Electoral Commission

[King Nuts]

Arron Banks took legal action against the Electoral Commission last year, and has since seen it off.

The BBC frames the story like it's a draw: External Link/Members Only

Elsewhere, Order-Order sees this is a victory: External Link/Members Only

Either way, this is now two significant screw-ups from the EC. Going to the High Court for recourse is never cheap, but to tax-munching commissions and quangos like this, someone else always picks up the bill, so who cares.

[Colston36]

I wish someone could come up with a happy medium that enabled us to be free of Eurocrats but still allow all the Europeans who do the jobs nobody here will - like the Romanians being flown in to pick fruit. And I have to say my only experiences of those willing to entertain me have been entirely delightful.

[King Nuts]

I wish someone could come up with a happy medium that enabled us to be free of Eurocrats but still allow all the Europeans who do the jobs nobody here will - like the Romanians being flown in to pick fruit. And I have to say my only experiences of those willing to entertain me have been entirely delightful.

I think we had that before, when it was called the EEC. Free movement of goods, labour and capital, but sovereignty retained.

Had that been a third option on the ballot paper in 2016, I reckon Remain (in the EEC) would have trounced it.

[Doc Holliday]

I think we had that before, when it was called the EEC. Free movement of goods, labour and capital, but sovereignty retained.

Had that been a third option on the ballot paper in 2016, I reckon Remain (in the EEC) would have trounced it.

Highly likely but that middle ground EEC no longer existed as an entity in 2016. You would have still needed to leave the EU and then negotiate along the lines of that 'third option'. Some may argue that is where we are at?

[wylie anchor]

  Perfectly put Doc

[GreyDave]

I wish someone could come up with a happy medium that enabled us to be free of Eurocrats but still allow all the Europeans who do the jobs nobody here will - like the Romanians being flown in to pick fruit. And I have to say my only experiences of those willing to entertain me have been entirely delightful.

Sorry those jobs are not paid well enough for UK expensise the Roms get suckered in as the mimimum wage and the food accodation sounds great when you are sitting in a village in the woods in Romania,,,,they get here do a bit of picking get wise then go and shoplift just to get arrested and in the system away from gang master life in the Town I am in several times a week this was happening they were polite and well behaved as police take them off and process...next stop council help center....

When I was younger I did pea picking back breaking and not bad pay for a kid but an adult shite ..The other night I caught fellow Baldly loud mouth Greg Wallace on TV In side Factory  Pea Picking with 3 very high tec machine combine havester type ( one of you lads will know correct description ) Quite simply the sensible Farm business have invested in plant then there are others who still can not quite get there heads around farming is a business (sick of hearing its away of life so is being a shop worker or whore for that )
And they need to invest or get out you see this inevery busines but its always farming that makes excuses. The firm that employed me made cash out of me they never got a sub to employ me and even in covin time they have gotten rid of us ( as sub contractors selfemployed not able to get help ) I hope as I am sur others in same postion the firm will get back if not I will have to look around again for work something at 60 I did think I d  be doing

[winkywanky]

Arron Banks took legal action against the Electoral Commission last year, and has since seen it off.

The BBC frames the story like it's a draw: External Link/Members Only

Elsewhere, Order-Order sees this is a victory: External Link/Members Only

Either way, this is now two significant screw-ups from the EC. Going to the High Court for recourse is never cheap, but to tax-munching commissions and quangos like this, someone else always picks up the bill, so who cares.

The BBC sets out the facts and gives the opinions of both sides, without favour.

Euro Guido says Banks has 'won'.

You reckon the BBC 'calls it as a draw', in other words you're suggesting the BBC piece is misleading.

Well they haven't even called it a 'draw' have they?

And if you think Banks has 'won', why has he decided to 'settle' with the Electoral Commission, and not to pursue his action for defamation? Is it because despite being an astute businessman and knowing he's in the right and that he could win, he's decided to bury the hatchet in a magnanimous display of the pursuit of harmony? 

You like to think Banks has 'won' and you like to see that in print, so you link to the website with the agenda that agrees with your own.

