AW's philosophy

[bob_mm]

Hey. Wanted to ask some questions to members who have UK punting experience under their belt as opinions are more informed due to the duration of being "in the game". I currently use agencies (Diva mainly) and AW along with UKP. Before UKP, I had utter shit punts 95% all the time on AW so UKP really helps me out - thanks to the members of UKP and the team at UKP  - but for the other (90%+ I assume) proportion of punters who don't have UKP, 
I recently started using Chrome plug-in and that helped me improve AW usability. Also, stumbled on m.adultwork new site (I assume they will make transition at some point) which is more usable but it isn't fully functioning ready, so I can't make the change yet but it is more palatable to use.
That said, I was wondering how members who have seen AW grow throughout years think it is developing. I browse the forum and often I read stuff to tune of "yeah fake profiles exist, yeah B&S on a few profiles etc, but AW is the best we have access to and when combined with UKP, can protect yourself from disaster." I agree that with UKP, you can prevent calamity in most cases. But it just shocks me that the team at AW give little care to punters' concerns, especially when understanding that majority of punters don't have access to the information gold on this forum! I see the UKP "AW Scam" thread where our community members expose fake profiles and report to AW, but AW really have no incentive to remove fake profiles to be honest as the non-UKP AW users will still use the platform, get baited, go to a punt but will have no care whether the WG was as advertised etc because "that's how it's supposed to be, and I can't do anything about it". So, we have what we have. It seems like a near-monopolist doing what thy want because they can do what they want...
Is this more or less AW's philosophy? For me, profile legitimacy - "you get what you see" - is very important alongside correct search outputs. What intricacies do you find you don't like about AW? I am not expert, but some people don't like no phone numbers showing etc.
Thanks to everyone. If this thread belongs somewhere else, please feel free to move it. I was recommended to start a new thread for this discussion. Good everning.
 

[ragged]

Paragraphs, my friend!  For the love of God, paragraphs!

[Spacecowb0y]

You lost me after "hey"

[alabama1]

You lost me after "hey"

Ditto ! 

[bob_mm]

You lost me after "hey"

Apologies for the poor wording and layout. Can be more formal in the future. 

[lewisjones23]

Apologies for the poor wording and layout. Can be more formal in the future. 

just getting to the point would be more helpful

[jamiekinkxxx]

Hope I understood what you are after?! 

AW is what it is, very hit and miss but with plenty of gold nuggets within it.

I think the basic platform is OK (not used the chrome plug-in and I actually do not like the mobile app). You just need to do your research and I think it is quite good for that:

- Use the various filters, tick boxes and key word searches. You have plenty of options on the other tabs your can filter on off the 'main page' too. They are not going to be perfect but they are quite comprehensive
- Find the SPs you like the sound and look of from the initial results... I normally scan through and just pick the ones where the thumb nail pictures draws me in (yes I may miss a gem this way but I am not opening every profile in my search results)
- Filter down that further by reading the profiles properly and viewing any additional pictures... maybe even worth spending a few credits on private gallery if it isn't expensive to help with this
- Read the AW reviews / feedback which may immediately knock a few promising ones out.
- Then the important bit, cross ref your shortlist to reviews on UKP, this will again lead to further discards.

As for the telephone #'s not being displayed, that isn't AW's fault other than I believe there is a 'cost' to SP to do so. Some escorts on AW are also v part-time so will probably prefer to read messages rather than having constant calls / messages whilst in their day job so I can understand why many may not list their number. Others I know for a fact, prefer an 'introduction' as a way to gauge whether they want to move forward with talking about a booking. Not something that can be easily done via a message.

Finally, I am not sure what their 'philosophy' is other than being a platform for SPs (escorting, cam and chat) and to make money.

For me, other than agencies and X (plus FetLife and ProDomme listing sites for kink) I do not use other platforms such a vivastreet (which I just find awful and from reviews the quality isn't even as good as the hit and miss AW listings).

[bob_mm]

AW is what it is, very hit and miss but with plenty of gold nuggets within it.

Fully agreed, but this is UKP-dependent. What I mean is that my experience without UKP, even visiting 'high-AW-feedback' WG's (and yes, I know feedback is mostly fake), has been really hit and miss (more misses honestly, especially appearance wise). I haven't had a lot of AW experience though.

