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Author Topic: Punting and Mental Health  (Read 1958 times)

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

First of all, forgive me if this is the wrong place to post this message.

I want to bring up the discussion about mental health and the punting lifestyle that I have been affected by. I raise this as a point of discussion because there could be others that share the same issues and problems I have and if a discussion on this topic can help them in any way then it's a positive step.

If you are not aware of my cameo appearances on these forums I'll try and sum it up for you:
I'm typically a barebacker who seeks cheap punts as much as possible with no disregard for my health and safety or of the WGs I visit. (A lot of replies to my posts helped me pen this self-definition).  :thumbsup:

My first experiences of depression and anxiety were in my teens (I'm in my late 30's now) and were put on a number of different medications and counselling to help with this. Initially, they did help but I knew deep down that life experiences were crucial to building my self-esteem and confidence. I lost my virginity at age 19 to a girl I barely knew at a house party and it was bareback (possible link?) and soon after that, I had my first girlfriend who I met via an online chatroom. We dated for 6 months and this girl loved watching porn and insisted on receiving CIM etc. which was great at the time but did not help with my growing opinions of sex/women/relationships etc. The girl ended up cheating on me a number of times and expressed how her 'ex lovers' all had large dicks and I just did not satisfy her. This, in turn, made me depressed and distraught, my self-esteem plummeted. My first 'Punt' came a few months after that R/S ended.

Growing up in central London, I always got curious about the numbers in the phone boxes and decided to call one up and visited the address they told me on the phone which was near Goodge St station. The whole experience was surreal at the time, a maid greeted me and I waited in a room for 3 different girls to enter, one by one, to greet me when I had to choose. I chose the skinny/slim one with piercings and went with her to a different room. I vaguely remember the actual punt but I know I did not last long. A blowjob and doggy style, all with a condom. I remember chatting to the girl after and tried to get her number because we both had piercings and she wanted to know where to get them in the area but said she can't leave and did not have a phone. She was Hungarian. I was so naive to even think she was trapped in this life. We hugged and shared a kiss as a left.

This must have been around the early 2000's and I think both of these factors inspired my punting lifestyle ever since. A) The first GF who dumped me for being "too small" and B) the first punt who I had a genuine connection with. That's my own psychological analysis of my punting habit and one I have spoken to a number of therapists about who have somewhat agreed.

After my first punt, I did not punt again for another year after being unsuccessful in attracting another GF and the punting started to become more frequent. Towards the end of Uni, I got into an LTR that lasted for several years and I thought my punting habit was gone. Once that R/S ended, a long time friend I sometimes went to punts with back in the day, was still doing it and that whole world was mine to explore again but it seemed even more accessible with forums like this and sites like AW.

I have worked out over the last 5 years that I have spent £7,540 on punts. I'm pretty good at recalling them, so there could be a few omissions. The last 2 years, I have logged them so I know they are exact. Around 70% were with Romanians/Hungarians, 20% British, 10% Other. I would say 40% were bareback and the average spend was £60 a punt. The most I ever paid for a punt was £120 for 1 hour. The cheapest I ever paid for a punt was £30 and it was my best punt ever.

I have never been a fan of strip clubs because they make me sexually frustrated. I stopped viewing Porn about 4 years ago for the same reasons, it would trigger me to punt even more often or viewing Porn would not make me erect. Despite this, I still masturbate 1-3 times a day without fail and I use my imagination (if I'm not punting).

Before my LTR of many years, punting did not feel like it was out of my control. I remember going to clubs, pubs etc and getting off with women, even getting laid, using online dating etc. Punting was always like the last resort, the odd occasion where I couldn't take blue balls anymore. After my LTR and entering the punting world again is where it began problematic after 1 year.

For the last 5 years, I have been punting on average once a month - in the last 2 years it would be once a week. For someone who only earns £18k a year and living in London, it's not a viable habit and has racked up debts on credit cards (£2,000 here, £3,000 there).

This year, I attended a Sex Annonymous meeting because I felt like it would help with my punting habit that was out of control but the majority all had a problem and issues with pornography, which I just could not relate to. I went back to one more meeting but found it to severely trigger my punting habit and did not go back, opting for some CBT (Cognitive Behaviour Therapy) instead.

