Unemployment!

[Digby232]

A lot of punters probably in their 50’s are going to have to face the fact that they will probably not be able to punt for many months or even years thanks to Boris fucking it up and us all losing our jobs. A weeks universal credit won’t pay for an hour! Be honest not many in their late 50’s will work again or if they do it’s going to be part time on minimum wage. The outlook is bleak. Might as well have let the virus take its coarse and if it got you tough. Who wants to live in this new world of unemployed social distancing crap. The riots won’t spark a leap in infections so standing in a pub as normal wont. They now love the state run government they’ve made and don’t want the old normal! Refuse collectors etc can walk the streets everyday but the council can’t be bothered to open the office. Your at danger if you are with someone for 15 minutes for track and trace. Your going to kill someone walking past them in the street the next minute. You won’t get a job as a young aircraft engineer will get it before you. Yep the cure is worse than the illness. The majority at risk were on benefits / pensions etc anyway so could have isolated and let us have a life not just fuck up everyone’s life!

[NIK]

A lot of punters probably in their 50’s are going to have to face the fact that they will probably not be able to punt for many months or even years thanks to Boris fucking it up and us all losing our jobs. A weeks universal credit won’t pay for an hour! Be honest not many in their late 50’s will work again or if they do it’s going to be part time on minimum wage. The outlook is bleak. Might as well have let the virus take its coarse and if it got you tough. Who wants to live in this new world of unemployed social distancing crap. The riots won’t spark a leap in infections so standing in a pub as normal wont. They now love the state run government they’ve made and don’t want the old normal! Refuse collectors etc can walk the streets everyday but the council can’t be bothered to open the office. Your at danger if you are with someone for 15 minutes for track and trace. Your going to kill someone walking past them in the street the next minute. You won’t get a job as a young aircraft engineer will get it before you. Yep the cure is worse than the illness. The majority at risk were on benefits / pensions etc anyway so could have isolated and let us have a life not just fuck up everyone’s life!

Every word of this is so true. 
You should do the covid briefings.

[King Nuts]

IF, and it is an 'if', this turns out to be true: External Link/Members Only

...some explanations are going to be required.

[daviemac]

IF, and it is an 'if', this turns out to be true: External Link/Members Only

...some explanations are going to be required.

What's wrong with that link? I get a 'checking your browser' page.     No way am I hanging about on that sort of thing while it does whatever it's doing.

[King Nuts]

What's wrong with that link? I get a 'checking your browser' page.     No way am I hanging about on that sort of thing while it does whatever it's doing.

It's harmless. I don't know why it does that.

[WASA38]

What's wrong with that link? I get a 'checking your browser' page.     No way am I hanging about on that sort of thing while it does whatever it's doing.

KEEP CALM. Took me ca 5 seconds.

[daviemac]

It's harmless. I don't know why it does that.

Sorry but a page that wants to check my browser doesn't get opened by me. Especially when it comes from a link posted on the internet.

Edit

KEEP CALM. Took me ca 5 seconds.

You can click any link you like, I'm not and there's nothing for me to keep calm about.

[King Nuts]

What's wrong with that link? I get a 'checking your browser' page.     No way am I hanging about on that sort of thing while it does whatever it's doing.

I'm not remotely techie, but maybe it's optimising its pages for your browser.

I know it looks fine on my computer, and I've been visiting that website on and off for some time, and haven't noticed any ill effects.


(Well, apart from all the subliminal messages I keep getting about JFK and the Russians....)

[daviemac]

I'm not remotely techie, but maybe it's optimising its pages for your browser.

I know it looks fine on my computer, and I've been visiting that website on and off for some time, and haven't noticed any ill effects.


(Well, apart from all the subliminal messages I keep getting about JFK and the Russians....)

I don't care what it's trying to do, it isn't doing it on my computer. 

[King Nuts]

I don't care what it's trying to do, it isn't doing it on my computer.

OK, basically the essence is that Cov19 is far more widespread than was first thought, and that maybe 60 per cent of people have had it but did NOT develop antibodies and they didn't even know they had it.

Consquently the IFR (infection rate) is way lower, this thing is nothing like as infectious as was first thought.

And predictions for widespread infection were and are seriously wide of the mark.

[Strawberry]

I am not going their either, definitely did not like that checking page.