- Use the various filters....
- ...Read the AW reviews / feedback which may immediately knock a few promising ones out.

From the selection process you describe, I basically follow that minus the part where I buy private gallery photos. I don't believe in paying for photos so it's more of a 'me' thing, but thanks for that piece of advice. I mean, out of the steps you outlined, the one which is most important is the UKP part. If you discarded the part where you look for reviews of WG on UKP, what happens is that your punt success rate takes a severe hit, i.e filtering for services, looks etc is good, but without UKP it doesn't really mean a lot..

As for the telephone #'s not being displayed, that isn't AW's fault other than I believe there is a 'cost' to SP to do so.

I agree with what you say about phones. I think what I mean is that (perhaps, although this is an assumption) WG's may not want to pay to display a phone number and hence don't display it because there is a price to it. It isn't AW's problem that SP's don't want to pay, but it is AW who made the decision for phone numbers to be non-displayable by default.

When I am talking about 'philosophy', these nuances are kind of what I mean. For example, is AW's philosophy is to provide punters with highest satisfaction possible, they can change things about platform (i.e be more proactive in removing fake profiles, taking into consideration punter queries, etc) i.e employ a customer-centric approach towards punters. Yet, at least from what I gather when interacting with our community members, they are a commercial machine and just want to reap profits, preferring them over punter satisfaction. The phone number issue is in accordance with their commercial 'philosophy' - they could make SP's post phone numbers for free, truly due to whether they want to or not, but they introduce certain monetary restrictions for a phone number to be revealed. Who are they catering to? What is their mission? 

For me, other than agencies and X (plus FetLife and ProDomme listing sites for kink) I do not use other platforms such a vivastreet (which I just find awful and from reviews the quality isn't even as good as the hit and miss AW listings).

Same over here. Mostly agencies for me. Thanks for response, Jamie. 

[Blackpool Rock]

Fully agreed, but this is UKP-dependent. What I mean is that my experience without UKP, even visiting 'high-AW-feedback' WG's (and yes, I know feedback is mostly fake), has been really hit and miss (more misses honestly, especially appearance wise). I haven't had a lot of AW experience though.

From the selection process you describe, I basically follow that minus the part where I buy private gallery photos. I don't believe in paying for photos so it's more of a 'me' thing, but thanks for that piece of advice. I mean, out of the steps you outlined, the one which is most important is the UKP part. If you discarded the part where you look for reviews of WG on UKP, what happens is that your punt success rate takes a severe hit, i.e filtering for services, looks etc is good, but without UKP it doesn't really mean a lot..

I agree with what you say about phones. I think what I mean is that (perhaps, although this is an assumption) WG's may not want to pay to display a phone number and hence don't display it because there is a price to it. It isn't AW's problem that SP's don't want to pay, but it is AW who made the decision for phone numbers to be non-displayable by default.

When I am talking about 'philosophy', these nuances are kind of what I mean. For example, is AW's philosophy is to provide punters with highest satisfaction possible, they can change things about platform (i.e be more proactive in removing fake profiles, taking into consideration punter queries, etc) i.e employ a customer-centric approach towards punters. Yet, at least from what I gather when interacting with our community members, they are a commercial machine and just want to reap profits, preferring them over punter satisfaction. The phone number issue is in accordance with their commercial 'philosophy' - they could make SP's post phone numbers for free, truly due to whether they want to or not, but they introduce certain monetary restrictions for a phone number to be revealed. Who are they catering to? What is their mission? 

Same over here. Mostly agencies for me. Thanks for response, Jamie. 

I think you will find AW's philosophy is to make as much money for themselves as possible 

[lewisjones23]

I think you will find AW's philosophy is to make as much money for themselves as possible 

Exactly this

They are a business out to make money, they're not some sort of punters collective just trying to scrape by

[bob_mm]

They are a business out to make money, they're not some sort of punters collective just trying to scrape by...

To the two posters above, this seems to be the general impression of what I see regarding this question on the forum. It seems to me that punter satisfaction and monetary success of the platform should go hand in hand i.e if there is a site literred with fake indies, no matter what prices these fake WG's set, you probably won't return after a couple of times you got baited.