The therapy helped, especially talking more in-depth about my punting habit and how it's related to my low mood, depression, low self-esteem.

I understand that from reading other posts on this forum that most of you are like I was in the 2000's - punting is a healthy 'hobby' that is within your control. For me this current decade we are in, it has been the opposite. It has tormented me. It has ruined friendships, potential relationships where I have tried to form and been close to but have sabotaged them and returned to punting.

I have only done bareback with WG's in the last few years and before that, I would never ever consider it. That is why I link it to my mental health issues because it's a huge risk and what my therapist labelled as 'slow suicide' or 'subtle suicide'. 2018 has given me some huge rude awakenings that I needed so desperately. I have lost count on how many evenings (usually Friday's) where I have curled up in my bed fighting the urge to punt without the ability to do anything else (watching TV or playing a game or something) because I was just overtaken with a compulsion to punt.

Out of the 200 or so punts I have been on in the last 2 years, I have been to about 200 more - where I have walked out. Sometimes, the 'fix' I get is in the setup and the sex or sexual act is just a bonus.

It's a typical addiction cycle of Acting Out > Guilt/Regret > Shame/Depression > Stress > Acting Out etc. - Punting in the last 18 months has been a stress response to anything. If I have had challenges at work, I'll punt. If I got rejected on a date, I'll punt. If my mood felt a little low one day, I would punt and it would get more common and out of control.

The last 2 months, I have been re-reading notes I had made in the mid 00's from reading books like 'The Game' by Neil Strauss and many others, which helped raise my self-esteem and seduction skills (it's how I seduced the GF I had a very long-term relationship with). To me, punting feels like 'Anti-Game' and I am sorry if that offends anyone reading this. For the first time in years, I feel like I have found some light at the end of the tunnel.

I would love to hear your thoughts on my post, I appreciate the honest feedback but let's keep it respectful even if there are disagreements. This post has come from the heart and I apologise if it's not easy to read but I am not the best at communication.  :hi:


vw

  • Guest
My thought are this might get more response on  the main board, can be moved if you want.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Yes, please do. I posted here as it's the only place I have posted other than reviews in the past.

Stortford

  • Guest
I like a punt but have other hobbies playing golf watching sport football cricket golf think you need a hobby/interest i have had depression anxiety and a couple of times horrible feeling all the best to you.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 01:41:46 pm by Stortford »

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

I like a punt but have other hobbies playing golf watching sport football cricket golf think you need a hobby/interest i have had depression anxiety and a couple of times horrible feeling all the best to you.

Thanks for your reply. I have many hobbies, I should have pointed out but they began to fade away as punting became the one and only hobby I felt compelled to do. It's a horrible feeling to feel 'nothing' for hobbies you have treasured for many years.

Stortford

  • Guest
The other thing is getting a dog I live out in a nice area good exercise meet other dogs walkers there always happy to see you :D

Offline Crazydave

Sounds like sex addiction to me. Google sex addiction therapists and get some help if it's effecting your life and mental health.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 03:01:33 pm by Crazydave »

Offline hungrypunt

With any mental health issue there are a myriad of things that can help or hinder. Your punting is just one of those where you initially think it helps. None of us here can give you accurate helpful responses on that part but for the punting part, Id say just try and enjoy it for what it is. The bareback thing you need to stop , you havent said how many STis you have had, but this needs to stop.

If it makes you feel better, punt, if it doesnt stop, save your cash regroup and come back when you have regrouped. I expect your docs and counsellors have told you about meds, eating healthy, excersise etc. Give it a go, for weeks and months not days and give up. Youll be surprised at the minds ability to "reboot" if given the right time and tools to do so.

No porn, no wanking, no drugs, blah blah, tough at first but like anything the first steps are the hardest. Only you can help you, we can give shot advice but its down to you. Usually inside most people know what is needed but fo various reasons cant follow it through. I mean if you work a full time job its not easy to "cut off" for a month. Or if your addicted to booze or drugs , Same.

In posting your message seems like your trying to back heel it, so I hope you stick at it and come back stronger.


Offline hungrypunt

The other thing is getting a dog I live out in a nice area good exercise meet other dogs walkers there always happy to see you :D

Cant beat a bit of dogging :)

Offline Bogof60

The other thing is getting a dog I live out in a nice area good exercise meet other dogs walkers there always happy to see you :D

Sounds like the OP needs to get himself together before taking on the added responsibility of a Dog.