[Strawberry]

OK, basically the essence is that Cov19 is far more widespread than was first thought, and that maybe 60 per cent of people have had it but did NOT develop antibodies and they didn't even know they had it.

Consquently the IFR (infection rate) is way lower, this thing is nothing like as infectious as was first thought.

And predictions for widespread infection were and are seriously wide of the mark.

Such suggestion has been floating around for many months, and many people think they have had it already.

Based on absolutely nothing I think some have, I think some haven't.

[Doc Holliday]

I'm not remotely techie, but maybe it's optimising its pages for your browser.

Yes

Here is the link to the scientific paper quoted by the article. As usual OffGuardian have put its own slant on it which bears very little resemblance to the scientific paper.

External Link/Members Only

The more we learn about this virus the more puzzling it becomes. The range of outcomes when exposed to it are vast.

This study adds both to the knowledge and the confusion. Immunological mechanisms are complex and it seems the virus triggers quite different antibody responses per individual.

 "These antibody responses showed a strong correlation with disease duration, but they were independent of patient age, gender, and pre-existing comorbidities."

As with other studies the response appears to be related to the volume of virus you are exposed to and the length of time.

Also

"These data might be a reflection of increased mucosal immunity in the young or decreased mucosal immunity in the old. Along these lines, previous data on coronavirus seroprevalence of HKU1-specific IgG showed an absence of systemic HKU1-specific antibodies in individuals younger than 20 years of age, with increasing seroprevalence with increasing age.28 Extrapolating this model to comprise also children and infants, it is conceivable that children and infants have primed mucosal innate and IgA antibody responses due to their frequent upper respiratory tract infections and, therefore, respond preferentially in this manner to SARS-CoV-2 infection. This hypothesis might also explain why children rarely present with symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection."

In simple terms it may be possible that in some people, especially the young, previous recent exposure to other viruses (coronaviruses especially) may result in a better innate immune response and them clearing the virus rapidly from their bodies before a more severe secondary immune response kicks in. This means they will show few if any symptoms.

It remains unknown though what happens with any subsequent exposure.

"Whether these S protein-specific antibody responses confer immunity to a secondary infection with SARS-CoV-2 is a matter of intense debate."

[RLondon99]

I am not going their either, definitely did not like that checking page.

Man every single website checks your browser. They have to to work out what display grids to use. That message is just an excuse for a slow server.

[daviemac]

Man every single website checks your browser. They have to to work out what display grids to use. That message is just an excuse for a slow server.

Man, nothing you can say will convince me to open a web page I'm not happy with. I've clicked on Guardian web pages before and they haven't been slow.

 

[Strawberry]

Man, nothing you can say will convince me to open a web page I'm not happy with. I've clicked on Guardian web pages before and they haven't been slow.

It's not the Gruniad this seems a little strange.

[daviemac]

It's not the Gruniad this seems a little strange.

It may well be perfectly alright, I just don't need to read it so why should I take a chance. I'm always very wary of whatever links are posted online that I know nothing about.

[Doc Holliday]

Man, nothing you can say will convince me to open a web page I'm not happy with. I've clicked on Guardian web pages before and they haven't been slow.

Its not the Guardian it is OffGuardian. This news platform was setup by a group of disgruntled Guardian readers from around the world who allegedly were banned from the comments section of the Guardian.

External Link/Members Only

[Beamer]

It may well be perfectly alright, I just don't need to read it so why should I take a chance. I'm always very wary of whatever links are posted online that I know nothing about.

Apparently,  the number of "special Apps" is growing and some are a real problem. The other scams are emails purporting to be from BT and others. They normally have a nasty virus or way of getting personal information from your account. I have already had two from "BT" today.
As I am no IT expert I simply delete from phone, I Pad and PC. Haven't been caught yet but for friends who have it's a nightmare for them and any normal IT user.

[daviemac]

Its not the Guardian it is OffGuardian. This news platform was setup by a group of disgruntled Guardian readers from around the world who allegedly were banned from the comments section of the Guardian.

External Link/Members Only

All the more reason not to open it.   

Apparently,  the number of "special Apps" is growing and some are a real problem. The other scams are emails purporting to be from BT and others. They normally have a nasty virus or way of getting personal information from your account. I have already had two from "BT" today.
As I am no IT expert I simply delete from phone, I Pad and PC. Haven't been caught yet but for friends who have it's a nightmare for them and any normal IT user.

