Six nations Rugby Union.

[mr.bluesky]

So the six nations Rugby starts on the 4th February. As an England fan I feel England's chances of winning it are so much better now that Steve Borthwick has replaced Eddie Jones as England coach. England under Eddie Jones were slowly going backwards with his results and team selection.  Jones always had his favourite players and often ignored the in form players, also played many out of their best position. France have to be slight favourites and Ireland have to be fancied too. Wales also have a new head coach in Warren Gatland so should show improvement over recent six nation tournaments. Italy have shown a marked improvement in results over the past 12 months but I would still expect them to finish bottom. England start with a home game against Scotland for the Calcutta cup which is held by Scotland. This will be the last six nations before the World Cup starts in France in September so should be a good benchmark to see how the Northern hemisphere teams are shaping up. I predict the six nations to finish as

1st: France
2nd. Ireland
3rd. England
4th. Wales
5th. Scotland
6th.  Italy

[MissWolf]

As a died in the wool Welsh supporter I'd like to argue that prediction but I'm not sure I can.

I do expect Italy to make more of an impact on the results than expected and wouldn't necessarily put them last this year.

Let's hope for a good tight fight all round 

[mr.bluesky]

As a died in the wool Welsh supporter I'd like to argue that prediction but I'm not sure I can.

I do expect Italy to make more of an impact on the results than expected and wouldn't necessarily put them last this year.

Let's hope for a good tight fight all round 

Yes there will be a lot of close games this year that's for sure. Even though I predict Italy to finish bottom they have had some great results the past twelve months and will not be push overs by any means. Wales have been unlucky with injuries in the past but with a great coach like Warren Gatland in charge will be tough to beat. I would fancy England to beat Wales if the game was at Twickenham but in Cardiff it's never an easy place to win. I thought Italy's win over Wales last year was the stand out match of the tournament ( sorry Misswolf that was one result you would prefer to forget. )

[MissWolf]

Yes there will be a lot of close games this year that's for sure. Even though I predict Italy to finish bottom they have had some great results the past twelve months and will not be push overs by any means. Wales have been unlucky with injuries in the past but with a great coach like Warren Gatland in charge will be tough to beat. I would fancy England to beat Wales if the game was at Twickenham but in Cardiff it's never an easy place to win. I thought Italy's win over Wales last year was the stand out match of the tournament ( sorry Misswolf that was one result you would prefer to forget. )

There are a few things I'd like to forget but that's life 

This year more than most is going to be a very interesting one,  an up and coming Italy alongside two of the big teams with new coaches, albeit Wales has a returning coach but still a change so close to a tournament like this is always a risk.

I never had faith in Pivac, he wasn't great at club level IMO so why they thought he could step up to national level I have no idea. The interesting thing is that returning coaches don't have a great history of repeating their initial success so I hope Gatland can buck the trend, he is already looking outside of the 'favorites pool' for talent which can only be a good thing but takes time to develop,  his eye I think is on the WC and the 6 nations is just a practice run.

I'm keen to see how the England changes will play out, I think imo the main issues around the English team are again the favourites pool and the attitude,  Farrell is imo an excellent player but his sulky little boy persona needs to go and he needs to put on his big boy pants when things aren't going his or England's way.

Interesting times Mr Bluesky 🤔

[ulstersubbie]

I would love to see Scotland win at Twickenham, but our rugby team is even worse than the football team and that's saying something. Like all Scots I live in hope!   

[mr.bluesky]

There are a few things I'd like to forget but that's life 

This year more than most is going to be a very interesting one,  an up and coming Italy alongside two of the big teams with new coaches, albeit Wales has a returning coach but still a change so close to a tournament like this is always a risk.

I never had faith in Pivac, he wasn't great at club level IMO so why they thought he could step up to national level I have no idea. The interesting thing is that returning coaches don't have a great history of repeating their initial success so I hope Gatland can buck the trend, he is already looking outside of the 'favorites pool' for talent which can only be a good thing but takes time to develop,  his eye I think is on the WC and the 6 nations is just a practice run.

I'm keen to see how the England changes will play out, I think imo the main issues around the English team are again the favourites pool and the attitude,  Farrell is imo an excellent player but his sulky little boy persona needs to go and he needs to put on his big boy pants when things aren't going his or England's way.