They are for life you know not just for therapy.
Banned reason: Abuse of a mod.
Banned by: daviemac

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

With any mental health issue there are a myriad of things that can help or hinder. Your punting is just one of those where you initially think it helps. None of us here can give you accurate helpful responses on that part but for the punting part, Id say just try and enjoy it for what it is. The bareback thing you need to stop , you havent said how many STis you have had, but this needs to stop.

If it makes you feel better, punt, if it doesnt stop, save your cash regroup and come back when you have regrouped. I expect your docs and counsellors have told you about meds, eating healthy, excersise etc. Give it a go, for weeks and months not days and give up. Youll be surprised at the minds ability to "reboot" if given the right time and tools to do so.

No porn, no wanking, no drugs, blah blah, tough at first but like anything the first steps are the hardest. Only you can help you, we can give shot advice but its down to you. Usually inside most people know what is needed but fo various reasons cant follow it through. I mean if you work a full time job its not easy to "cut off" for a month. Or if your addicted to booze or drugs , Same.

In posting your message seems like your trying to back heel it, so I hope you stick at it and come back stronger.

Thanks, I wasn't posting for help as I don't feel like I need saving as I feel a lot different now than when I did a few months to a year ago. I would say I am in recovery, which is still a dangerous place to be but at least I feel in control and not out of control. My purpose in posting here is to see if anyone could relate to these issues.

Also, I'm interested if anyone has experienced 'the game' and the whole seduction community which is like the polar opposite to this community. Both full of positives and negatives.

I discussed sex addiction at length with my most recent therapist but she came to the conclusion that it is not because, typically the sexual acts would be a 'bonus' of the punting and I had no addiction to porn. It could be an acute sexual addiction however, but I see it as more of a behavioural addiction/flight or fight response.

I'm against traditional meds and have tried exercise/healthy diet which helps massively. I have BED (Binge Eating Disorder) and typically in my worse times that and the punting are out of my 'control', so I have gone from 22 stone 15 years ago to 13 stone 10 years ago to 22 stone again now. Knowing I have lost the weight before is some reassurance I can do it again. Taking each day as it comes.

I've not browsed porn for many years so that is not a problem but regular masturbation is. I'm currently reading a book called 'The Multiple Orgasm Man' which is redefining my perception of sexuality, especially as it suggests a man in his 30's should only be ejaculating once every 8 days at most (but the book also teaches you how to separate orgasm and ejaculation) which is fucking magic btw.

As I said before, the OP wasn't meant for advice seeking - I just wanted a discussion on the topic, even if it is a difficult subject for some people to address. I don't think punting is bad, it can be quite healthy but I doubt I am the only one who is punting due to a lot of negative issues.

Mental health needs to be discussed openly in order to combat it. If anyone has been through anything similar, please comment.

Offline Malvolio

OP - if you can't afford to punt then you shouldn't punt.  If you're racking up debt just to punt you have a serious problem.

I'd suggest avoiding any internet sites to do with punting, and doing physical exercise to increase endorphins in your system whenever you feel like having a punt.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Also, I want to add about STIs/STDs which I should have commented on in my OP.

Despite all the bareback sex, I have had and frequent checkups I have had, many clinics know me now, I've not had any STIs or STDs which is pretty fucking surprising right? I know sometimes they can be untraceable so, not saying I definitely haven't but I have not had any symptoms or have had anything come back in tests.

I still acknowledge that bareback sex wasn't wise and completely stupid thing to do and keep doing but I wasn't of sound mind. I worry how many other men are in this situation and perhaps are not as lucky as I have been.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

OP - if you can't afford to punt then you shouldn't punt.  If you're racking up debt just to punt you have a serious problem.

I'd suggest avoiding any internet sites to do with punting, and doing physical exercise to increase endorphins in your system whenever you feel like having a punt.

I agree. I'll be gone from here by Sunday, I just wanted to raise this discussion before I departed if I can help anyone else.

I have started playing more football and have also began kettlebell training.