For example, I assume Apple (as in the tech company) takes user satisfaction super seriously. Look where they are now in relation to all other huge players. The one thing is that Apple needs this great customer satisfaction to thrive in the market due to extreme competition conditions. I guess the difference is that AW don't really have competition.

Thanks for input.

[scutty brown]

One thing to point out is that contrary to common belief AW are actually a lot more responsive to reports about fake profiles than is generally understood.
Both Bops909 and myself are seeing a pretty high success rate in getting fakes taken down (he's way ahead of me in numbers).
From what I can see, if you report a fake profile with stolen photos, and specify where the photos were lifted from then there's around an 80% probability the profile will be taken down within 24 hours. I've had several taken down recently within an hour.
Yes AW are pretty hard-nosed businessmen, but don't fall for the belief that they allow any crap on their website. Complain and prove the complaint and they'll act.
FWIW AW by any standards are much more punter-friendly than Vivastreet: your chances of getting a VS fake profile taken down are around 5%. Also VS never react to reports of trafficking, AW (on occasion) do.

[bob_mm]

From what I can see, if you report a fake profile with stolen photos, and specify where the photos were lifted from then there's around an 80% probability the profile will be taken down within 24 hours. I've had several taken down recently within an hour.

In the thread, I saw the high success rate you and Bops have in taking down profiles. Thanks for doing this important work! What protocols do they follow, however, to themselves determine which profiles are fake. It seems plausible that they do indeed take down profiles, but rely on seasoned punters to find these profiles. In essence what they are doing is then saying, "well, let our profile regulation be as is, but if someone reports a profile we will take it down", i.e there isn't a lot of interest from their end to determine fake profiles.

FWIW AW by any standards are much more punter-friendly than Vivastreet...

I assumed so. I've never used them but read around on the website. Very mixed experiences with VS for members, so I am not even taking them into consideration.

Thanks for the input. 

[bob_mm]

And, by the way, clarification to everyone reading. For myself, I highlight fake profiles as the largest issue about AW. That is the issue for myself, but other community members may find other aspects of the platform problematic. My point is that if you feel like there are other issues you face, it would be interesting to hear about them. I guess, the "fake profile" issue is very vanilla and has been discussed pretty extensively. 

[Steely Dan]

I'll state something obvious: Any changes to AW software etc does not change the fact that it is people on the end of it.  These people are escorts and they look like they look, and they provide the service and attitude that they do.  Same for agencies - these are just a way to find escorts.

I'd guess that half (or more) of the escorts in the UK are not value for money (for what I am looking for).  They either don't provide a key service (e.g. OWO, DFK) or they are not friendly enough.  Or not nice looking enough. Or impossible to book or annoying for other reasons. But when looking on what they say on AW or Max's Angels or Vivastreet, 90% meet my requirements.  All mislead. The trick to having more green experiences and less red experiences is to filter out the bad and also filter out the ordinary.  This takes spidersense, klingon guile and a whole lot of UKP. 

I think agencies are more reliable than AW.  But still very far from certain and cost more.  And hard to track girls since they change name at the drop of a hat.  So I find AW + UKP a better solution.  Though for a last minute plan B, agency is better.

But no changes to AW platform will make the escorts of the UK better.

[bob_mm]

... They either don't provide a key service (e.g. OWO, DFK) or they are not friendly enough.  Or not nice looking enough. Or impossible to book or annoying for other reasons. But when looking on what they say on AW or Max's Angels or Vivastreet, 90% meet my requirements.

 ...And hard to track girls since they change name at the drop of a hat...

But no changes to AW platform will make the escorts of the UK better.

Interpreting what you wrote you say that no changes will make escorts better. You say that majority of WG's are not VFM because of the reasons in the quotations. 2 of the 4-5 issues you write, however, can be controlled by the platform, be it an agency or AW. For example, if they mislead about services, perhaps platforms can be more stringent with girls listing their lists of "Likes". Comms with agencies are completely agency-dependent, on indie platforms in the girl's hands. Making it harder for girls to open profiles with new names is also controllable by the platform, I assume.

