shame to lose that wealth of past experience..

Members who contribute to punting discussions will continue to do so or come back and do so. Those who've only resurfaced to post in off topic will disappear into the sunset again.

I say bin off topic and leave the forum to those who have been, and will continue, to contribute to its core purpose. There are numerous other forums where the off topic posters can air their "thoughts".
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:24:22 pm by GingerNuts »

Offline Kev40ish

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Members who contribute to punting discussions will continue to do so or come back and do so. Those who've only resurfaced to post in off topic will disappear into the sunset again.

Yes I do agree, however there is in reality only a couple of people like that to be honest.. so not really an issue.
Also anyone who has posted in off topics since it has been back is a bit hypocritical to say it should be banned...

Offline winkywanky

Crazy off the wall idea. Don't know how workable it would be though, but, have one offtopic for lefties, and one off-topic for cool people.

No arguments will occur ever. Nobody will ever get offended as everyone will be with similar thinking people?


FFS Anth, it's that type of attitude which fucks it up  :rolleyes:

Offline Kev40ish

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FFS Anth, it's that type of attitude which fucks it up  :rolleyes:

Tbh he is on my list to have his access revoked, if he continues in that vain.
I am sure Head1 is getting his list together as to who to allow access  :lol:

Only problem is we may need 90125 to sort this all out for us  :lol:
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:27:18 pm by Kev40ish »

Offline AnthG

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When I started punting there were about 8 different punting forums in existence. Every one of them has now fallen by the wayside into non-existence leaving only one. (I say one, but there may be others around that I have never heard of now)

In that entire time this forum had an off-topic section, with people posting boisterous opinions of current affairs. And it still became the biggest and then only forum with that there.

So it definitely hasn't hurt the forum, and I personally think its helped the forum. People generally like straight-talking no-nonsense, no sugarcoating type of people and will think those straight-talking people will give good advice on the world of punting too.

For me personally, i have really enjoyed Offtopic being back. I usually do not like to venture outside of the north-east section as I feel no need to given this is where I live and like chatting to the north-easters. But seeing all the old school posters coming back and posting has really been great and like old times.

A lot of people like off topic, its the rare few who didn't. If its set so you have to ask for access, those people can never even know it exists.
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Offline AnthG

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FFS Anth, it's that type of attitude which fucks it up  :rolleyes:

Like Beamer said, it was said lightheartedly immediately after the revoking based on who votes lighthearted comment. Nobody seems to get my humour.

The post above ^ [Reply #36] was my genuine sincere response to this. So will leave it at that.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:30:21 pm by AnthG »
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Offline winkywanky

Like Beamer said, it was said lightheartedly immediately after the revoking based on who votes lighthearted comment. Nobody seems to get my humour.


Fair enough Anth.

But I'm sure you are well aware of the old adage, the few fuck it up for the many.

Offline Beamer

Yes I do agree, however there is in reality only a couple of people like that to be honest.. so not really an issue.
Also anyone who has posted in off topics since it has been back is a bit hypocritical to say it should be banned...

I have posted in Off-Topic and often in response to an extreme view that I do not agree with.
I have also created new, non-controversial topics in a small effort to move away from the more extreme topics.
I don't consider this to be hypocritical, but each to their own.

Offline GingerNuts

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Yes I do agree, however there is in reality only a couple of people like that to be honest.. so not really an issue.
Also anyone who has posted in off topics since it has been back is a bit hypocritical to say it should be banned...

Off topic was brought back as their would be little activity on the forum. As punting takes off again, and it seems to be doing in at least some areas, there's no need for it and it seems to do more harm than good for relations between the membership.

I've posted in off topic myself but have pretty much given it up as a bad job given the response of certain members. I don't think it's hypocritical to say you've tried it and found it wanting.

Offline winkywanky

I have posted in Off-Topic and often in response to an extreme view that I do not agree with.
I have also created new, non-controversial topics in a small effort to move away from the more extreme topics.
I don't consider this to be hypocritical, but each to their own.


I guess the acid test is, how many posts did your uncontroversial thread get, compared with the controversial ones?  :D

I'm only half-joking, if something's popular then by definition it's valuable IMO (within reason, but reason gets a bit stretched on a punting forum anyway).

