The AW Hot List Conundrum

[PatMacGroin]

I was reviewing my AW Hotlists earlier and something occurred to me that I thought I might as well share.

Firstly, a bit of background. I rarely search on AW for talent anymore. Generally, I browse UKP and if a WG catches my eye I add her to my AW hotlist. Usually, just the default HL, occasionally I'll put one straight into my "most wanted" listed or one of my other custom/specialist lists.

More often than not the chance that I'll actually visit them is slim to none. Usually for one or a combination of the following reasons:

1) They're based in area I'm very unlikely to visit. But she's hot, so I'll add her on the off chance I spot her again while she is touring somewhere more convenient.

2) They have priced themselves beyond the maximum I'm willing to pay. It may only be by £20, but there are also plenty of other just as attractive WG's that on the face of it are better VFM. So chances are, I'll have to get through those, before I make it to her. If it's a very new profile I often think, once she's had a dusty phone for a while that price will come down to something more reasonable, although tbh it's not happened that often that I've noticed.

3) There is one or more service I like that they don't offer (usually CIM). But I add them anyway in case I decide to go without or they decide to expand their repertoire.

My AW hotlist count is now approaching 250. Some accounts go inactive, but I rarely remove any from those lists. I rarely even look at the default list. If I'm honest with myself I've realised many of them are there just because I'm hoping that they will change some aspect of their service, but I haven't even looked to see if they have.

From previous threads I've read. On a WG's AW account they can see how many times they have been hot listed, and even which AW account has added them, e.g.: https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=26902.msg383265#msg383265

So if a new WG see's that she has been HL'd hundreds of times, it's not surprising if she would automatically think "They like my looks, they like my services, they like my prices and they are happy to come to where I am". Which would influence her into thinking she doesn't need to change locations or adjust her prices/services because there are hundreds of guys just about to call her (even though they haven't called yet).

So here comes the question/conundrum...

- Would you agree that if there are hundreds or even thousands of other punters like me hot listing WG's they have no intention of seeing (if we're honest), is this likely to influence how those WG's operate?
- Does it set a false expectation of the amount of business they are likely to receive?
- Potentially discouraging them from trying new locations or recognising that their rates could be a bit optimistic?
- If the above is true, would it generally be better for all punters if we don't use the AW Hot List feature?

Apologies if this topic has been covered in length before now or if my opening post is a bit rambling. Just thought I'd put it out there and see if anyone else had any thoughts on the matter.

[GingerNuts]

- Would you agree that if there are hundreds or even thousands of other punters like me hot listing WG's they have no intention of seeing (if we're honest), is this likely to influence how those WG's operate?
- Does it set a false expectation of the amount of business they are likely to receive?
- Potentially discouraging them from trying new locations or recognising that their rates could be a bit optimistic?

Sign up to SAAFE and ask the WGs.

[Woodcutter]

You can make multiple hot lists, the ones I like the look of go in a 'default'  hot list I then check if theyre reviewed here & positively so I put them in a HL I titled 'reviewed' which I then reduce further so it's never more than one page long

[daviemac]

I only use one list, a hot list. There's ones there I would like to see, ones I might like to see and dodgy scammers and the like that I would never see. It keeps them all in the same place, easier to keep a check on. I just add notes for the reason they are there.

I couldn't give a shit what they think or do about it.

[Wett]

If someone has been on the list for a while and I haven't booked them I delete them. Once I have deleted one I tend to cull a few more. I didn't know that the wgs were informed when they were added to a hot list. I presume they also know when they are deleted. I would guess that a fair number of them can't be bothered to look up the profiles of those who have added them. Am not bothered if they see my profile partly as it doesn't say a lot.

[PatMacGroin]

Sign up to SAAFE and ask the WGs.

I was expecting a response like this. Although I was expecting someone to say try posting it on UKE. Interesting that you chose to suggest Saafe. I'm not a member on that site but feel free to repost the questions there if you are.

[PatMacGroin]

You can make multiple hot lists, the ones I like the look of go in a 'default'  hot list I then check if theyre reviewed here & positively so I put them in a HL I titled 'reviewed' which I then reduce further so it's never more than one page long

I also have multiple hotlists. But most of the AW profiles I spot on UKP get added to the plain default list for simplicity. Then I can go through them and do a bit more research later if I'm struggling to find a good prospect out of my main favourites.