[Beamer]

Always good to see the FACTS......
Posted: 29 April 2020
Joint announcement by The Electoral Commission, Mr Robert Posner, Mr Arron Banks and Ms Elizabeth Bilney
The Electoral Commission, its Chief Executive Mr Robert Posner, Mr Arron Banks and Ms Elizabeth Bilney wish to announce that they have agreed amicable terms of settlement of a complaint raised by Mr Banks and Ms Bilney over the Electoral Commission's announcement on 1 November 2018 of its referral of Mr Banks and Ms Bilney to the National Crime Agency for further investigation over possible electoral offences in connection with the UK's 2016 EU membership referendum.

The NCA stated publicly on 24 September 2019 that having investigated the matters referred by the Electoral Commission, it found that there was no evidence of any criminal offences having been committed by Mr Banks and Ms Bilney. In carrying out its complex investigation the NCA had analysed information, including banking information, which had not formed part of the Commission’s investigation. A copy of the statement can be found at External Link/Members Only (Opens in new window). The NCA further notified the Electoral Commission that its investigation showed that the monies Mr Banks used to fund the loans came from the group of companies of which Mr Banks was the ultimate beneficial owner.

Mr Banks and Ms Bilney consider that if the Electoral Commission had applied the law on the loans, the matter would never have been referred to the NCA. The Electoral Commission considers it was right to refer this matter to the NCA for further investigation, but confirms that it accepts (a) the NCA’s conclusions that it found no evidence that any criminal offences have been committed under PPERA or company law by Mr Banks or Ms Bilney; and (b) the NCA had not received any evidence to suggest that Mr Banks or his companies received funding from any third party to fund the loans, or that he acted as an agent on behalf of a third party.

The parties are pleased to have reached accommodation and to be able to put this matter behind them

[King Nuts]

The BBC sets out the facts and gives the opinions of both sides, without favour.

Euro Guido says Banks has 'won'.

You reckon the BBC 'calls it as a draw', in other words you're suggesting the BBC piece is misleading.

Well they haven't even called it a 'draw' have they?

And if you think Banks has 'won', why has he decided to 'settle' with the Electoral Commission, and not to pursue his action for defamation? Is it because despite being an astute businessman and knowing he's in the right and that he could win, he's decided to bury the hatchet in a magnanimous display of the pursuit of harmony? 

You like to think Banks has 'won' and you like to see that in print, so you link to the website with the agenda that agrees with your own.

You're jumping to conclusions. I didn't side with the BBC or Guido Fawkes. Just interested in the way the story unfolded.

More relevantly, I wonder why and how such an ill-fated notion of the EC having a go at Messrs Banks and Grimes ever got off the ground. I got involved in a civil case in the High Court years ago. It's eye-wateringly expensive just to file a claim. And then there's the barristers....

[winkywanky]

Apologies, I misread your intent  .

[hornyguylondon]

Always good to see the FACTS......
Posted: 29 April 2020
Joint announcement by The Electoral Commission, Mr Robert Posner, Mr Arron Banks and Ms Elizabeth Bilney
The Electoral Commission, its Chief Executive Mr Robert Posner, Mr Arron Banks and Ms Elizabeth Bilney wish to announce that they have agreed amicable terms of settlement of a complaint raised by Mr Banks and Ms Bilney over the Electoral Commission's announcement on 1 November 2018 of its referral of Mr Banks and Ms Bilney to the National Crime Agency for further investigation over possible electoral offences in connection with the UK's 2016 EU membership referendum.

The NCA stated publicly on 24 September 2019 that having investigated the matters referred by the Electoral Commission, it found that there was no evidence of any criminal offences having been committed by Mr Banks and Ms Bilney. In carrying out its complex investigation the NCA had analysed information, including banking information, which had not formed part of the Commission’s investigation. A copy of the statement can be found at External Link/Members Only (Opens in new window). The NCA further notified the Electoral Commission that its investigation showed that the monies Mr Banks used to fund the loans came from the group of companies of which Mr Banks was the ultimate beneficial owner.