Interesting times Mr Bluesky 🤔

Owen Farrell needs to learn how to tackle properly 🙄  he was lucky to escape a six game ban for his last one. Sentence reduced so he could play in the six nations. A lucky boy

[mr.bluesky]

I would love to see Scotland win at Twickenham, but our rugby team is even worse than the football team and that's saying something. Like all Scots I live in hope!   

Surely they are not that bad. At least Scotland Rugby hold the Calcutta Cup. When was the last time your football team had their hands on a trophy. It stretches back further than the England football team 

[mikecee]

Can't provide any sort of link to this but I'm sure l read or heard something about South Africa wanting to leave the Rugby Championship and play in the six nations instead. 

[mr.bluesky]

Can't provide any sort of link to this but I'm sure l read or heard something about South Africa wanting to leave the Rugby Championship and play in the six nations instead.

Yes I've heard of this story too. Replace Italy who let's be honest despite recent improvements are the perennial wooden spoon winners. There was even rumours of Georgia replacing Italy. It would give the other teams more of a bench mark if South Africa joined the six nations.

[ulstersubbie]

Can't provide any sort of link to this but I'm sure l read or heard something about South Africa wanting to leave the Rugby Championship and play in the six nations instead.

That would be interesting, considering how many Boks have played for the home nations over the years eg Mike Catt.

[mr.bluesky]

That would be interesting, considering how many Boks have played for the home nations over the years eg Mike Catt.

South African teams play in the United Rugby Championships which has Irish, Welsh and Scottish teams so I don't see why not.   

[willie loman]

the way forward is an 8 nations, georgia and romania could be invited to join, its remarkable how underdeveloped rugby is globally, rugby betting used to be free money, but now every game is quite close.

[Matrix]

As long as we whip England again, I'd happily lose all the other games. 

[MissWolf]

Owen Farrell needs to learn how to tackle properly 🙄  he was lucky to escape a six game ban for his last one. Sentence reduced so he could play in the six nations. A lucky boy

Again I can't disagree with that, he was Eddie's favourite and got away with way too much, he has talent or he wouldn't be where he is but he needs to learn how to be taught and how to change because he thinks he knows it all atm

I wouldn't right Scotland off in the calcutta Cup they seem to come alive in that game.

I'm not sure bringing in a side like south Africa into the 6 nations would work, for me its about proximity, France and Italy work.

[mr.bluesky]

the way forward is an 8 nations, georgia and romania could be invited to join, its remarkable how underdeveloped rugby is globally, rugby betting used to be free money, but now every game is quite close.

I think 7 nations would work better, that would give each team 3 home games and 3 away games instead of the current imbalance.  I don't think Romania would be strong enough at the moment. They could be on the end of some heavy defeats. A second tier of 6 nations containing countries like Georgia , Spain  Portugal and Romania could be the way forward.

[willie loman]

I think 7 nations would work better, that would give each team 3 home games and 3 away games instead of the current imbalance.  I don't think Romania would be strong enough at the moment. They could be on the end of some heavy defeats. A second tier of 6 nations containing countries like Georgia , Spain  Portugal and Romania could be the way forward.

that sounds fair, but the way forward has surely to be making rugby a global game, with its complex rules and the possibility to inflict extreme violence , this has to be a game that the germans would love.

[mr.bluesky]

that sounds fair, but the way forward has surely to be making rugby a global game, with its complex rules and the possibility to inflict extreme violence , this has to be a game that the germans would love.

Yeah, can't understand how it has never really taken hold in Germany 
You only have to see the improvement in countries like Japan and Argentina.  A lot of British players are now playing in Japan. It seems that is where to go to make some big bucks.

[willie loman]

Yeah, can't understand how it has never really taken hold in Germany 
You only have to see the improvement in countries like Japan and Argentina.  A lot of British players are now playing in Japan. It seems that is where to go to make some big bucks.

we rightly deplore the awful corruption of fifa, but football has truly become global since the 66 world cup, progress in rugby is remarkably slow.