Especially when they are very new profiles I've picked up off of the London TOFTT and verification threads:
Latest London TOFTT Page: https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=98715.3500
Latest London Veri Pic Page: https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=91649.4350

[PatMacGroin]

I only use one list, a hot list. There's ones there I would like to see, ones I might like to see and dodgy scammers and the like that I would never see. It keeps them all in the same place, easier to keep a check on. I just add notes for the reason they are there.

I couldn't give a shit what they think or do about it.

If you were not already aware, you can add folders to split up you hotlist. Based on what you've said you could call them:
- Would Like
- Might Like
- Scammers
It can make your HL shorter and easier to scan through. So you could ignore the scammers. Then concentrate on the Would likes, but move on to the might likes if nothing has grabbed your interest.

[PatMacGroin]

I realise my original post waffled a lot.

The main point I was trying to make was that if AW WG's can see that they have been added to hundreds of Hot Lists, it can give them an abundance mentality. Making them believe they are in demand and expect higher rates, even if they actually have a dusty phone.

The AW HL is convenient for us most of the time. Especially as we get used to using it when we first start using AW. And as far as AW is concerned it's also good for their own marketing as it tells the WG's registered with them that many of their members are interested in what they have to sell. Similar to the way a lot of the old dodgy online dating sites used to send male members fake messages from interested woman to get us to sign up to the VIP memberships which included Instant Messaging (anyone remember those?).

However, as a result of that, it could be in punters interests not to us the AW Hot List function. Instead use some other "incognito" method to track the WG's that you like the look of, which doesn't also notify them of how much interest they are getting.

Does that not make sense to anyone else?

[ZeroCount]

They couldn't give a fuck if they're getting "interest", they care about getting bookings. If a girl gets hot-listed 1,000 times and only one guy books her, why would that influence her thinking in any way?

[daviemac]

If you were not already aware, you can add folders to split up you hotlist. Based on what you've said you could call them:
- Would Like
- Might Like
- Scammers
It can make your HL shorter and easier to scan through. So you could ignore the scammers. Then concentrate on the Would likes, but move on to the might likes if nothing has grabbed your interest.

I'm well aware of the facility to create multiple lists, (there's a link on the Hot List page) did you miss this bit in my post??  - 'It keeps them all in the same place, easier to keep a check on.'  A simple 'hover' over the 'notes' link reveals any notes you have made as well, all very simple really.

I don't want to ignore the scammers, I want to see any name changes.

Edit

Look at it another way, an escort sees that 1000's of people have her in their hot list but she only gets 1 booking from it, does she then think 'I'm popular I'd better put my rates up', or does she think, 'what am I doing wrong, in all those hot lists but no bookings'.

You're over complicating matters, this is supposed to be fun. Unless you can link to some examples of them putting prices up as a result of being in a hot list, this is all unfounded speculation.

[EastCoast Rambler]

I keep about 30 in my hotlist and also under the search tab, I keep some in there too under different categories, such as outcalls, incalls and towns, etc. and pay for the 'logged in now' facility.

[winkywanky]

I was reviewing my AW Hotlists earlier and something occurred to me that I thought I might as well share.

Firstly, a bit of background. I rarely search on AW for talent anymore. Generally, I browse UKP and if a WG catches my eye I add her to my AW hotlist. Usually, just the default HL, occasionally I'll put one straight into my "most wanted" listed or one of my other custom/specialist lists.

More often than not the chance that I'll actually visit them is slim to none. Usually for one or a combination of the following reasons:

1) They're based in area I'm very unlikely to visit. But she's hot, so I'll add her on the off chance I spot her again while she is touring somewhere more convenient.

2) They have priced themselves beyond the maximum I'm willing to pay. It may only be by £20, but there are also plenty of other just as attractive WG's that on the face of it are better VFM. So chances are, I'll have to get through those, before I make it to her. If it's a very new profile I often think, once she's had a dusty phone for a while that price will come down to something more reasonable, although tbh it's not happened that often that I've noticed.

3) There is one or more service I like that they don't offer (usually CIM). But I add them anyway in case I decide to go without or they decide to expand their repertoire.

My AW hotlist count is now approaching 250. Some accounts go inactive, but I rarely remove any from those lists. I rarely even look at the default list. If I'm honest with myself I've realised many of them are there just because I'm hoping that they will change some aspect of their service, but I haven't even looked to see if they have.

