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Author Topic: She doesn't owe him sex  (Read 12831 times)

Offline Tailpipe

When it comes to withholding sex women know damn well that most men will mention it once or twice and get their heads bitten off and then will forget the subject all together so the women can happily carry on as they were.  If the men don't stop they bring up the old , oh you want me to have sex with you even though you know I wont enjoy it, knowing damn well that will be enough to stop men talking about it


I did not know you new me ex  :D :D :D :D :D Good post

Offline mh

When it comes to withholding sex women know damn well that most men will mention it once or twice and get their heads bitten off and then will forget the subject all together so the women can happily carry on as they were.  If the men don't stop they bring up the old , oh you want me to have sex with you even though you know I wont enjoy it, knowing damn well that will be enough to stop men talking about it
I did not know you new me ex  :D :D :D :D :D Good post

+1

Offline baltar


I love their argument that all sex you pay for is inherently rape by its very nature. All those gold digging girls marrying for money are being raped by definition because they don't "really" want to have sex with the man they just want his money

And you gotta love how this definition completely shits in the face of every real rape victim.

Btw a lot of you guys should look up Dr Helen Smiths book "Men On Strike".

Offline Knick

I'm never getting married. As I dont want kids that doesn't bother me, but I guess I've also gotten used to doing my own thing whenever I want all the time, and bachelorhood is habit forming.

I've kind of gone down the whole mgtow route but as I've never gone through the sting of a divorce (never been married) I've not ruled out long term relationships as long as there no wedding and no kids....

if you want to know what marriage feels like, then find a woman who treats you with contempt, and buy her a house !

Offline baltar

I hope someone beats the sense into me if I ever say I want to get married. MGTOW is the only way to go, sadly.

I'm never getting married. As I dont want kids that doesn't bother me, but I guess I've also gotten used to doing my own thing whenever I want all the time, and bachelorhood is habit forming.

I've kind of gone down the whole mgtow route but as I've never gone through the sting of a divorce (never been married) I've not ruled out long term relationships as long as there no wedding and no kids....

This thread can either go depressingly deep or enlightening.

I don't think there is any benefits for a man to get married, unless the women is very wealthy! Why would any man want to get married baffles me? Anything that reduces your freedom has to be a bad thing. That is why married men see prossies, to feel free and to do anything they desire to a woman without any consequences.

I don't want to get married or have kids, but I wouldn't mind a long relationship if we meet each others needs. Some days I feel like I want a girlfriend and most of time I'm content with solitude and pleasing myself. It's nice to have friends, but I only like them in small doses for the odd night out or a few hours talking over a few drinks etc.

It very difficult which path to choose because the more you try to control life, the more life controls you. If you go by what society wants you to do (get married, have kids, get a degree, be a debt slave) you're fucked either way.

I think the key is to be content with whatever the outcome is, in anything you do.

If you approach a girl and ask a girl out - Accept she'll say no
If you do get married/enter long term relationship - Accept sex may dry up and you may fall out of love (lose interest in each other).

We shouldn't fear rejection sexually if there are good quality prossies, offering a good service.

Thank god for prossies :)




 

Offline baltar

Marriage has always been a social system to protect women, for men to take care of them. That's the hard truth of it.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2013, 02:18:30 AM by baltar »

I'm never getting married. As I dont want kids that doesn't bother me, but I guess I've also gotten used to doing my own thing whenever I want all the time, and bachelorhood is habit forming.


I wish I'd seen things that clearly before I asked Mrs R L to marry me.  She later told me that I'd lived on my own for too long before we met and was too set in my ways.

Coincidentally, the only other woman to whom I've ever suggested a relationship, an friend from schooldays with whom I'd kept in touch when she emigrated to Australia [no connection with overhead, I'm sure!], used the same excuse about both of us.  At the age I was at the time [5 years ago], being in a long-term relationship was, practically speaking, the only way I could have emigrated there.

Offline overhead

I wish I'd seen things that clearly before I asked Mrs R L to marry me.  She later told me that I'd lived on my own for too long before we met and was too set in my ways.