"Not nice looking enough" and "friendliness" are completely girl dependent, with the prior being unchangable (unless they do surgery) so I don't really see it as a problem in general because unfortunately we aren't going to get super-hot WG's at low prices, just as I can't acquire a Lamborghini for the price of a Vauxhall. "Friendliness" is unfortunately completely in WG's hands but if you use UKP, you can protect yourself from horrid experiences. You can't really do much about it except review transparency on the platform, however most platforms unfortunately allow fake reviews.

Overall, the issue for me is unmet expectations. I see a profile, and I agree to visit the WG in the profile i.e I expect her looks to be similar, things other people say about her in reviews, services etc to be representative of experiences described by others. If there is a mismatch, that is bad. But if the lady happens to be a 4 out of 10 in my preference scale, but I decided to punt her and she acts in accordance to her reviews, yes, I punted not the best looking lady but I was entering the interaction with no higher expectations.

Thanks for input.

[southcoastpunter]

AW is what it is! Discussion (or moans) on here won’t change anything! If you have changes that can be justified on business ( profit) reasons then message AW with your suggestions.

And you have to accept certain parts of the website is open to interpretation- for example the “likes” list! Some ladies take that to be what she likes doing not necessarily what she will provide! So why don’t AW change the heading to “provides” rather than “likes”? Maybe to get around prostitution laws in some countries ( I don’t know that as fact but I think it is a good guess)!

Wouldn’t life be wonderful if every lady on AW looked like her pics, provided all the services on her “likes” list, saw anyone of whatever race, and didn’t charge extras other than those listed on her profile! 

And provided her services with great enthusiasm and was VFM - ah but we wouldn’t need UKP then or have anything much to talk about.

We know the issues and problems with AW - do whatever is needed to make it work for you!

[bob_mm]

AW is what it is! Discussion (or moans) on here won’t change anything!

The aim of this discussion is for myself to achieve an understanding of different punters perspectives on AW drawbacks. I did not call for, and did not say my intent was to, contact AW with a list of things they should change. There are limits on PMs and I thought it would be interesting to receive punter's inputs. Especially those more experienced than myself i.e the majority of members. Apologies if intent came through otherwise.

Maybe to get around prostitution laws in some countries ( I don’t know that as fact but I think it is a good guess)!

Very interesting point. Haven't thought about that. Some girls write in profiles things to tune of "Anal - 40 pounds extra" etc. Would this be against prostitution laws in some countries? Point I am trying to make is that if your reasoning for 'likes' instead of 'provides' was true, i.e that AW is trying to not have law enforcement on their backs, wouldn't they have to ensure that profiles don't discuss extras as well?

Wouldn’t life be wonderful...

It would  .

...but we wouldn’t need UKP then or have anything much to talk about.

The community here is interesting. I'd like to think that if there were much less negative reviews, punters would still get together here and lead discussions/place reviews about all the positive experiences they are having, and other general questions.

Thanks for input. Have a good day. 

[scutty brown]

It's a definite fact that AW were regarded under USA law as facilitating prostitution and had to thoroughly sanitise their USA site to remove any suggestion of escorting. It's now just overtly a media sales and webcam site.

[scutty brown]

To an extent we, as punters, can affect the quality of AW.
It's simply a case of everyone reporting fake profiles. When you see a profile with a dodgy photo, find the source and report the details to AW. When the SPs realise that their income is at risk they'll begin to change their ways.
And it needs all of us to do this - not just Bops carrying out a one-man crusade, which is pretty much what's happening at the moment.

[JontyR]

AW's Philosophy

"I ching therefore I am"

With apologies to Descartes.

[8MillionDollarMan]

I think AW is excellent if you want to see how not to do it take a look at VS.

[bob_mm]

To an extent we, as punters, can affect the quality of AW.
It's simply a case of everyone reporting fake profiles. When you see a profile with a dodgy photo, find the source and report the details to AW. When the SPs realise that their income is at risk they'll begin to change their ways.

Do you approach finding photo sources by posting them into Google Images? I am a noob so I don't know what software you use for this. Also, how can this address the issue of profile sharing i.e a real WG has a legit account which she shares with other WG's (B&S) or sells to another WG (also B&S)?

Thanks for reply.

[bob_mm]

I think AW is excellent if you want to see how not to do it take a look at VS.

Thanks for the comment. I have seen other platforms and am thus asking specifically about the best one, AW. VS, Kommons, all the other crappy platforms I don't take into consideration. Thanks for the input.