From previous threads I've read. On a WG's AW account they can see how many times they have been hot listed, and even which AW account has added them, e.g.: https://www.ukpunting.com/index.php?topic=26902.msg383265#msg383265

So if a new WG see's that she has been HL'd hundreds of times, it's not surprising if she would automatically think "They like my looks, they like my services, they like my prices and they are happy to come to where I am". Which would influence her into thinking she doesn't need to change locations or adjust her prices/services because there are hundreds of guys just about to call her (even though they haven't called yet).

So here comes the question/conundrum...

- Would you agree that if there are hundreds or even thousands of other punters like me hot listing WG's they have no intention of seeing (if we're honest), is this likely to influence how those WG's operate?
- Does it set a false expectation of the amount of business they are likely to receive?
- Potentially discouraging them from trying new locations or recognising that their rates could be a bit optimistic?
- If the above is true, would it generally be better for all punters if we don't use the AW Hot List feature?

Apologies if this topic has been covered in length before now or if my opening post is a bit rambling. Just thought I'd put it out there and see if anyone else had any thoughts on the matter.

Firstly, from your point of view you probably need to be a bit more selective when you do a search.

Reduce the radius mileage and carefully select the postcode area you're interested in.

Don't speculate on whether they might add extra services in the future, that's what UKP reviews are good for showing up. Keep your search precise to what you want.

What a shame AW doesn't include upper (and even lower) price limit in searches. They could easily do this and it would tend to reduce speculative pricing by WGs. (Just goes to show AW is there for a WG's benefit, not ours).


As for whether WGs get a falsely high impression of their own worth when they get hotlisted, yes, I think they might. Certainly for new WGs anyway. The more realistic of them might suss this out and modify their prices, but there'll always be plenty of girls who think they're such hot shit they don't need to, even if they have a dusty phone. And this would again tend to keep prices high. Even more important then, to be a bit more selective when you do searches, if you spread your net too wide when you hotlist, you probably actually add to the problem.

[cunningman]

What a shame AW doesn't include upper (and even lower) price limit in searches. They could easily do this and it would tend to reduce speculative pricing by WGs. (Just goes to show AW is there for a WG's benefit, not ours).

Surely they do, but not in the phone app?

[GingerNuts]

What a shame AW doesn't include upper (and even lower) price limit in searches.

Unless I'm missing the point you can set upper and lower limits for half hour, hour or overnight on the "Rates & Availability" tab.

[winkywanky]

Surely they do, but not in the phone app?

Unless I'm missing the point you can set upper and lower limits for half hour, hour or overnight on the "Rates & Availability" tab.

Doh, my apologies!  .

[Ali Katt]

1) Would you agree that if there are hundreds or even thousands of other punters like me hot listing WG's they have no intention of seeing (if we're honest), is this likely to influence how those WG's operate?
2) Does it set a false expectation of the amount of business they are likely to receive?
- Potentially discouraging them from trying new locations or recognising that their rates could be a bit optimistic?
3) If the above is true, would it generally be better for all punters if we don't use the AW Hot List feature?

1) Yes, as some punters will hotlist girls to view their PGs or whatever. Not every punter is active, also there are more personal factors like a punter planning to see an escort, but he's got marriage guilt.

2) Possibly, but I think every escort knows not every man who hotlists them will see them. As is common knowledge even a booking request doesn't mean Joe Punter will turn up.

3) No because as I've said nothing is guaranteed, until it is guaranteed. If an escort is say hotlisted 1K times it doesn't mean they will get 1K+ bookings, I don't know the stats, but I doubt they will get 1%. Adultwank basically encourages voyeurism above say "adult dating".

I have a few hotlists set-up and searches for different areas. I do intend to see every escort on my hotlist, and a few I plan on seeing again. It's time more than anything. The other factor is there's been girls I would have seen by now, but we could never sort anything out.

[daviemac]

Doh, my apologies!  .

I wouldn't worry, I can't think of anything that AW could add to the search feature to improve it but there's still loads who don't know what's available.

[PatMacGroin]

I'm well aware of the facility to create multiple lists, (there's a link on the Hot List page) did you miss this bit in my post??  - 'It keeps them all in the same place, easier to keep a check on.' A simple 'hover' over the 'notes' link reveals any notes you have made as well, all very simple really.

I don't want to ignore the scammers, I want to see any name changes.

Edit

Look at it another way, an escort sees that 1000's of people have her in their hot list but she only gets 1 booking from it, does she then think 'I'm popular I'd better put my rates up', or does she think, 'what am I doing wrong, in all those hot lists but no bookings'.

You're over complicating matters, this is supposed to be fun. Unless you can link to some examples of them putting prices up as a result of being in a hot list, this is all unfounded speculation.