That's something we all suffer from, unless we become involved in a relationship early in life. The same thing happens with women, but of course they don't take that in account. To be fair, lot's of men are very set in their ways and they don't realise it, and you can see that their relationship(s) are inevitably going to crash and burn. The relationships that tend to endure are the ones where the man gives in most of the time, but not so much that he loses the respect of his partner. Getting the balance right is the tricky bit. I failed in the end after 25 years.

Coincidentally, the only other woman to whom I've ever suggested a relationship, an friend from schooldays with whom I'd kept in touch when she emigrated to Australia [no connection with overhead, I'm sure!], used the same excuse about both of us.  At the age I was at the time [5 years ago], being in a long-term relationship was, practically speaking, the only way I could have emigrated there.

I'm also sure not. My story dates from a lot longer than 5 years ago.

Offline overhead

Marriage has always been a social system to protect women, for men to take care of them. That's the hard truth of it.

Probably. But most of my marriage were the best years of my life. We did some great things, and I wouldn't change anything apart from the last couple of years. The whole was greater than the sum of the parts for sure. Unfortunately in the end I was the only one to recognise that. Most of my friends think I was stupid to get myself into that situation, but they have no concept, and I don't think that any of them that are married are in any better situation than I was.


Offline overhead

We shouldn't fear rejection sexually if there are good quality prossies, offering a good service.

Thank god for prossies :)

Well, I think it is very difficult to find ones that are suitable. I am sure different men want different things. I want an active sex life and someone I can relate to when I'm with them, but not to be invasive in each others lives. There is a fine line to be drawn and all too many people are not smart enough to recognise where that line is.

Finding a WG who is real is the first hurdle. If AW is typical then I would say that over 90% don't even exist except as scams. Most of the rest have read too much Belle de Jour and think there is easy money to be made on a scale that is ten times what the average person can sustain. They are all aiming for the top 1% of the market in other words - who else can afford £300 plus per hour on a regular basis? I like what Brooke Magnanti has done, but she has her head above the clouds and taken a lot of others' expectations with her. So she has done a lot of good for her former profession, but for the average punter none at all, in fact she's made it worse for us.

Then there are the ones who are so insular that it becomes like going to the dentist. One WG told me that she feels like freaking out if she becomes the slightest bit aroused. I felt sick when I heard that, who wants to spend time with someone with that attitude. I'm sure there are a lot of men they find repulsive around, but to feel like that with everyone is obnoxious. I guess it's okay with young men who just need to get their rocks off, and that of course is quite valid, but you try and find 15 min specialists, they are very thin on the ground. Some people need to feel a bit more of a connection than that anyway. What's the good of spending an hour with someone who despises every minute of that time. Unfortunately I  have found that to be the typical senario.



Offline overhead

I am banned form Mumsnet I am afraid.  I posted on a few of their prostitute threads and the women there did not like my answers so much so that most of my posts were deleted for not being in the spirit of mumsnet (as in not man hating or standing up for the harridens on there).
they are all of the opinion that a relationship is one sided, theirs, no other opinion is welcome.  I do not think one of them has a healthy relationship at all and I do feel for their husbands.  A relationship is about compromise. You also have to be able to talk about anything and be able to see the other persons point of view even if you don't agree with it you should be able ot see where they are coming from.
When it comes to withholding sex women know damn well that most men will mention it once or twice and get their heads bitten off and then will forget the subject all together so the women can happily carry on as they were.  If the men don't stop they bring up the old , oh you want me to have sex with you even though you know I wont enjoy it, knowing damn well that will be enough to stop men talking about it.  It is infuriating.  They go on about feminism, which is the right to be treated as equals with men and with their next breathe they use sex against them.  Hardly bloody equal is it.
Personally if my hubby felt neglected sexually I know he would talk to me and I would listen (no problem with that as I am the neglected one most of the time as he works hard and is often too tired).  Marriage is about talking.  Problems do not get resolved if one refuses to talk to the other.  I suppose I was lucky and was brought up by parents who were very loving and talked about everything and taught us to do the same.