Offline Chorley

Mate, you need to stop.the barebacking right now.
 You're playing Russian Roulette with yours and other people's health.
Get yourself some treatment. Look up.SLA ( sex and love addiction) as this is what I think you have.
Google local support groups for this. Your local Community Drug and Alcohol Team might also offer treatment or groups.

Best of luck. :hi:

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Thanks Chorley, I will look into SLA.

As for bareback I haven't done this in the last 4 months and I agree.

SlamBoy

  • Guest
Sometimes you've just got to decide to take responsibility for your own life and the lives of others. Stop thinking about yourself, and how you feel all of the time. There are so many people with real problems in the world. Ruminating over why you irresponsibly bareback hookers is not one of them. Decide not to do it and stick to it.

Try to be a little less self-obsessed and introspective. It doesn't make people interesting or indicate sensitivity, it is redolent of boring narcissists. It sounds like you have too much time on your hands and you use it to be self absorbed. Get busy with life and the present, take a second job, and your money problems will disappear and you will be too concerned with your responsibilities to keep focussing on the past and what makes you tick.

Basically, stop being such a fucking snowflake and grow up.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 08:41:46 pm by SlamBoy »

Offline hendrix

Good on you for speaking frankly about this. Best of luck with finding the right balance in life for yourself. It's not easy.

Offline Carl Adams

You've probs hit a nail on the head for several guys on here.

Sorry you've been through that and I hope you get to hook up with someone who gets where you're coming from.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Sometimes you've just got to decide to take responsibility for your own life and the lives of others. Stop thinking about yourself, and how you feel all of the time. There are so many people with real problems in the world. Ruminating over why you irresponsibly bareback hookers is not one of them. Decide not to do it and stick to it.

Try to be a little less self-obsessed and introspective. It doesn't make people interesting or indicate sensitivity, it is redolent of boring narcissists. It sounds like you have too much time on your hands and you use it to be self absorbed. Get busy with life and the present, take a second job, and your money problems will disappear and you will be too concerned with your responsibilities to keep focussing on the past and what makes you tick.

Basically, stop being such a fucking snowflake and grow up.

I agree and have thought of all of these points you make. I am struggling to fulfil my current job, nevermind a second job. I looked into the possibility of a second job with the hours I have spare and the extra tax would make little difference to my income. Plus, I feel like if I don't master control of my punting habit and the state of my mental health any extra income would go towards punting. I have tried to get busy with life, I have various hobbies and interests, I am a creative person who has many projects on the go...

...but your last line makes me assume that you have never experienced depression, anxiety or any form of mental health on a level that you can comprehend. I am my own worst critic and of course have told myself to grow up and stop being a snowflake for many years but came to realise that this was fuelling my own failure in making a significant change and I feel grateful to be aware of that.

However, I do feel that taking accountability is crucial in my situation as well as many others who relate to my OP. Changes in habit are crucial in steering the perception out of the habit (prison) that you have built for yourself. These habit changes can be anything, from taking a long walk to doing an activity (within reason) of energy levels that you do not usually do.

I have done this by cycling down the riverside and feeding the ducks. It's given me exercise, something to interact with that isn't punting and travel. Thank you for your comment and your attempt of good advice.

Offline hungrypunt


Basically, stop being such a fucking snowflake and grow up.

Complete bullshit/wankers comment
« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 01:34:17 am by hungrypunt »

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Good on you for speaking frankly about this. Best of luck with finding the right balance in life for yourself. It's not easy.

Thank you, I appreciate your comment. I agree the right balance is required and I feel I have made some big steps in the last few months.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

You've probs hit a nail on the head for several guys on here.

Sorry you've been through that and I hope you get to hook up with someone who gets where you're coming from.

Thanks, no need to be sorry for me but sometimes people go through this shit that can prevent or help others from going through the same despair. Onwards and upwards.

Offline CluckinBell

You need major positive lifestyle changes.

1 Better job/career
2 Solid healthy hobbies,sports etc
3 A girlfriend

Not saying these are miracles (probably cause more problems) but you seem stuck in a runt,same old stuff all year round.Maybe concentrate on achieving one of the above and see what happens

 

SlamBoy

  • Guest
Complete bullshit/wankers comment

Actually, not. Some people need TLC. Others need a good kick up the arse to stop themselves pontificating, dreaming and being self-obsessed. Maybe you're one of those too  :unknown:

Offline hungrypunt

good kick up the arse
Yeah thatll work  :lol: :lol:

a quick glance at your recent posts shows what type of guy you are.