My apologies, when I read this opening statement in you initial post... "I only use one list, a hot list." … I read the emphasis to indicate you felt users only get one hot list in AW.

I used to use the notes function a lot, but I found it became time consuming to keep updating them.

As I can't see WG's hotlists notifications/records, I can't provide any examples. I am aware of several WG's that increased the prices they had listed on AW, but I have no idea if that is due to increased bookings or the impression of increased interest due to HL notifications. It would make sense that actual bookings would be a more direct motivation for prices rises, but a greater level of perceived interest could also be an influence.

I don't haggle, I pay the price advertised or don't see them. However, I am aware many WG's continue to arrange bookings at their old/lower rates for old/regular customers, "one off specials", reverse bookings etc. Again, there's the psychological effect of feeling that "if so many guys seem interested why shouldn't I charge more?" balanced against the practicalities of not wanting to turn away bookings because they are not actually busy.

[PatMacGroin]

Firstly, from your point of view you probably need to be a bit more selective when you do a search.

Reduce the radius mileage and carefully select the postcode area you're interested in.

Don't speculate on whether they might add extra services in the future, that's what UKP reviews are good for showing up. Keep your search precise to what you want.

What a shame AW doesn't include upper (and even lower) price limit in searches. They could easily do this and it would tend to reduce speculative pricing by WGs. (Just goes to show AW is there for a WG's benefit, not ours).


As for whether WGs get a falsely high impression of their own worth when they get hotlisted, yes, I think they might. Certainly for new WGs anyway. The more realistic of them might suss this out and modify their prices, but there'll always be plenty of girls who think they're such hot shit they don't need to, even if they have a dusty phone. And this would again tend to keep prices high. Even more important then, to be a bit more selective when you do searches, if you spread your net too wide when you hotlist, you probably actually add to the problem.

I don't really do searches on AW anymore. These days I mostly HL WG's I like the look of after spotting their profile via a UKP thread. Most of them end up in the generic "default list". I also keep a "most wanted" HL on AW, containing the next few WG's I intend to visit if I can. It's usually got about 7 or 8 listed. Once I've met them, I move them into a "seen" HL.

The final section of your comment is what I was getting at. New girls gets tonnes of notifications. She thinks "hey, I'm popular I should be charging more!". Once she has made a few bookings at the higher rate there is a large psychological barrier against the feeling that you are selling yourself short.

[PatMacGroin]

1) Yes, as some punters will hotlist girls to view their PGs or whatever. Not every punter is active, also there are more personal factors like a punter planning to see an escort, but he's got marriage guilt.

2) Possibly, but I think every escort knows not every man who hotlists them will see them. As is common knowledge even a booking request doesn't mean Joe Punter will turn up.

3) No because as I've said nothing is guaranteed, until it is guaranteed. If an escort is say hotlisted 1K times it doesn't mean they will get 1K+ bookings, I don't know the stats, but I doubt they will get 1%. Adultwank basically encourages voyeurism above say "adult dating".

I have a few hotlists set-up and searches for different areas. I do intend to see every escort on my hotlist, and a few I plan on seeing again. It's time more than anything. The other factor is there's been girls I would have seen by now, but we could never sort anything out.

Thank you for a balanced, considered response.

I guess we'd need a WG's perspective to see how they regard the notifications/hot lists records. Or to get any sort of rule of thumb about how many new Hot Listings in any week/month actually convert into new bookings. I probably should have posted it on UKE, but I don't really go on there much.

[PatMacGroin]

OK, so yes, I started this thread completely as a matter of unfounded speculation on my part.

I've recently read some articles about so called "dark patterns". Various features and techniques most websites use to influence their users. It occurred to me that the HL function is a bit like Amazons save for later shopping baskets, but for punters. And then by notifying the WG's it also serves a double purpose, reinforcing the message that paying to market themselves on AW is worthwhile and that other users "like" them.

It is total speculation that it can have other psychological effects on the users. I was wondering if anyone agrees or had any other thoughts on it. The general consensus I'm feeling is that most don't think it's important.

Funnily enough, most people also don't think they are influenced by "dark pattern" techniques. Even though the most successful sites are the ones that use them the most, like Facebook and Amazon.

In conclusion, the lesson I have learned for myself is to stop treating the Hot List so literally, and adding so many WG's just because I'm always horny and they look fucking hot. 

[winkywanky]

I think you're totally correct about the 'dark patterns'.