I suspect that the marriages of many of my friends have gone down that road, but I wouldn't be so bold or invasive as to discuss it with any of them.

Dani, you are clearly someone who has a deeper understanding than most. I thought that many WG's would be the same. Not at all, I've yet to encounter one who even gives a toss to be honest. To most of them clients are to be endured rather than welcomed.

Single, never married and in my mid 20's.

While I was never married, I did have one very long term relationship which came very close to marriage at one point; we were living together and had been discussing having kids.

Similar to the stories many of those of you who are/were married, sex life went to hell, she got extremely fat, and generally the love in the relationship had gone. She had cheated on me before when the relationship was still good, and I never really got over it properly, which then festered into resentment. Different to the people here, it was actually me who was refusing sex; she was hugely overweight, and I resented her for her previous infidelity as well as her general treatment of me, which was pretty vile. Not sure why I stayed in the relationship; I think because generally I used to feel like quitting was a terrible thing, and so I would try and struggle through, making compromises, trying to understand her, get on her good side, etc. It's easy to see from the outside what a disaster it was, but it had just taken so long to get to that point, and used to be at such a high, that at the time I just couldn't see how bad things were.
Anyway I finally pulled the plug when I discovered she had been shagging most of the country from near enough the start of the relationship; even during the really good times when I had thought we were madly in love. I was absolutely devastated, it took me a long time to get over it, and it was really what prompted me into punting.

In hindsight, in a way I'm glad to have had the experience as I think I've learned and grown a hell of a lot from it. Hearing a lot of stories about people's marriages that went sour,  it seems like the exact sort of thing I went through, only I've managed to escape it without the huge upheaval of a divorce. It's completely reshaped my view of marriage; where previously I thought of it as something everyone should seek out one day, and should stay together "till death do us part", I now just don't think it's viable. There are some couples I know who will probably have very good marriages, but I don't think it's for me. I posted in another thread a brief comment on how monogamy is perfectly natural, but I just don't think it's meant to be a lifelong commitment. In my view it's effectively a temporary pairing to raise a child, and shouldn't be the all consuming lifelong commitment that it is, as I just don't think it's meant to last that long.

I'm pretty firm on the idea that I'll never get married. Kids? Yes. Live with someone? Probably. Marriage? Never.
Perhaps that's not the ideal situation for the kids, but I don't think a child is any better off growing up in a loveless house with two parents who resent each other.

Offline wristjob

I need to read some of these Mumsnet threads. Frankly they look like wannabe middle class middle aged women with too much time on their hands and a little bit of a chip on their shoulders. In recent years I have become a little cynical regarding women. They have more power than they appreciate in many areas and are all too willing to abuse that. In a marriage a woman can wield all that passive-aggressive sex control and if a man thinks about leaving they have the kid card to carry on abusing.

In terms of owing a man sex if just seems bizarre. Men wouldn't have such an attitude but it's actually harder for a man to have sex if he's not interested. More to the point why would you not want to have a sexual relationship? Isn't that a big part of what marriage is - if a woman or man doesn't want to then I would say that's a problem and what exactly are they in that relationship for? To say it's not owed implies resenting "giving" sex to the other party, I did many things in my marriage I wouldn't have chosen to but surely by the time you have got married you have decided you want to do things for the other person, their happiness is your happiness. Trust me I never mowed a lawn when I wasn't married.

Actually punting and withholding sex are the same thing in some sense. If a woman has sex with a man when she doesn't really want to she's doing something specifically to please him. If a man would prefer to punt then gives that up because he's married - he's doing (or not doing) something to please her.

I am recently divorced but was married for about 5-6 years. To be honest sex was the only thing we had in common and it was great from the start to the end. We had similar sex drives and there was enough common ground. Some things she wouldn't do but enough she would.  Everything else was crap really. Literally everything else. After we separated I'd pop in occasionally for a bit, even had to bribe her to sign the divorce papers with a shag . The problem was when I started refusing - that was a bigger rejection than walking out on her and then it got acrimonious - very acrimonious.