ME ? Im not the one with a parasitic worm as an avatar.  :sarcastic:

Ill end this here, its taking the thread off track,  Ive made my point.

« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 12:25:54 pm by hungrypunt »

Offline Spencer Fobby

The OP has made a brave contribution and it's good to see something of this nature on the forum.   :drinks:
Banned reason: Abuse of mod.
Banned by: daviemac

Offline Moby Dick

I can relate to this.

Sex is addictive, whether shagging civvies of punting. The more you have the more you crave.
I was stupid when I was younger, took far to many risks. Fortunately I never caught anything, but was mugged/robbed twice, tyres slashed etc.

The key point is don't let punting be the only thing in your life. Treat it as a hobby amongst other hobbies. Stick to a sensible budget that you can afford.

And don't confuse paying for sex/companionship to having a relationship. This can be a costly mistake financially and emotionally and will definitely end in mental ruin, ie depression.

Offline freeze44


Sex is addictive, whether shagging civvies of punting. The more you have the more you crave.

The key point is don't let punting be the only thing in your life. Treat it as a hobby amongst other hobbies. Stick to a sensible budget that you can afford.

And don't confuse paying for sex/companionship to having a relationship. This can be a costly mistake financially and emotionally and will definitely end in mental ruin, ie depression.

Sound points there  :hi: Could be a range of things like drinking, sex or gambling that are the outlet for deeper issues. Hope the op get's the help he needs.

Offline bhudda

Actually, not. Some people need TLC. Others need a good kick up the arse to stop themselves pontificating, dreaming and being self-obsessed. Maybe you're one of those too  :unknown:

Cunt

Offline Brokenshed

I'm not qualified to comment on mental health issues and sexual compulsions, I do know the gym, swimming, makes me feel good.
Doesnt matter what your body shape is, fitness levels, slow I you start to see an improvement in yourself and feel better about yourself.
The endorphins after a good cardio session in gym, bike, running, rowing etc is fantastic.
I enjoy a punt, had some great ones, and shit ones, and will continue, but it's not working for you, but exercise will

Good luck

Online WKD123

An interesting post and one I had to read a few times to try and decide if it was a clever wind-up to get a reaction or a serious post.  I opt for the latter and on that basis, thanks for sharing your personal experience.   

As others have said, you won't find anyone on here qualified to help you get out of the fix you are in.  All good comments so far though in terms of if you start to look after yourself and concentrate on a goal to be fit and eat healthy it's amazing how it improves your positive outlook on life. If you could stabilise that part then maybe you could work towards regulating punting to something you can afford and you enjoy. 

It would be a great help to fellow punters if you could list all the WGs who have offered BB, either on this thread or on the relevant thread in the forum.  That way, we can make sure to avoid them. One of the aspects of your post that made me think it might have been a wind up was the sense of "Russian Roulette" - waiting for what? catching a disease that in most cases you can cure? All you have done before (you say) you gave this up was create more risk for others and propagate the disgusting behaviour of those prossies prepared to offer bareback. Do us a favour and help in some small way to reduce their business .


Offline thor555

OP It’s good that you have put your issue here think it helps to talk about it and to discuss.
My punting hobby started due to bad mental health although I’m not sure I’m at the stage that I want to discus it.

 Punting did help me clear my head and gave me an escape from my day to day life, boring routine that never feels to end and the feeling of being trapped!

Post punt when you head is clear or wanting a punts always s good time think about things. I normally go for a pint after an evening punt and try and figure things out and get my head straight.

The more you talk to people about it the better it is I guess, think I might need to take my own advice...

Offline JonasG

Good thread. Punting does fuck with your head in one shape or form for everyone. And you don't realise this when you first get into it.

Honestly, if you have an addictive personality and you get into this when you're younger in your 20s and 30s, I think this hobby will fuck you.

I've met a great girl from work, been seeing her for 6 weeks. We get on really well, chemistry since the day we met. This could genuinely go somewhere. I'm 29 ftr.

