Glasgow Live reporting MSP’s investigation in Pimping websites in Scotland

[globewindsailor]

Old thread, but thought I'd check on the progress of the thing. The SNP manifesto has banning buying sex is in there. "Scotlands first prostitution consultant...With aim to tackle this form of violence against women"

[Squire Haggard]

Old thread, but thought I'd check on the progress of the thing. The SNP manifesto has banning buying sex is in there. "Scotlands first prostitution consultant...With aim to tackle this form of violence against women"

Yes, they are still calling prostitution ''a form of violence against women and girls.''  They want to ''challenge men's demand for prostitution''' and to ''challenge men's attitude to the purchase of sex.'' 

The link to the manifesto is out there, but I wont post it, as its maybe too political?  They have made sure that it cant be cut and pasted.

No SP or punter on here agrees with them, but they do dont want to know, as always. 

[J_H]

Old thread, but thought I'd check on the progress of the thing. The SNP manifesto has banning buying sex is in there. "Scotlands first prostitution consultant...With aim to tackle this form of violence against women"

I do wonder if the girls charging £100+ per half hour feel this is a form of violence against them!

And make no mistake, if the other parties think this is a vote-winner, they'll all be on this bandwagon quicker then you can say 'incall'!!

[subedin33]

Politicians love hot button topics as a way of getting voters.

Usually they do zero research, make up nonsense facts with little or no evidence, and the public just agree and jump on the bandwagon because people tend to believe what theyre told. Its infuriating, but its true.

Just last week, my mate said "why do people smoke weed when its so bad for them??". I asked "Why is it bad?" And he replied "Because its illegal. It must be bad. Plus the government says its bad. Why would they lie?......
Coming from a guy who has never smoked in his life.
One of those classic hand in face moments that reminded my mate mates a complete dumbass 😂 

The same principal applies to the lies being posted in the SNP Manifesto. Zero research. Dramatisation of a hot button topic that people will fall for. Every single person on this site no doubt read it and just rolled their eyes and shook their head.

[Marmalade]

Prostitution in Glasgow is a big problem.
Firstly there’s not enough of it. Secondly the quality is often quite low.

I’m not sure why SNP are so violently against it.
I’m against any sort of violence.
 

[The Critic]

I do wonder if the girls charging £100+ per half hour feel this is a form of violence against them!

£100+ per half hour feels like a form of violence against my wallet. 

Joking apart, these threats of criminalsing punting have been around for a while and never seem to fully go away but equally they never seem to gain any real traction either. Fingers crossed.

[Matrix]

Unfortunately most drones won't consider this when placing their "X".  Something about Turkeys and Christmas.

[J_H]

Unfortunately most drones won't consider this when placing their "X".  Something about Turkeys and Christmas.

Like Brexit?

[Matrix]

Banned topic, but yes I did thanks. 

Independence is a great thing.

[Honey Badger]

Ever being the sceptic, I went and had a look myself and indeed it is there.  On page 34, the last paragraph of the section "Tackling Domestic Abuse and Sexual Violence" for anyone that is interested.

It is quite poorly worded and I can read the meaning of the first two sentences in two different ways.  Either they are saying all forms of prostitution are violence against women or they are saying they will tackle forms of prostitution which are violent.  If they are saying the latter then I think most of us here will be behind the effort to try and improve the safety of SP's.   

However, if it is the former then it is quite the hyperbole and the only way I can interpret it making any sort of logical sense is if the SNP are at the same time saying that all women offering sex for cash are victims and either coerced into it by men or forced into it by circumstance since any reasonable person would not do this of their own free-will.

I would be interested to hear what SP's make of this as, if it is the first interpretation, the SNP seem to be saying that anyone who freely chooses to do this doesn't have the mental capacity to make their own rational decisions.

[J_H]

Ever being the sceptic, I went and had a look myself and indeed it is there.  On page 34, the last paragraph of the section "Tackling Domestic Violence and Sexual Abuse" for anyone that is interested.

It is quite poorly worded and I can read the meaning of the first two sentences in two different ways.  Either they are saying all forms of prostitution are violence against women or they are saying they will tackle forms of prostitution which are violent.  If they are saying the latter then I think most of us here will be behind the effort to try and improve the safety of SP's.   

However, if it is the former then it is quite the hyperbole and the only way I can interpret it making any sort of logical sense is if the SNP are at the same time saying that all women offering sex for cash are victims and either coerced into it by men or forced into it by circumstance since any reasonable person would not do this of their own free-will.

I would be interested to hear what SP's make of this as, if it is the first interpretation, the SNP seem to be saying that anyone who freely chooses to do this doesn't have the mental capacity to make their own rational decisions.

Party politics aside, I've spoken to two SPs very recently and they are/were incensed at being portrayed as 'victims' and unable, as one put it, to control their own bodies - an objection that many feminists also make about criminalisation.

I find it hard to believe that any government of any complexion would go absolutely the whole hog, and criminalise every aspect of paid sex, including 'massage'. I can't see how they would enforce it; they'd need an enormous vice squad.

[Honey Badger]

Assuming the interpretation is correct, if you take it forward logically the next step would be to make it illegal to purchase sex but not to sell it as those selling it are victims.

[Matrix]

That's exactly what they want.   

Why not ask one of them?

[J_H]

To the best of my knowledge that's what's meant by the Nordic Model, or at least is being 'sold' as the Nordic Model: only purchase is illegal, not selling.

It woudln't take genius to recognise the difficulty in criminalising one part of the transaction without - at least inadvertently - criminalising the other.

A Finnish WG collective opposed to criminalisation explained how Sweden does is it: 'they do surveillance of sex workers to catch clients ... a violation against sex workers’ integrity and right to privacy. It seems to be difficult to get the clients without harassing the sex workers.'

However, in practice the whole surveillance thing seems to be targeted at migrants who are (suspected of) being trafficked.

[Squire Haggard]

To the best of my knowledge that's what's meant by the Nordic Model, or at least is being 'sold' as the Nordic Model: only purchase is illegal, not selling.

It woudln't take genius to recognise the difficulty in criminalising one part of the transaction without - at least inadvertently - criminalising the other.

A Finnish WG collective opposed to criminalisation explained how Sweden does is it: 'they do surveillance of sex workers to catch clients ... a violation against sex workers’ integrity and right to privacy. It seems to be difficult to get the clients without harassing the sex workers.'

However, in practice the whole surveillance thing seems to be targeted at migrants who are (suspected of) being trafficked.

Here, they are targeting punters, regardless of what they, or SPs, think.

Ash Denham MSP Minister for Community Safety, is not targeting migrants who might be trafficked, but all punters.

Since I posted this quote a few months ago, its no longer on the link that it was originally on. Have they ''disappeared'' Ash Denham's quote? 

 ''Commercial sexual exploitation refers to a continuum of violence. Prostitution is just one act on this continuum.''

                         '' I see this consultation paper as an opportunity for us to hold that national discussion to inform future policy decisions about how we address this form
                           of gendered violence........''

 External Link/Members Only                                                                 

EDIT   Her rant is here..... 

External Link/Members Only

[J_H]

I meant that WG was saying in Finland the target was migrants not punters.

[Squire Haggard]

I meant that WG was saying in Finland the target was migrants not punters.

 

[Matrix]

One of the reasons I stopped backing them a few years back.  Don't fancy criminalising myself.