During the relationship I never punted. I watched porn often enough but even though I often worked away for a week or more at a time I never felt it would be fair.

In the future wild horses couldn't get me married again. I don't get the point - marriage is just a way of making it harder to split when the time is right to go your own ways. In terms of sex I've slowed down quite a lot the last few years. Now the occasional punt with a hot girl is enough so what I want is all the other bits of a good relationship and as my marriage gave me pretty much none of those then I don't relate marriage to being what I'm after.

Offline akauya

Interesting posts Kingcharmiing and Wristjob.

What I found interesting Wristjob is the fact that your ex got angry once you started refusing sex with her. It highlights what I often noticed about women that, despite their protestations otherwise, they just can't handle rejection. I often hear women say 'men can't handle rejection' when in fact that's bollocks. I think women find it much harder to deal with rejection than men simply because they are not used to it.

Unless you're Brad Pitt personified, I would say the majority of us have experienced rejection pretty much all the time because being horny bastards we ask women all the time. So when we get rejected we generally move on, yes there are a few guys who can’t handle it well but the majority of us deal with it OK.

The saying hell has no fury like a woman scorned pretty much says it all, yet women always complain that it is men who can’t handle rejection.

Offline overhead

Interesting posts Kingcharmiing and Wristjob.

What I found interesting Wristjob is the fact that your ex got angry once you started refusing sex with her. It highlights what I often noticed about women that, despite their protestations otherwise, they just can't handle rejection. I often hear women say 'men can't handle rejection' when in fact that's bollocks. I think women find it much harder to deal with rejection than men simply because they are not used to it.

Unless you're Brad Pitt personified, I would say the majority of us have experienced rejection pretty much all the time because being horny bastards we ask women all the time. So when we get rejected we generally move on, yes there are a few guys who can’t handle it well but the majority of us deal with it OK.

The saying hell has no fury like a woman scorned pretty much says it all, yet women always complain that it is men who can’t handle rejection.

+whatever

That is so true.

(In fact so bleedin' obvious you don't realise it in everyday life)

Offline dave123

My parents are in their 80s and my dad says that my mum is still the girl he married all them years ago. They are very much in love and would be lost without each other. But they are from a different generation, one where porn was frowned upon and where sex was very much part of love. The problem with porn and prostitutes is that you get so much you have to go more and more exotic to get the same thrill. They use to say that men would get turned on by a flash of a pretty ankle.

Offline fredpunter

They use to say that men would get turned on by a flash of a pretty ankle.

probably belongs in another thread but it's funny what can turn you on ... I fell for a lass once who I only noticed initially because I admired the curve of her neck

Offline NaturalMystique

probably belongs in another thread but it's funny what can turn you on ... I fell for a lass once who I only noticed initially because I admired the curve of her neck

I am very curious about why having sex often seems to be a lot more important to a majority of men than women.  Do you think it's because it's what society expects or nature. Sorry if it's already answered in the thread.

Also I will add that I think that after a while (not speaking for all women) you start going off your husband.  The way he walks.  His habits. His face etc after a while just seems to annoy your very soul. His touch just makes your skin crawl and it just can not be helped. So maybe some women genuine wish they could be intimate with their husband but mentally can not bring themselves to do it in less they grit their teeth and bare it. Not sayings it's right. The marriage / wife probably needs to undergo counselling or find ways to rekindle that lost flame.

Offline fredpunter


Also I will add that I think that after a while (not speaking for all women) you start going off your husband.  The way he walks.  His habits. His face etc after a while just seems to annoy your very soul. His touch just makes your skin crawl and it just can not be helped. So maybe some women genuine wish they could be intimate with their husband but mentally can not bring themselves to do it in less they grit their teeth and bare it. Not sayings it's right. The marriage / wife probably needs to undergo counselling or find ways to rekindle that lost flame.

the mystery to me is not why women go off men but why they are ever attracted to them in the first place - I feel as you describe about all men the moment I meet them.

