Hypersonics and defence economics

[maxQ]

then show the links to your videos

Its hardly my videos, you can find them on twitter yourself, I assume you will call almost anything I post Russian propaganda 

External Link/Members Only

Fab bombs hitting Chasiv Yar

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Himars in Bakhmut

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More Fabs

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The easiest way to figure out what is going on is to follow the Military summary channel on youtube, he shows the most important videos each day and geo locates them to update the map

External Link/Members Only

New update in about 20minutes

[Squire Haggard]

There's scores of videos showing hundreds of Russian armoured columns being blown up by drones, artillery, and Javelin Anti-Tank Weapons. It appears almost suicidal to be in an armoured column, but they keep sending them.

A regular update from the Ukrainian side.

External Link/Members Only

[Squire Haggard]

No , Really,  I find that hard to believe 

 

[mills_and_bhuna]

There's scores of videos showing hundreds of Russian armoured columns being blown up by drones, artillery, and Javelin Anti-Tank Weapons. It appears almost suicidal to be in an armoured column, but they keep sending them.

A regular update from the Ukrainian side.

External Link/Members Only

The Ukrainian propaganda is about as reliable as the IDF.
Well funded by the good ol' US of A though.
And unfortunately by our  sorry excuse for a Government

[RedKettle]

But you don't engage, you make claims with zero evidence

What evidence ?

I thought you were trying to engage, I see little evidence of that either

We come at this from different perspectives. You and m and b are for whatever reasons fanatical and desperate to prove you are right in your support for Putin. You have no real knowledge of war so you look for little video clips that can be interpreted as proving the facts that you believe from some ridiculous sources. I checked some of the ones out that you quoted in the early days and they were child like.

I come at this with a very sound general knowledge of Russia, the old Soviet Union and military matters, including Russian and Soviet military doctrine over a considerable period. I have read and seen plenty on the current conflict and I am perfectly confident in my views, although always open to interesting, knowledgeable and different views. Yours tend to fail on the first two.

However I feel no need as you do to convince the world and no desire to write long thesis on here with referenced articles etc.

I would like normal respectful chat about the subject but we have a couple of loud month yobs who stamp their feet, throw out insults and generally try and bully anyone who does not want to lick Putin’s arse. If I do mention an article or such then  will be rubbished as MSM, a tool of US empire so some such rubbish.

So in the end like most other normal people I keep my head down and ignore the ignorant.

Is that enough engagement for you? Well enough explained by this retard?

[mr.bluesky]

The Ukrainian propaganda is about as reliable as the IDF.
Well funded by the good ol' US of A though.
And unfortunately by our  sorry excuse for a Government

It's like listening to a record that's got stuck
It's like listening to a record that's got stuck
It's like listening to a record that's got stuck
It's like listening to a record that's got stuck.

[Blackpool Rock]

Thankfully after a 6 month wait the US house of representatives finally approve an aid package for Ukraine 

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[mills_and_bhuna]

Thankfully after a 6 month wait the US house of representatives finally approve an aid package for Ukraine 

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Wall Street will be chuffed.
Ordinary Americans looking for investment in their infrastructure and housing not so much.

[mills_and_bhuna]

We come at this from different perspectives. You and m and b are for whatever reasons fanatical and desperate to prove you are right in your support for Putin. You have no real knowledge of war so you look for little video clips that can be interpreted as proving the facts that you believe from some ridiculous sources. I checked some of the ones out that you quoted in the early days and they were child like.

I come at this with a very sound general knowledge of Russia, the old Soviet Union and military matters, including Russian and Soviet military doctrine over a considerable period. I have read and seen plenty on the current conflict and I am perfectly confident in my views, although always open to interesting, knowledgeable and different views. Yours tend to fail on the first two.

However I feel no need as you do to convince the world and no desire to write long thesis on here with referenced articles etc.

I would like normal respectful chat about the subject but we have a couple of loud month yobs who stamp their feet, throw out insults and generally try and bully anyone who does not want to lick Putin’s arse. If I do mention an article or such then  will be rubbished as MSM, a tool of US empire so some such rubbish.

So in the end like most other normal people I keep my head down and ignore the ignorant.

Is that enough engagement for you? Well enough explained by this retard?

What a load of self-satisfied tosh.
You're the one stamping their feet and calling anyone who disagrees with you a Putin fanboy, a Kremlin shill , a useful idiot or whatever you've picked up from Western propaganda outlets.
If you don't mind I'll take the word of John Mearsheimer, Chris Hedges, Max Blumenthal, Aaron Mate, and actual journalists over the well remunerated hacks of our esteemed press corps and the politicians clamouring for more war .
Pro tip for you....If Boris Johnson, Keir Starmer, Rishi Sunak, Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton, and John Bolton all agree on something , that something is very likely to be a bad idea.
You'll notice they're all fine with genocide as well.