As for an AW Hotlist and the Amazon shopping basket, at least if you go through with the purchase and it's shit, with Amazon you can get a refund!

[ZeroCount]

You're totally right about the whole dark patterns thing, which is even scarier now it's starting to influence elections too. I just don't think it has any bearing on the hotlist question.

No girl is going to be sat staring at her dusty phone thinking "hey, 500 guys hot-listed me this week, I better put up my prices".

Your conclusion may work for you, but I'm going to continue making full use of hotlists, safe in the knowledge that I'm not making the blindest bit of difference to anyone's pricing model.

[Botev Plovdiv]

I get seriously confused when I find someone on my HL I don’t recall putting there. Sometimes I can figure out who the profile originally belonged to when I ticked it, but other times it seems to be a different location and name. Do WGs just give their profile to someone else? If they do it’s damn confusing. Presumably they can’t change the pictures though?

[GingerNuts]

Do WGs just give their profile to someone else? If they do it’s damn confusing. Presumably they can’t change the pictures though?

Profiles are passed on (given or sold) or a pimp might use the same profile for a succession of girls. Photos can be changed.

[adenmc4]

I only hotlist on AW to see a profile's last login time so I can see if my intro email has been ignored. Doubt i'm the only one.

[Gordon Bennett]

I've got 3 hotlists, broadly organised as local, near-ish and miles away. I never let total I have hotlisted get beyond 25 or so names. I think if you have loads of ladies hotlisted it becomes hard to see the wood for the trees..... I'd suggest at least having a primary/main hotlist that includes ladies that all things being equal you could visit this week and keep ladies not in that category in different hotlist(s).

[Ali Katt]

I've got 3 hotlists, broadly organised as local, near-ish and miles away. I never let total I have hotlisted get beyond 25 or so names. I think if you have loads of ladies hotlisted it becomes hard to see the wood for the trees..... I'd suggest at least having a primary/main hotlist that includes ladies that all things being equal you could visit this week and keep ladies not in that category in different hotlist(s).

That's pretty much what I do. I have a difficult locations list, immediate list which is the default hotlist, seen and sexy for girls I've seen and plan on seeing again and a back burner list for girls I want to see, but not immediately.

[Flunt]

Women have a strange way of thinking, prostitutes doubly strange. 

Whether they have an over-inflated sense of worth by being hot listed by thousands, who knows, some will. Ultimately, they will have to balance their situation with economic reality. If they charge £500 an hour and have no punters then they're doing something wrong, regardless of how many hot lists they are on?

I have about a dozen in my hot list which hasn't been added to for a couple of years. I prefer to have a collection of saved searches which match my criteria, which means if the prostitute bumps her prices or changes her services then she no longer appears in a search, new profiles that do will replace them.

[Marmalade]

I keep a hotlist of blacklist. Much better than the auto blacklist as you can leave yourself a note as to why she's a no-fucking-way next she's incarnated under a stupid new name.
The other hotlists I use are Now, Possible, Shagged and Forum. I don't shag forum prossies but it's handy to know who they are.

Hotlists let you browse them (useful for deleting them if when they move to another city), seeing at a glance how much they charge, postcode and any dealbreaker non-likes. That's quicker than scrolling all through their epic efforts at self-adulation (profile) or adding a 'frequent' to our dear overfuckingseer, Monsieur LeGoogle.

Of course it does mean you have to be registered on AW but the benefits outweigh the other (remote) concerns. 

[Private Parts]

Bang on Marmalade.
Only worry about the dodgy ones!
IMHO
PP

[PepeMAGA]

I have (under different names to these)

default (holding area until I decide whether I'll see them or not, waiting for more feedback, rarely available)
seen (girls I've seen and will see again)
to see (girls I want to see soon)
blacklist (girls Ive seen, but wont see again)

there are some in default that have been in there for years, mostly just hasnt worked out a good time to see them

[Steely Dan]

You are thinking about it too hard OP:
- You hot listed them as a maybe.  So in fact they are better than shit.
- The shit ones get hot listed even less.
- The super stars get hot listed even more.

So it all comes out in the wash.  Use the hot list the way you think - like many of us do, to black list and record a few for the cage.

[Shortandsensible]

I have 3 lists:

I have my ‘seen’ list. All the girls I’ve ever seen. Apart from two I can’t ever find.

I have my list of girls I wanna see ASAP who are local

Then I have a default list of just hot girls I’ve seen on here or on aw who maybe I’ll see one day, most of them aren’t even local, or just a lot more expensive then I’d like.