A few years ago I got one of those fake police ones that lock your computer and you have to send them money to unlock it. No chance of me doing that but it was a twat to get rid of, I had to take the HD out and connect it to another computer as a slave and run the anti virus software to get rid. All the hidden parts of it took some finding as well.

[Strawberry]

Its not the Guardian it is OffGuardian. This news platform was setup by a group of disgruntled Guardian readers from around the world who allegedly were banned from the comments section of the Guardian.

External Link/Members Only

The URL told me.

[Xtro]

I don't care what it's trying to do, it isn't doing it on my computer.

Type "What is Cloudflare" into a search engine dm. That's what it is.

Example :-
Why is Cloudflare used?
Cloudflare is a free CDN type product that protects against threats such as SQL injection and identity theft. Cloudflare also improves site performance and speeds up loading times by using their multiple data centers that are located around the world. The Cloudflare network acts like a giant VPN.

What is Cloudflare and why is it on my computer?
CloudFlare is a CDN service that a website can use to store their data files and that includes some protection against attacks by visitors of the website.

What is the point of CloudFlare?
Cloudflare is one of the biggest networks operating on the Internet. People use Cloudflare services for the purposes of increasing the security and performance of their web sites and services.

Do I need CloudFlare protection?
Security and DDoS Protection
CDNs can help improve your site's security by protecting against DDoS attacks, data breaches, and malicious bots. When you consider that the majority of web traffic is served through CDNs, they really are the first line of defense against malicious attacks.

[daviemac]

Type "What is Cloudflare" into a search engine dm. That's what it is.

I don't need or want to read it so it makes no difference to me what it is. I won't even turn my adblocker off to read newspaper links posted here. If it doesn't open straight away I don't bother.

[king tarzan]

A this moment fuck everything and everyones else..
As long as you have your health and enough money for food on the table that is what counts..
Everything and everyone else is a worry for later on not now apart from the two extremely important things above.. simpletto

[winkywanky]

IF, and it is an 'if', this turns out to be true: External Link/Members Only

...some explanations are going to be required.

First of all may I say it's refeshing to see you reading The Grauniad KN   

Re: The 'explanations required', to be fair this is new research which has only just been released. So while it's a pisser that we didn't know this before, we didn't..er...know this before. One thing that is true and has been said all along of course, is that this is a new virus and we learn about it as we go along.

Hopefully it is true that many already have some in-built resistance, and a modified strategy can be worked out, taking this into account.

[winkywanky]

OK, basically the essence is that Cov19 is far more widespread than was first thought, and that maybe 60 per cent of people have had it but did NOT develop antibodies and they didn't even know they had it.

Consquently the IFR (infection rate) is way lower, this thing is nothing like as infectious as was first thought.

And predictions for widespread infection were and are seriously wide of the mark.

I don't think it's saying that, it's saying that previous Coronaviruses that we've all been exposed to before (like the common cold for example) may have imbued some people with a natural resistance to the Covid-19 virus (which is also a Coronavirus).

[winkywanky]

Its not the Guardian it is OffGuardian. This news platform was setup by a group of disgruntled Guardian readers from around the world who allegedly were banned from the comments section of the Guardian.

External Link/Members Only

Ooer, by the way, the warning signal that came up on my browser seemed to be trying to protect the site from DDOS attacks (that may be bollocks of course, and perhaps I now have a nasty infection)...Doc, HEEEEELP!!!!   

If it really is a bunch of disgruntled ex-Grauniadistas (I just made that word up  ) then perhaps the Grauniad are onto them and want to destroy them  .

[winkywanky]

A this moment fuck everything and everyones else..
As long as you have your health and enough money for food on the table that is what counts..
Everything and everyone else is a worry for later on not now apart from the two extremely important things above.. simpletto

Get the distilled water, canned goods and ammunition, and everyone down in the bunker, NOW!!!! 

[tesla]

Get the distilled water, canned goods and ammunition, and everyone down in the bunker, NOW!!!! 

bunker is occupied at the moment, some bloke called Donald has a block booking for inspection purposes..

[winkywanky]

He's the first one to shoot, every man for himself!!

[King Nuts]

First of all may I say it's refeshing to see you reading The Grauniad KN   

I log on to the Grauniad's website most days, as it happens.

Got to know what the enemy is thinking.

[winkywanky]

I log on to the Grauniad's website most days, as it happens.