[PepeMAGA]

Thankfully after a 6 month wait the US house of representatives finally approve an aid package for Ukraine 

External Link/Members Only

Where's the end point for this? Russia' s economy is growing faster than everyone else and they can produce munitions 7 times faster.
Money will continue to be pumped in until it runs out then the same thing will happen anyway with tens of thousands more dead and the western economies in a worse state than the countries we're supposed to be hurting.
At some point there will need to be negotiated peace, so do it sooner rather than later.
Unless they're thinking they just have to hold on until Putin dies, but that might be decades away

[mills_and_bhuna]

Where's the end point for this? Russia' s economy is growing faster than everyone else and they can produce munitions 7 times faster.
Money will continue to be pumped in until it runs out then the same thing will happen anyway with tens of thousands more dead and the western economies in a worse state than the countries we're supposed to be hurting.
At some point there will need to be negotiated peace, so do it sooner rather than later.
Unless they're thinking they just have to hold on until Putin dies, but that might be decades away

You're starting to sound like a Putin fanboy 
Totally agree with what you've said.
Even they know Russian sentiment is behind Putin.
And difficult as it is to accept reality in the face of years of anti-Russian bollocks fed to us, Putin is as measured and rational a politician as you are likely to find within Russia with any support.
Let's face it.
Anyone who doesn't capitulate to American hegemony is going to find themselves painted as the next Hitler.
Basically the US is only going to be happy with a puppet . A Russian Quisling. Like Juan Guaido.

[PepeMAGA]

You're starting to sound like a Putin fanboy 
Totally agree with what you've said.
Even they know Russian sentiment is behind Putin.
And difficult as it is to accept reality in the face of years of anti-Russian bollocks fed to us, Putin is as measured and rational a politician as you are likely to find within Russia with any support.
Let's face it.
Anyone who doesn't capitulate to American hegemony is going to find themselves painted as the next Hitler.
Basically the US is only going to be happy with a puppet . A Russian Quisling. Like Juan Guaido.

Even if Putin is literally Satan, the question is the same, where does it end? Invade Russia and overthrow him?
Ukraine are making very little progress in retaking land and the latest 60 billion is only being routed as slowing Russia down... But slowing them down for what, the 100 billion next time?
Even if someone took over from Putin, chances are they would still support the people in Eastern Ukraine that believe themselves to be Russian and wouldn't give up Crimea either, so the war rages on.

[jackdaw]

Where's the end point for this? Russia' s economy is growing faster than everyone else and they can produce munitions 7 times faster.
Money will continue to be pumped in until it runs out then the same thing will happen anyway with tens of thousands more dead and the western economies in a worse state than the countries we're supposed to be hurting.
At some point there will need to be negotiated peace, so do it sooner rather than later.
Unless they're thinking they just have to hold on until Putin dies, but that might be decades away

You actually think this is hurting Western Europe and US more than Russia??

[PepeMAGA]

You actually think this is hurting Western Europe and US more than Russia??

I'll repost this
External Link/Members Only
It's hurting Russia more in terms of loss of life, but from an economy point of view not that much.
Sanctions seem to have been ineffective. Where american companies have pulled out, Russian ones have filled their place.
This isn't a pro Russian stance btw, but realistically this can go on for a long time for Russia, whereas it's spreading the finances and military resource of the West much thinner.
50k troops lost is obviously no small thing, but again, how much regard is there for that loss of life on the Russian side?

[Blackpool Rock]

I'll repost this
External Link/Members Only
It's hurting Russia more in terms of loss of life, but from an economy point of view not that much.
Sanctions seem to have been ineffective. Where american companies have pulled out, Russian ones have filled their place.
This isn't a pro Russian stance btw, but realistically this can go on for a long time for Russia, whereas it's spreading the finances and military resource of the West much thinner.
50k troops lost is obviously no small thing, but again, how much regard is there for that loss of life on the Russian side?