Offline Hyborean

I am very curious about why having sex often seems to be a lot more important to a majority of men than women.  Do you think it's because it's what society expects or nature. Sorry if it's already answered in the thread.

Also I will add that I think that after a while (not speaking for all women) you start going off your husband.  The way he walks.  His habits. His face etc after a while just seems to annoy your very soul. His touch just makes your skin crawl and it just can not be helped. So maybe some women genuine wish they could be intimate with their husband but mentally can not bring themselves to do it in less they grit their teeth and bare it. Not sayings it's right. The marriage / wife probably needs to undergo counselling or find ways to rekindle that lost flame.

I think it just that when the marriage starts to go wrong, whatever the reason, then all sorts of things about you spouse can start to grate. As true for men as for women.

My ex-wife never went off sex even though she went off me and had no respect for me any more. The thing is that I went off her. Trying to work on the relationship was very difficult when I couldn't bear sex with her any more. She still turned the heads of every male when she walked in the room but due to the breakdown I no longer found her attractive.

Guys, when your wife no longer wants sex, it may be because it is a medical or age thing but it is far more likely that she no longer loves you in that way. Sex for women is after all a lot more tied to emotion.

Once you have been together long enough she may have stopped viewing you as her soul partner but more of a friend and room mate she is stuck with. Time to re-evaluate.  :hi:

Offline NaturalMystique

the mystery to me is not why women go off men but why they are ever attracted to them in the first place - I feel as you describe about all men the moment I meet them.

Sorry brain running slow today explain the " I feel as you..   etc" please

Offline lovelysofia92

I am very curious about why having sex often seems to be a lot more important to a majority of men than women.  Do you think it's because it's what society expects or nature. Sorry if it's already answered in the thread.

Also I will add that I think that after a while (not speaking for all women) you start going off your husband.  The way he walks.  His habits. His face etc after a while just seems to annoy your very soul. His touch just makes your skin crawl and it just can not be helped. So maybe some women genuine wish they could be intimate with their husband but mentally can not bring themselves to do it in less they grit their teeth and bare it. Not sayings it's right. The marriage / wife probably needs to undergo counselling or find ways to rekindle that lost flame.

You just described my exact feelings about anyone I've been seeing for more than 3 months  :D

Having said that, there have been times I wanted to have sex and the other person didn't feel like it! Admittedly, very rarely, but it did happen.
And I heard so many girls complaining about their boyfriends not shagging them enough, believe it or not.

In my opinion, there are just some people that aren't very sexual, male or female. It certainly seems to happen more with women though.
It might also be because they are never really satisfied sexually with their partner and in that case, it's just a nuisance to have to go through with it so they'd rather not do it altogether.
 As young people in love or as newlyweds, the woman often makes more of an effort to satisfy his sexual needs but after years and years the novelty is wearing off and they've already got their husband by their balls so why bother?  :wackogirl: I think that's how some women think and it's very sad. If I ever do get married, the guy has to be dangerously close to being a sex addict.  :lol:

Offline Hyborean

You just described my exact feelings about anyone I've been seeing for more than 3 months  :D

Having said that, there have been times I wanted to have sex and the other person didn't feel like it! Admittedly, very rarely, but it did happen.
And I heard so many girls complaining about their boyfriends not shagging them enough, believe it or not.

In my opinion, there are just some people that aren't very sexual, male or female. It certainly seems to happen more with women though.
It might also be because they are never really satisfied sexually with their partner and in that case, it's just a nuisance to have to go through with it so they'd rather not do it altogether.
 As young people in love or as newlyweds, the woman often makes more of an effort to satisfy his sexual needs but after years and years the novelty is wearing off and they've already got their husband by their balls so why bother?  :wackogirl: I think that's how some women think and it's very sad. If I ever do get married, the guy has to be dangerously close to being a sex addict:lol:

You may just have described most of the members.

Where did I put that MASSIVE diamond ring? Do I propose on here or by pm?  :unknown:


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