[ragged]

Key thing to remember about AW:

Punters are NOT Aw's customers.
SPs are AW's customers.
Punters are the product they sell.

[jamiekinkxxx]

I think AW is excellent if you want to see how not to do it take a look at VS.

Agree, in that AW is far from perfect, but it is so much better than VS!

[bops909]

To an extent we, as punters, can affect the quality of AW.
It's simply a case of everyone reporting fake profiles. When you see a profile with a dodgy photo, find the source and report the details to AW. When the SPs realise that their income is at risk they'll begin to change their ways.
And it needs all of us to do this - not just Bops carrying out a one-man crusade, which is pretty much what's happening at the moment.

100% agree with this.

As punters, we definitely can affect the quality of AW.

If more people reported fakes in the way Scutty details, showing AW the source, more fakes would get taken down.

There's a limit to what a few people can do, we certainly have made a dent in the problem, and with a few more people doing it we could make a much bigger dent.

 

[advent2016]

Hey. Wanted to ask some questions to members who have UK punting experience under their belt as opinions are more informed due to the duration of being "in the game". I currently use agencies (Diva mainly) and AW along with UKP. Before UKP, I had utter shit punts 95% all the time on AW so UKP really helps me out - thanks to the members of UKP and the team at UKP  - but for the other (90%+ I assume) proportion of punters who don't have UKP, 
I recently started using Chrome plug-in and that helped me improve AW usability. Also, stumbled on m.adultwork new site (I assume they will make transition at some point) which is more usable but it isn't fully functioning ready, so I can't make the change yet but it is more palatable to use.
That said, I was wondering how members who have seen AW grow throughout years think it is developing. I browse the forum and often I read stuff to tune of "yeah fake profiles exist, yeah B&S on a few profiles etc, but AW is the best we have access to and when combined with UKP, can protect yourself from disaster." I agree that with UKP, you can prevent calamity in most cases. But it just shocks me that the team at AW give little care to punters' concerns, especially when understanding that majority of punters don't have access to the information gold on this forum! I see the UKP "AW Scam" thread where our community members expose fake profiles and report to AW, but AW really have no incentive to remove fake profiles to be honest as the non-UKP AW users will still use the platform, get baited, go to a punt but will have no care whether the WG was as advertised etc because "that's how it's supposed to be, and I can't do anything about it". So, we have what we have. It seems like a near-monopolist doing what thy want because they can do what they want...
Is this more or less AW's philosophy? For me, profile legitimacy - "you get what you see" - is very important alongside correct search outputs. What intricacies do you find you don't like about AW? I am not expert, but some people don't like no phone numbers showing etc.
Thanks to everyone. If this thread belongs somewhere else, please feel free to move it. I was recommended to start a new thread for this discussion. Good everning.
 

Can you or someone précis this into a few sentences? I couldn't make head nor tale after "Hey"

I probably use use AW more than any of other SP site. It's slightly better than other sites like VS,Kommons, etc.

Downsides.
The reviews are mostly worthless and often written by the SP themselves or friends.

Positives
You can put in your search criteria, distance and other details and get a list of SPs that might suit your needs.

[bob_mm]

If more people reported fakes in the way Scutty details, showing AW the source, more fakes would get taken down.

Thanks to you as well Bops! 

[bob_mm]

Can you or someone précis this into a few sentences? I couldn't make head nor tale after "Hey"

I probably use use AW more than any of other SP site. It's slightly better than other sites like VS,Kommons, etc.

Downsides.
The reviews are mostly worthless and often written by the SP themselves or friends.

Hello. In a nutshell, I was asking members of the community how has AW's attitude shifted to accomodate for punters over the years. Scutty and Bops interact with them frequently when exposing fake profiles and AW comply very well with these types of requests. It seems that AW has become more punter-centric than it was earlier.

The second question I had was regarding what disadvantages members think AW has. For myself personally, usability of the website is important, along with minimum fake profiles. Website of AW isn't the best in my opinion. What do you believe could be improved?

Thanks for reply.