I think it's been great having OT back but of course yes, it does get out of hand. It'd be a shame IMO, if a way couldn't be found to enable it to exist without people feeling they could simply be as offensive as they liked. If there's a way of achieving that then I think it's worth keeping.

My two pen'orth.

Offline Kev40ish

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I have posted in Off-Topic and often in response to an extreme view that I do not agree with.
I have also created new, non-controversial topics in a small effort to move away from the more extreme topics.
I don't consider this to be hypocritical, but each to their own.

So it’s the Moderation that is at fault. I’m my opinion anyone who tries to derail a thread should get their first warning and risk a ban... I do like lots of different topics to discuss, if people are constantly turning them into arguments, then the question is why are the Mods allowing them to do this..

It’s not nice having to warn / ban people but unfortunately it’s an important part of keeping a harmonious atmosphere

Offline Sparta Prada

First and foremost this is a punting forum. Appreciate that while there’s less punting going on the owners had to do something to keep traffic coming here.

Now punting appears to be returning, let’s mothball off topic.

Offline Dogfather

I'd vote remove.

Mods are volunteers (I presume) and it just adds to their plate.

With time created hopefully implement improvements to the site to limit poor punts and improve value for money. 

Offline Beamer

So it’s the Moderation that is at fault. I’m my opinion anytime who tries to derail a thread should get their first warning and risk a ban... I do like lots of different topics to discuss, if people are constantly turning them into arguments, then the question is why are the Mods allowing them to do this..

It’s not nice having to warn / ban people but unfortunately it’s an important part of keeping a harmonious atmosphere

Not sure I understand your "fault" comment. IMO, the mods always try to be fair and balanced.

Offline Kev40ish

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First and foremost this is a punting forum. Appreciate that while there’s less punting going on the owners had to do something to keep traffic coming here.

Now punting appears to be returning, let’s mothball off topic.

There hasn’t been any new member since old admin left, so not sure how it will continue until that is fixed...

Offline Sparta Prada

There hasn’t been any new member since old admin left, so not sure how it will continue until that is fixed...

Not sure how your reply relates to my post?
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 10:54:32 pm by Sparta Prada »

Offline Kev40ish

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Not sure I understand your "fault" comment. IMO, the mods always try to be fair and balanced.

I am not blaming the Mods.. they do a fantastic job at managing the site.
I am just questioning the guidance they are given, they steer the site and need to impose what is acceptable.

Like I said it’s not nice warning or banning people, but if that’s what it takes to set the tone of what is acceptable then that’s what should be happening. That would stop any extreme posts and allow off topics to be a valuable part of this forum.

Online daviemac

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When I started punting there were about 8 different punting forums in existence. Every one of them has now fallen by the wayside into non-existence leaving only one. (I say one, but there may be others around that I have never heard of now)

In that entire time this forum had an off-topic section, with people posting boisterous opinions of current affairs. And it still became the biggest and then only forum with that there.

So it definitely hasn't hurt the forum, and I personally think its helped the forum. People generally like straight-talking no-nonsense, no sugarcoating type of people and will think those straight-talking people will give good advice on the world of punting too.

For me personally, i have really enjoyed Offtopic being back. I usually do not like to venture outside of the north-east section as I feel no need to given this is where I live and like chatting to the north-easters. But seeing all the old school posters coming back and posting has really been great and like old times.

A lot of people like off topic, its the rare few who didn't. If its set so you have to ask for access, those people can never even know it exists.
You keep forgetting it was OldAdmin who binned off topic and for the very reasons this thread is necessary. The few with the extremist views, both left and right, are the ones who spoil it, they just can't help themselves.

Then you have the ones who think the rules don't apply to them and post whatever anyway.

I agreed with 90125's proposal to bring off topic back, though I had hoped it would be a place for like minded people to have a bit of light hearted craic about CV-19 or anything else not related to punting. Unfortunately it's gone down a similar road as the last one and turned into somewhat of a war zone.

Personally I would like to keep off topic, for now at least, though I would go with keeping religion, race and politics out of it. Those three subjects can never be agreed on, no matter what one person says it will not convince the other and the continued battles to do so are where the problems stem from.

I'm sure there are plenty of other places where such subjects could be discussed at will.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2020, 11:00:11 pm by daviemac »