[timsussex]

the problem with a 2nd division would be the need to have promotion relegation and IIRC any chances to 6 nations require a unanimous vote and Italy wont be agreeing anytime soon. If they do then we could be seeing the end of the annual Calcutta cup

[mikecee]

External Link/Members Only

[mikecee]

If South Africa join the 6 nations maybe Japan could replace them in the rugby championship.

[mr.bluesky]

If South Africa join the 6 nations maybe Japan could replace them in the rugby championship.

Japan would be a good replacement for South Africa in the Rugby championship . They only lost to New Zealand by 7 points recently and have improved no end in recent years although they did get a bit of a walloping by England at Twickenham in the recent Autumn international. I do love watching Japan play Rugby . They play with energy and intensity .  In fact I prefer watching Japan to South Africa who try and stiffle the life out of the opposition.  Japan play Rugby with a fearless gung ho attitude . Always entertaining to watch 

[chrishornx]

the problem with a 2nd division would be the need to have promotion relegation and IIRC any chances to 6 nations require a unanimous vote and Italy wont be agreeing anytime soon. If they do then we could be seeing the end of the annual Calcutta cup

not so..... if either got relegated they could play it in the autumn international fixtures

[mr.bluesky]

not so..... if either got relegated they could play it in the autumn international fixtures

True, even though its part of the six nations tournament if either Scotland or England were to finish bottom and get "relegated " the game could still be played in the Autumn international period as a one off due to its historic element. The Calcutta Cup is here to stay

[chrishornx]

If South Africa join the 6 nations maybe Japan could replace them in the rugby championship.

External Link/Members Only

Not convinced SA will be joining

[bigden40]

Not any time soon.

BUT the northern hemisphere is much much wealthier than the southern, TV money generates a lot more, crowds are bigger and South Africa fits the European time zone better than it fits with Aus/NZ and Argentina.

The demand will remain in the background for now but I can see it happening a few years down the line as their provincial teams are embedded in United Rugby Championship and the European Cups.

A broader restructuring of the 6N into a 2-tier competition with play-offs in the first instance and promotion/relegation longer term is also inevitable IMO.  I give it 5 years until it happens.

[mr.bluesky]

External Link/Members Only

Not convinced SA will be joining

No according to the Ruck website Ben Morel ceo of the six nations says there are no plans to replace Italy with South Africa in the six nations

[bigden40]

No according to the Ruck website Ben Morel ceo of the six nations says there are no plans to replace Italy with South Africa in the six nations

No plans =/= no discussions. 

Don’t think incorporating SA would necessarily come at the cost of losing Italy anyway. 

7 team league = 3 home and 3 away fixtures.  A second division of Georgia, Spain, Portugal, Romania and 3 others (Russia, Belgium and Switzerland on current rankings but conceivably Netherlands, Poland or Germany instead) would be a great way to expand the game in Europe. 

The Southern Hemisphere competition would do well to incorporate Fiji, Samoa and Tonga properly in an equivalent expansion.

[mr.bluesky]

There are a few things I'd like to forget but that's life 

This year more than most is going to be a very interesting one,  an up and coming Italy alongside two of the big teams with new coaches, albeit Wales has a returning coach but still a change so close to a tournament like this is always a risk.

I never had faith in Pivac, he wasn't great at club level IMO so why they thought he could step up to national level I have no idea. The interesting thing is that returning coaches don't have a great history of repeating their initial success so I hope Gatland can buck the trend, he is already looking outside of the 'favorites pool' for talent which can only be a good thing but takes time to develop,  his eye I think is on the WC and the 6 nations is just a practice run.

I'm keen to see how the England changes will play out, I think imo the main issues around the English team are again the favourites pool and the attitude,  Farrell is imo an excellent player but his sulky little boy persona needs to go and he needs to put on his big boy pants when things aren't going his or England's way.