Got to know what the enemy is thinking.

I was merely teasing you KN, it's good that you have varied sources  . If you've read The Guardian then it means you're well qualified to comment on it.

[King Nuts]

I was merely teasing you KN, it's good that you have varied sources  . If you've read The Guardian then it means you're well qualified to comment on it.

It's probably the best-designed newspaper website I've seen. Shame that both the comments and the news reporting is mainly such miserablist lefty cobblers. I mean, George Monbiot. Really? Miserable fucker he is. He won't be happy until we're all living in caves. Afua Hirsch? Spiteful, shit-stirring individual. Brought up in the 1 per cent, and indulged like no-one I know.

But the coverage of arts and travel is excellent.

[David1970]

It's probably the best-designed newspaper website I've seen. Shame that both the comments and the news reporting is mainly such miserablist lefty cobblers. I mean, George Monbiot. Really? Miserable fucker he is. He won't be happy until we're all living in caves. Afua Hirsch? Spiteful, shit-stirring individual. Brought up in the 1 per cent, and indulged like no-one I know.

But the coverage of arts and travel is excellent.

Thanks for the unbiased review Nuts, I would be interested in you doing the same review for the Daily Mail.

[winkywanky]

It's probably the best-designed newspaper website I've seen. Shame that both the comments and the news reporting is mainly such miserablist lefty cobblers. I mean, George Monbiot. Really? Miserable fucker he is. He won't be happy until we're all living in caves. Afua Hirsch? Spiteful, shit-stirring individual. Brought up in the 1 per cent, and indulged like no-one I know.

But the coverage of arts and travel is excellent.

Worth the cover price alone then 

[pbrown355]

If you want real miserable negativity I recommend the Independent

[David1970]

If you want real miserable negativity I recommend the Independent

That was the first newspaper I bought regularly, gave up when Janet Street-Porter became editor of the Sunday edition. She changed it dramatically and not in a good way, her personal rag to moan about what she wanted, page after page about freedom to roam. Never read it since.

[king tarzan]

bunker is occupied at the moment, some bloke called Donald has a block booking for inspection purposes..

He is a roaring 🦁

[LLPunting]

I don't care what it's trying to do, it isn't doing it on my computer.

You really aren't a barebacker are you!     

[LLPunting]

He is a roaring 🦁

Pussy?

If you're been unable to find an appropriate emoticon for "cunt" all this time then a lot of your past posts take on a whole different light of tomfoolery.

[LLPunting]

Yes

Here is the link to the scientific paper quoted by the article. As usual OffGuardian have put its own slant on it which bears very little resemblance to the scientific paper.

External Link/Members Only

The more we learn about this virus the more puzzling it becomes. The range of outcomes when exposed to it are vast.

This study adds both to the knowledge and the confusion. Immunological mechanisms are complex and it seems the virus triggers quite different antibody responses per individual.

 "These antibody responses showed a strong correlation with disease duration, but they were independent of patient age, gender, and pre-existing comorbidities."

As with other studies the response appears to be related to the volume of virus you are exposed to and the length of time.

Also

"These data might be a reflection of increased mucosal immunity in the young or decreased mucosal immunity in the old. Along these lines, previous data on coronavirus seroprevalence of HKU1-specific IgG showed an absence of systemic HKU1-specific antibodies in individuals younger than 20 years of age, with increasing seroprevalence with increasing age.28 Extrapolating this model to comprise also children and infants, it is conceivable that children and infants have primed mucosal innate and IgA antibody responses due to their frequent upper respiratory tract infections and, therefore, respond preferentially in this manner to SARS-CoV-2 infection. This hypothesis might also explain why children rarely present with symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 infection."

In simple terms it may be possible that in some people, especially the young, previous recent exposure to other viruses (coronaviruses especially) may result in a better innate immune response and them clearing the virus rapidly from their bodies before a more severe secondary immune response kicks in. This means they will show few if any symptoms.

It remains unknown though what happens with any subsequent exposure.

"Whether these S protein-specific antibody responses confer immunity to a secondary infection with SARS-CoV-2 is a matter of intense debate."

Interesting, so if kids have a more vigorous primed immune response precisely because as foundlings they need to acquire as much immunity as they can to their environment in order to reach maturity they are better placed to adapt to novel infections.  And us adults in our stunted and declining biologies have less capacity to address these new threats, particularly with the complications of the other creeping damage and vulnerabilities we individually acquire due to lifestyle and genetics.