[scutty brown]

from the usability point of view, don't forget that AW has four different alternative interfaces

External Link/Members Only        desktop version
External Link/Members Only       the proposed replacement site, in development
External Link/Members Only       supposedly optimised for tablet use
External Link/Members Only   mobile version

beside that there are several third party licencees who repackage part or all of the AW database, sometimes from a special interest point of view (e.g. specific geographic regions, fatties, big tits)

[bob_mm]

External Link/Members Only        desktop version
External Link/Members Only       the proposed replacement site, in development
External Link/Members Only       supposedly optimised for tablet use
External Link/Members Only   mobile version

Thanks for the links. I have already used the top three links you sent. AWLists is weirds and I believe the filter wasn't even working so I scrapped it. Plus, who scrolls looking for punts on an IPad?!

m.adultwork looks much more pleasant than old AW site but I believe the filtering functionality isn't all working yet.

[petermisc]

In essence what they are doing is then saying, "well, let our profile regulation be as is, but if someone reports a profile we will take it down", i.e there isn't a lot of interest from their end to determine fake profiles.

What are you expecting them to do?  Send round some "customer service agents" to check each girl out before they accept her ad?  Even agencies put up bad apples - there are no end of agency girls with negative reviews on here.

AW have improved their regulation considerably over the years, you only have to compare with the likes of VS.  However, they are treading a tightrope.  Yes, they should take down girls that are reported, but equally they have to be careful of malicious reports.  At the end of the day there has to be a compromise between customer satisfaction and making a profit.  Agencies are generally far more selective on who goes on their site, but that comes at a price.  If you are wanting AW to be more selective, and carry out far more vetting of ads, then that would come at a cost.

As to Apple being interested in customer satisfaction, that is a somewhat controversial view.  They keep getting regulated against for their restrictive practices and inflated prices.  Personally, I view their stuff as over-hyped and over-priced, aimed at the kind of fool that just has to have the latest designer gear.

[southcoastpunter]

I was agreeing with you petermisc right up to the point where you said “ the kind of fool that just has to have the latest designer gear”

Having a different view to you does not make someone a “fool” ! I might think you are a fool for having a different view / opinion to me, but I don’t. We are just different! That is all!

Btw - I don’t hanker after the latest iPhone etc but probably half the youngsters under about age 30 do! Are they all “fools”?? Plus whatever we think of Apples’s products, you have to give credit to their marketing strategies- they have cleverly created a brand that so many people want! So many other companies would give almost anything for branding like that!!

[petermisc]

I was agreeing with you petermisc right up to the point where you said “ the kind of fool that just has to have the latest designer gear”

Having a different view to you does not make someone a “fool” ! I might think you are a fool for having a different view / opinion to me, but I don’t. We are just different! That is all!

So in your view there is no such thing as a fool or an idiot?  No matter how ridiculous and outlandish their views are?

[southcoastpunter]

Someone with an EXTREME view might fall into that category- not everyone that disagrees with me or who I disagree with , otherwise you would fall into that category, and a lot of members who post pics on here of “what they consider fabulous ladies or great tits etc! We just have different opinions! I personally wouldn’t spend £60k on a car even though I can afford it. In my view a car is to get you from A to B in relative comfort - a £30k car will do that! But I don’t think anyone spending £60k is a fool. It’s personal choice and we are all different!

But I am beginning to wonder about you- you are either just being argumentative or arrogant beyond belief if you really think that anyone who disagrees with you is a fool!

[bob_mm]

Hello. Thank you for your input.

What are you expecting them to do?  Send round some "customer service agents" ...

For instance. The feasibility of such a solution is questionable (at scale in particular) but I am sure there are ways this procedure can be "sharpened" and therefore am asking members of the community about things like this. Maybe you know how to streamline it, wwho knows... .

...but equally they have to be careful of malicious reports.  At the end of the day there has to be a compromise...

Obviously, increasing quality, you compromise profit. That's a moral dillema for AW's owners. I am just asking about hypothetical ways to achieve solutions to very pertinent issues we have as punters. As regards to being careful of malicious reports, there are workarounds there as well. Not trivial, but nonetheless.

Thanks for reply.

[Colston36]

Apologies for the poor wording and layout. Can be more formal in the future. 

Formality is irrelevant.

Just start a new paragraph after each thought.

Otherwise yoiur messages can be like a trudge though a dreary desert.

If in doubt see how any popular newspaper expresses things.