Interesting times Mr Bluesky 🤔

I think Welsh Rugby shoot themselves in the foot with this ridiculous 60 cap rule ( not picking players who play for  clubs outside of Wales unless they have won 60 caps) Domestic Welsh Rugby is in a bit of a mess at the moment and there's going to be an exodus of players leaving Welsh clubs because they can earn more money playing elsewhere . Garland wants this rule looking at. Clubs like Cardiff,  Ospreys, Dragons and Scarlets will have great difficulty holding on to their best players who are going to go where the money is 

[mr.bluesky]

A cracking game of Rugby.  Scotland retain the Calcutta Cup 29-23 . Looks like I'm going to need to re think my finishing order prediction 
Ireland as expected beating Wales. Van der Merwe's try for Scotland must go down as one of the best tries scored at Twickenham

[Coriniumstud]

Instead of having this 6 nations crap year after year why don’t they have a proper European Championship

[mr.bluesky]

Instead of having this 6 nations crap year after year why don’t they have a proper European Championship

Because apart from the six European nations in the home nations championships none of the others would be strong enough to give any of them a game with the exception of Georgia. The six nations is a big money making tournament and one of the oldest International Rugby tournaments in the world.

[ulstersubbie]

A cracking game of Rugby.  Scotland retain the Calcutta Cup 29-23 . Looks like I'm going to need to re think my finishing order prediction 
Ireland as expected beating Wales. Van der Merwe's try for Scotland must go down as one of the best tries scored at Twickenham

Fantastic result for us, albeit with help from an honorary Boer!  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[mr.bluesky]

Fantastic result for us, albeit with help from an honorary Boer!  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

Yeah, I thought that was a strange accent for a jock    bloody SouthAfricans come back to haunt us again at Twickenham 

[ulstersubbie]

Yeah, I thought that was a strange accent for a jock 

 

[mr.bluesky]

Hopefully the rest of the six nations games live up to this one.

[timsussex]

now we understand - they just wanted to spare Delilah the embarrassment of that first half   

[Stevelondon]

Great match at Twickenham today. Great atmosphere.
See the way VAR is used in Rugby.
FA take note.

[chrishornx]

Instead of having this 6 nations crap year after year why don’t they have a proper European Championship

what is the six nations if not a European championship - how would you change things?

[berksboy]

A cracking game of Rugby.  Scotland retain the Calcutta Cup 29-23 . Looks like I'm going to need to re think my finishing order prediction 
Ireland as expected beating Wales. Van der Merwe's try for Scotland must go down as one of the best tries scored at Twickenham

I think it will be the try of tournament , his 2rd may well be the runner up ! Was a great game for sure even if we lost.

[Coriniumstud]

what is the six nations if not a European championship - how would you change things?

Add other European countries and use the Football format of group stages then knockout

[berksboy]

Its not football and lets keep it that way please.

[Watts.E.Dunn]

Its not football and lets keep it that way please.

Second that!!!

[Coriniumstud]

Its not football and lets keep it that way please.

That’s right it will never be the beautiful game

[mr.bluesky]

That’s right it will never be the beautiful game

No it's a real man's game, not played by overpaid prima Donna's  who roll about the floor screaming like a baby when they get a little tap on the ankle 

[mr.bluesky]

Add other European countries and use the Football format of group stages then knockout

We have that,  but add other world countries. Its called the Rugby Union World Cup. ( its starts in November in France)

[chrishornx]

Add other European countries and use the Football format of group stages then knockout

the European football format is not viable in Rugby as football championships  have 3 group stage games in 9 days which isn't really feasible in rugby . Then they have the knockout stages all in one country

Are you suggesting we replace the 6 nations with some tournament where England may play Spain , Georgia and Scotland in the group stages and then knock out games all in one country?  that would mean no games at Twickenham in the championship - not very practical

[mr.bluesky]

Italy running France close today. It's going to be a tough game for England next week at Twickenham.  Italy no longer the whipping boys of the 6 nations.

[timsussex]

Italy running France close today. It's going to be a tough game for England next week at Twickenham.  Italy no longer the whipping boys of the 6 nations.

There have been many false dawns for Italian rugby but I must admit this one looks like it might be the real deal.
England are of course the only side that has never lost a game to Italy that looks like a difficult record to hold onto but the fact that its Twickenham might give England the edge

[willie loman]

the European football format is not viable in Rugby as football championships  have 3 group stage games in 9 days which isn't really feasible in rugby . Then they have the knockout stages all in one country

Are you suggesting we replace the 6 nations with some tournament where England may play Spain , Georgia and Scotland in the group stages and then knock out games all in one country?  that would mean no games at Twickenham in the championship - not very practical

these are not insurmountable problems, the fact is rugby will eventually become a global game, but boy progress is remarkably slow.