I think this was the previous point which was disputed, Russia has a long history of not giving a fuck about how many men get killed so long as they can keep finding more to replace them however it was questioned whether that is currently happening albeit not to the same extent of WW2

Where indeed does it all end 
Realistically if the West / Nato had got actively involved then the shitty Russian conventional equipment and tactics would have been wiped aside, remember those 40+ mile columns of stranded Russian vehicles in the early stages, what a fucking joke 

The only reason Russia wasn't wiped out (and I don't mean Russian soil I mean Russian troops in Ukraine) is the fact Putin has Nukes and if we had destroyed his conventional stuff then I guess there was a possibility he could / would have thrown his toys out the pram 

So here we are sending Ukraine another trickle of weapons which won't allow them to make significant advances or to win but should help to slow the Russian advance
I would agree it does prolong the war but the only other options would be to escalate it with the West getting actively involved which could end badly for everyone or to simply roll over and let Putin take whatever he wants

I don't agree with simply rolling over and letting Putin win in exactly the same way we didn't roll over and let Hitler win
Is the West stalling for time until there is enough weapons to give Ukraine so they can actually win, basically in the same way Churchill had to wait until things were ready and let Poland get invaded 

I would like to see some meaningful dialogue from Nato in the form of a solid statement that it doesn't intend to ever invade / take / capture any Russian territory whatsoever, I believe that has always actually been the case and we were never going to advance but perhaps it needs to be clarified
We would however immediately run into a problem that we would want the border to be drawn from a few years ago and possibly prior to Crimea whereas Putin would want whatever he's got now

Part of the problem here is that Putin displays a lot of the common traits that dictators have like paranoia and a deep down insecurity complex, it's hard to talk sense with these people, just like his followers on here who think he can do no wrong 

[maxQ]

Is that enough engagement for you? Well enough explained by this retard?

No, because you have still failed to show any evidence that the Russians are using human waves as a tactics, your only "evidence" is "trust me bro, I'm an expert", I sure that convinces many around here, but its of zero worth to me

[chrishornx]

No, because you have still failed to show any evidence that the Russians are using human waves as a tactics, your only "evidence" is "trust me bro, I'm an expert", I sure that convinces many around here, but its of zero worth to me

nor do your videos confirm your claims

evidence that the Russians are using missiles/bombs does not prove that they re using 'more' bombs it shows they are using some bombs. This is typical you just twisting things enough to suit your agenda. Nor doe say video prove your claims that the Ukrainian offensive was a total disaster

[maxQ]

evidence that the Russians are using missiles/bombs does not prove that they re using 'more' bombs it shows they are using some bombs. This is typical you just twisting things enough to suit your agenda.

I haven't twisted anything

If you are watch videos everyday, its clear that the Russian rate of bombing with Fab glide bombs has increased as the Ukrainian air defense has been eroded. I'm seeing less Lancet videos these days

The Ukrainians use a lot of FPV drones, those videos seem to be more or less constant

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The Western media are all saying the very same thing, its hard for them to ignore it

Nor doe say video prove your claims that the Ukrainian offensive was a total disaster

True, videos alone would not be proof, but it was a disaster, even without the videos, we know they lost most of their tanks/IFV and a huge number of men, and we know they didn't break the Russian lines and retake much territory

It was a disaster

[mills_and_bhuna]

. Nor doe say video prove your claims that the Ukrainian offensive was a total disaster

I think the recent capitulation to the neocons in the house vote to splurge another 61,000,000,000 dollars on this sham of a proxy war should tell you all you need to know about the success of the 'Spring Offensive'.
There again you never struck me as being particularly perceptive.

[mills_and_bhuna]

Part of the problem here is that Putin displays a lot of the common traits that dictators have like paranoia and a deep down insecurity complex, it's hard to talk sense with these people, just like his followers on here who think he can do no wrong 

Putin wanted peace talks and a negotiated settlement.
The Western leaders vetoed it.
Putin negotiated the Minsk 2 accords.
The Western leaders admitted they had no intention to abide by them..
Putin supports a ceasefire in Gaza.
Our lot have vetoed or abstained giving spurious excuses.
So our politicians are fine with 35,000 dead Palestinians and grovel at Netanyahu's feet.
We blew up the Nordstream pipeline.
Our unwillingness to verify who did it confirms this.
Yet Putin is the next Hitler.
Got it.

[cunnyhunt]

We blew up the Nordstream pipeline.

Please provide some irrefutable evidence for this claim.

[Blackpool Rock]

Please provide some irrefutable evidence for this claim.

Seeing as you reposted a comment from him i'd say that looks correct as in he's clearly on the Russian side so when he says "We" he means Russia 

[RedKettle]

Yet Putin is the next Hitler.
Got it.

I am ignoring the crap above the part I quoted because I know debating that with you is pointless, for whatever reason you have an agenda against western democracies and simply cannot listen to anything else.

However just on this point do you really not see the similarities between Putin and Hitler in the 1930s.  It is almost an identical playbook with the use of democratic means initially but then corrupting the system to stay in power. Taking control of the security forces and completely destroying free media and freedom of speech. The taking over of the judicial system so that there is no challenge.  Then starting foreign military adventures whilst convincing anyone foolish enough to believe it that these are isolated and justified.

You are clearly not a student of history but Putin certainly is.