Mr Banks and Ms Bilney consider that if the Electoral Commission had applied the law on the loans, the matter would never have been referred to the NCA. The Electoral Commission considers it was right to refer this matter to the NCA for further investigation, but confirms that it accepts (a) the NCA’s conclusions that it found no evidence that any criminal offences have been committed under PPERA or company law by Mr Banks or Ms Bilney; and (b) the NCA had not received any evidence to suggest that Mr Banks or his companies received funding from any third party to fund the loans, or that he acted as an agent on behalf of a third party.

The parties are pleased to have reached accommodation and to be able to put this matter behind them

Does that mean he'll receive compensation for false allegations ?

[winkywanky]

..

[Beamer]

Does that mean he'll receive compensation for false allegations ?

Sorry I don't know.  This was the whole press release as far as I know 

[King Nuts]

Does that mean he'll receive compensation for false allegations ?

I expect an order will be made or will have been made for costs and compensation. Neither party is under any obligation, I believe, to reveal the sums involved.

Unless some of the learned brethren here know any more on the subject?

[petermisc]

More relevantly, I wonder why and how such an ill-fated notion of the EC having a go at Messrs Banks and Grimes ever got off the ground. I got involved in a civil case in the High Court years ago. It's eye-wateringly expensive just to file a claim. And then there's the barristers....

It was Banks who took the matter to court, using his wealth to bankroll the action.  If Banks had been more cooperative with the EC in the first place, the EC might not have had to refer the matter to the NCA for further investigation.  It sounds like a somewhat pyrrhic victory to me.  Those who think Banks is an obnoxious twat who thinks his money means he can do whatever he likes are highly unlikely to be persuaded otherwise by this result.

[petermisc]

I expect an order will be made or will have been made for costs and compensation. Neither party is under any obligation, I believe, to reveal the sums involved.

I am sure that if significant costs or compensation had been awarded, certain individuals would have been trumpeting about it by now.

[King Nuts]

It was Banks who took the matter to court, using his wealth to bankroll the action.  If Banks had been more cooperative with the EC in the first place, the EC might not have had to refer the matter to the NCA for further investigation.  It sounds like a somewhat pyrrhic victory to me.  Those who think Banks is an obnoxious twat who thinks his money means he can do whatever he likes are highly unlikely to be persuaded otherwise by this result.

I don't know whether Banks is an 'obnoxious twat' or not, but that's neither here nor there. It's his money and he can do what he likes with it. I'm more interested in how something like this came about and how it was reported. As usual, too many people shouting 'twat' around the edges of a story, distorts the perception for the rest of us of what actually happened.

[King Nuts]

I am sure that if significant costs or compensation had been awarded, certain individuals would have been trumpeting about it by now.

Conversely, they may not. Those whom I have met who've been through expensive litigation are keen to put it behind them.

[Adoniron]

This is the Arron Banks who is such a patriot he fled to New Zealand at the start of the COVID-19 outbreak?

[petermisc]

I don't know whether Banks is an 'obnoxious twat' or not, but that's neither here nor there. It's his money and he can do what he likes with it. I'm more interested in how something like this came about and how it was reported. As usual, too many people shouting 'twat' around the edges of a story, distorts the perception for the rest of us of what actually happened.

Allegations were made, which the EC were duty-bound to investigate.  The EC found sufficient evidence to suggest that the rules could have been broken, but were being thwarted by Banks's lack of cooperation and political grandstanding, so passed it to the NCA for further investigation, as they have greater investigatory powers.  The NCA found that the rules had not been broken.  Banks took the EC to court for daring to have him investigated, as being a millionaire his actions should of course be above public scrutiny.

[petermisc]

I don't know whether Banks is an 'obnoxious twat' or not, but that's neither here nor there. It's his money and he can do what he likes with it.

Not when it comes to political campaigning.  The same rules apply to him as to anyone else.

[King Nuts]

Not when it comes to political campaigning.  The same rules apply to him as to anyone else.

Clearly they do indeed. And he was exonerated.

[King Nuts]

This is the Arron Banks who is such a patriot he fled to New Zealand at the start of the COVID-19 outbreak?