But I've gotten bored of the sex life already cos of the punting and I've punted since I started seeing her. Cos of the variety and the need for that sex with a random girl and the thrill of it all.

Seems like to me punt when it dries up when in a decade+ relationship/marriage.

Because if you have that type of addictive personality, this hobby is dangerous.

Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Good thread. Punting does fuck with your head in one shape or form for everyone. And you don't realise this when you first get into it.

Honestly, if you have an addictive personality and you get into this when you're younger in your 20s and 30s, I think this hobby will fuck you...

I agree that punting at a young age can be worse. I honestly don't know how many exactly I have punted with but I would say it is between 150 to 200. However, I do know how many women I have had sex with that were not punts and that's 55. In contrast, I have an old friend who has only slept with 5 women (non-punt) but has punted over 100 times. I think, if punting is all you know from your 20's into your 30's (and you watch a lot of Porn) it can have a lot of negative effects on the mind.

OP It’s good that you have put your issue here think it helps to talk about it and to discuss My punting hobby started due to bad mental health although I’m not sure I’m at the stage that I want to discus it...

Thank you and I really appreciate you and others who can relate to my OP. Talking is good, even in private. DM me if you want.

An interesting post and one I had to read a few times to try and decide if it was a clever wind-up to get a reaction or a serious post.  I opt for the latter and on that basis, thanks for sharing your personal experience...

Ahh, I expected one to question the validity of my OP. Unfortunately for me it's all genuine. Thanks for your comments and advice.
On your last paragraph, I am not sure I can fulfil this. I have reviewed a number of WG's who I experienced BB with. The others, are not on AW anymore and the fact they change their names a lot means it will be hard to give enough information for others to avoid. I will point out that all my BB encounters were with WG's who listed it on their profiles, so surely that should be an avoidance in itself for those of you on the hollier path.

I'm not qualified to comment on mental health issues and sexual compulsions, I do know the gym, swimming, makes me feel good...

Thank you. I have been doing exercise lately and it does help and it has helped me in the past too. The problem I have however, is the consistency but it is something I am aiming to master by setting shorter goals rather than long term ones.

I can relate to this.

Sex is addictive, whether shagging civvies of punting. The more you have the more you crave...


Thanks for your comment Moby. You make a good point. I remember when I came out of my long term relationship about 4 or 5 years ago and I had not punted for about several years during it. Punting again was once every 3 months but it soon turned to once every payday. Then it was once a week and then 3 times a week. Credit Cards. 2 times a day sometimes. But it all seemed to happen to me unexpectedly. Like, I did not see the reality of the situation until much way further down the line and that's the scary part.


Offline Mr_X_Ldn

Thank you everyone for your comments  :hi:

I appreciate all the feedback, advice and those of you who relate to the issues I raised in my OP.

Whilst I would like to stay around here I feel it is best for me to depart but I won't delete my account. I hope to come back in the future with happier tales but for now, I feel like it would be best for me to not be around any potential triggers down the line because despite being in a strong and controlled frame of mind currently, I know how quickly and easily that can turn dark and downwards.

Before I go I just want to finish off on some positive notes...

I have just finished reading: The Multi-Orgasmic Man Book by Douglas Arava and Mantak Chia and it was pretty phenomenal. I would highly recommend it to every man and wish I had read it in my late Teens. If you want to learn how to have multiple orgasms, conserve your energy and last longer in bed whilst also changing your perceptions on sex (away from Porn and Social Norms/Culture) then read it. It may not be for everyone, but at least check out the synopsis.

I am a bit of a book worm and I have noticed a lot of people here are in dead relationships, hence the punting but I would also recommend Sex at Dawn Book by Cacilda Jethá and Christopher Ryan - a history of human sexual behaviours. Some fascinating insights in this book that may surprise you. The takeaway I got from it was that monogamy isn't natural for us humans. This lead me onto a book called Sex 3.0: A Sexual Revolution Manual by JJ Roberts. This is about how to redefine relationships so that they come from a place of love, rather than from a place of fear and deals with the subjects of monogamy vs polyamory to being in fenced or unfenced relationships.

Once again, I appreciate your comments and reading. I know it's going to be a long hard road for me from here on but I have already taken the first corner.

Happy punting, be respectful and stay safe.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2018, 10:54:43 pm by Mr_X_Ldn »