[Xtro]

Here is the link to the scientific paper quoted by the article. As usual OffGuardian have put its own slant on it which bears very little resemblance to the scientific paper.

External Link/Members Only

At the top of the study it reads "bioRxiv is receiving many new papers on coronavirus SARS-CoV-2.   A reminder: these are preliminary reports that have not been peer-reviewed. They should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or be reported in news media as established information."

Which means, "What is an unrefereed preprint?
Before formal publication in a scholarly journal, scientific and medical articles are traditionally “peer reviewed.” In this process, the journal’s editors take advice from various experts—called “referees”—who have assessed the paper and may identify weaknesses in its assumptions, methods, and conclusions. Typically a journal will only publish an article once the editors are satisfied that the authors have addressed referees’ concerns.
Because this process can be lengthy, authors use the bioRxiv service to make their manuscripts available as “preprints” before completing peer review and consequent certification by a journal. This allows other scientists to see, discuss, and comment on the findings immediately. Readers should therefore be aware that articles on bioRxiv have not been finalized by authors, might contain errors, and report information that has not yet been accepted or endorsed in any way by the scientific or medical community."  Source - External Link/Members Only

Doc, would I be right in saying that this paper could amount to nothing?   

[Doc Holliday]

At the top of the study it reads "bioRxiv is receiving many new papers on coronavirus SARS-CoV-2.   A reminder: these are preliminary reports that have not been peer-reviewed. They should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or be reported in news media as established information."


Doc, would I be right in saying that this paper could amount to nothing?   

Good spot I hadn't noticed it wasn't yet peer reviewed but TBH at the moment scientific studies are being released on an unseen scale and rapid rate and not peer reviewed it is almost become 'the new normal'.

It reads well to me but I'm not an immunologist that can peer review it 

[Doc Holliday]

Interesting, so if kids have a more vigorous primed immune response precisely because as foundlings they need to acquire as much immunity as they can to their environment in order to reach maturity they are better placed to adapt to novel infections.  And us adults in our stunted and declining biologies have less capacity to address these new threats, particularly with the complications of the other creeping damage and vulnerabilities we individually acquire due to lifestyle and genetics.

Yes you can imagine a youngster saying "bring it on" and knocking it for six at the first hurdle of your immune system (mucosal level) as against an old un like me saying "oh fuck this .. not another one .. I'm knackered can't be arsed ... open the door and let the bugger in"

[Xtro]

Yes you can imagine a youngster saying "bring it on" and knocking it for six at the first hurdle of your immune system (mucosal level) as against an old un like me saying "oh fuck this .. not another one .. I'm knackered can't be arsed ... open the door and let the bugger in"

I feel for you Doc....... #OldFartsMatter          

[winkywanky]

Yes you can imagine a youngster saying "bring it on" and knocking it for six at the first hurdle of your immune system (mucosal level) as against an old un like me saying "oh fuck this .. not another one .. I'm knackered can't be arsed ... open the door and let the bugger in"

Perhaps a potential treatment would be a drug which made the older immune system work like it was younger? In some way stimulated it to be so?

Isn't this the way some potential anti-cancer drugs are going now, enable the immune system to detect problems and deal with them early on at a cellular level?

[lostandfound]

IF, and it is an 'if', this turns out to be true: External Link/Members Only

...some explanations are going to be required.

Smacks of people selecting from a mass of conflicting data an item that supports their own entrenched point of view.

[scutty brown]

IF, and it is an 'if', this turns out to be true: External Link/Members Only

...some explanations are going to be required.

The report that off-guardian page refers to is here.
External Link/Members Only

thats a non-peer reviewed, non-repeated notice of preliminary findings which have not been confirmed.
Furthermore the off-guardian page misrepresents the findings: in short, totally fake news

[Metalgear2018]

Yes there will be mass unemployment. Look at BP making thousands of cuts to their job force. British Gas cutting thousands of senior management posts.

This is just the start of things. There is going to be cuts in social services too.

My advice is to learn a new skill that will help you earn a bit of money.

[Xtro]

My advice is to learn a new skill that will help you earn a bit of money.

Agreed.  Winkywanky and I are selling our arses. We're doing BOGOF at the moment.   

Now, where's ADF when you need him?