And luvvie Emma Thompson, having made such a noise about Britain being a dull grey island, or some such cobblers, when she relocated to Venice to remain in the warm embrace of the EU, moved to Scotland, apparently, when all the shit went down in Italy.

So what. I don't blame her any more than I would blame anyone else for electing to take advantage of their own freedom to go where the fuck they like.

[King Nuts]

Allegations were made, which the EC were duty-bound to investigate.  The EC found sufficient evidence to suggest that the rules could have been broken, but were being thwarted by Banks's lack of cooperation and political grandstanding, so passed it to the NCA for further investigation, as they have greater investigatory powers.  The NCA found that the rules had not been broken.  Banks took the EC to court for daring to have him investigated, as being a millionaire his actions should of course be above public scrutiny.

Allegations made by whom? I think it was Carole Codswallop, wasn't it?

And you say the EC suggested the rules 'could' have been broken. Hmm. But they weren't.

As regards Banks taking them to court for that reason, he had reasons to feel victmised. He wanted redress. It's what courts are for.


Seems to me the only reason people get pissed off with Mr Banks is that he's loaded and wants out of the EU. Classic British begrudgery. Again.

[dubs]

Classic SLAPP suit

[petermisc]

Allegations made by whom? I think it was Carole Codswallop, wasn't it?

And you say the EC suggested the rules 'could' have been broken. Hmm. But they weren't.

As regards Banks taking them to court for that reason, he had reasons to feel victmised. He wanted redress. It's what courts are for.


Seems to me the only reason people get pissed off with Mr Banks is that he's loaded and wants out of the EU. Classic British begrudgery. Again.

It doesn't matter who makes an allegation, if an allegation is made the EC is duty-bound to investigate it.

I didn't say the EC suggested that the rules had been broken, I said that they found sufficient evidence to suggest that the rules had been broken and therefore that the matter needed deeper investigation.  As Banks was being obstructive, they had to refer it to the NCA to do that.

What reasons had Banks to feel victimised?  Because the EC dared to question the source of his contributions?  That is their job.

It sounds like it was a technical victory.  I am sure that if there had been any redress, Banks would have been crowing about it by now.  Instead, he has been unusually quiet.  That in itself speaks volumes.

[petermisc]

And luvvie Emma Thompson, having made such a noise about Britain being a dull grey island, or some such cobblers, when she relocated to Venice to remain in the warm embrace of the EU, moved to Scotland, apparently, when all the shit went down in Italy.

My understanding is that she was already in Scotland, with her elderly parents, and decided to stay there rather than return to Italy.  Which in my view, is quite reasonable.  Would you deliberately go to a danger zone if you didn't have to?  I can also understand her wanting to move somewhere warm and sunny for her dotage, she wouldn't exactly be the first Brit to do that.  However, her moaning about cold, grey Britain while keeping her beloved holiday home in sunny Scotland does seem rather hypocritical.  But I wonder how much that statement has been blown out of context by the tabloid press?

[King Nuts]

My understanding is that she was already in Scotland, with her elderly parents, and decided to stay there rather than return to Italy.  Which in my view, is quite reasonable.  Would you deliberately go to a danger zone if you didn't have to?  I can also understand her wanting to move somewhere warm and sunny for her dotage, she wouldn't exactly be the first Brit to do that.  However, her moaning about cold, grey Britain while keeping her beloved holiday home in sunny Scotland does seem rather hypocritical.  But I wonder how much that statement has been blown out of context by the tabloid press?

I think it's entirely reasonable too. But I'm not the one grizzling about Arron Banks going to New Zealand or wherever it was.

[King Nuts]

It sounds like it was a technical victory.  I am sure that if there had been any redress, Banks would have been crowing about it by now.  Instead, he has been unusually quiet.  That in itself speaks volumes.

I've learned over many years not to take someone's silence as an assumption of anything.

[petermisc]

I've learned over many years not to take someone's silence as an assumption of anything.

He wasn't exactly backward in publicising the start of the case, though, was he?  Which makes his silence now, the more notable.