[chrishornx]

I haven't twisted anything

Haven't twisted anything? You claim to pronounce things with complete certainty. Those videos do not unequivocally prove the Russians are using more glides

the idiot would be proud of how you continually just slightly twist things to suit your point

[mills_and_bhuna]

Please provide some irrefutable evidence for this claim.

Anyone with a functioning brain knows the US was involved.
Why would anyone blow up billions of dollars worth of their own infrastructure?
The US had the motive.
They have the knowhow.
They had made numerous threats in the past.
And it speaks volumes that the Swedes had opened an investigation and promptly closed it down.
Their conclusions were clearly not convenient for the narrative

[mills_and_bhuna]

I am ignoring the crap above the part I quoted because I know debating that with you is pointless, for whatever reason you have an agenda against western democracies and simply cannot listen to anything else.

However just on this point do you really not see the similarities between Putin and Hitler in the 1930s.  It is almost an identical playbook with the use of democratic means initially but then corrupting the system to stay in power. Taking control of the security forces and completely destroying free media and freedom of speech. The taking over of the judicial system so that there is no challenge.  Then starting foreign military adventures whilst convincing anyone foolish enough to believe it that these are isolated and justified.

You are clearly not a student of history but Putin certainly is.

I am quite familiar with the history.
Why not address the 'crap' I posted above?
Will it show you up to having double standards?
Are you proud of our government siding with an apartheid state currently engaged in the slaughter of innocent women and children?
Or are you going to say 'It's complicated'?

[maxQ]

Haven't twisted anything? You claim to pronounce things with complete certainty. Those videos do not unequivocally prove the Russians are using more glides

I gave you links to multiple sources all saying the Russians are dropping an increasing number of glide bombs, after that I can't help you, believe what you want

the idiot would be proud of how you continually just slightly twist things to suit your point

I'm not twisting anything, I have no interest in lying to anyone, I see no point to that

[Blackpool Rock]

Haven't twisted anything? You claim to pronounce things with complete certainty. Those videos do not unequivocally prove the Russians are using more glides

the idiot would be proud of how you continually just slightly twist things to suit your point

Lord Haw Haw would be proud of him 

[jackdaw]

I am quite familiar with the history.
Why not address the 'crap' I posted above?
Will it show you up to having double standards?
Are you proud of our government siding with an apartheid state currently engaged in the slaughter of innocent women and children?
Or are you going to say 'It's complicated'?

I suspect it’s a long time since any of us were proud of our government. Though I hope most of us love many things about our country.

Personally I think Israel has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path.

Do you agree that similarly Russia has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path? (After all Russia before they decided to invade Israel were provoked much less than Israel, and facing much lower external threats.)

[WASA38]

I suspect it’s a long time since any of us were proud of our government. Though I hope most of us love many things about our country.

Personally I think Israel has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path.

Do you agree that similarly Russia has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path? (After all Russia before they decided to invade Israel were provoked much less than Israel, and facing much lower external threats.)

Ukraine of course.
But +1

[RandomGuy99]

External Link/Members Only

[RedKettle]

I am quite familiar with the history.
Why not address the 'crap' I posted above?
Will it show you up to having double standards?
Are you proud of our government siding with an apartheid state currently engaged in the slaughter of innocent women and children?
Or are you going to say 'It's complicated'?

Great so you agree that Putin is very similar to Hitler, progress at last.

Not sure how I have double standards, I detest the current Israeli government and support calls for a ceasefire. I do support Israel’s right to exist. Do you support Ukraine’s right to exist as an independent country?

I an also capable of discussing Ukraine and Russia without having to throw in crap to divert the debate. Can you?

[Doc Holliday]

External Link/Members Only

Thanks that's a good (if somewhat highly depressing read) 

[PumpDump]

I do support Israel’s right to exist.

What does this even mean? Exist in what form? The 1967 borders? What would they do with the additional land the occupied since then? What happens to the Palestinians forced out of their homes?

[cunnyhunt]

Anyone with a functioning brain knows the US was involved.

The simple answer that you have no actual evidence would have been sufficient.

[PumpDump]

The simple answer that you have no actual evidence would have been sufficient.

What exactly do you expect him to show you?

[PepeMAGA]

This collects the major theories together
External Link/Members Only

[jackdaw]

What exactly do you expect him to show you?

Something that would make a reasonable person with no preconceived notions reasonably certain that the US ordered the strike. (Bear in mind that Mills and Bhuna has not been saying that US may have done…but is declaring with a high degree of confidence that they did do it.)

(Cunnyhunt…I’m guessing, of course, so please correct me if I’m wrong.)

[RedKettle]

What does this even mean? Exist in what form? The 1967 borders? What would they do with the additional land the occupied since then? What happens to the Palestinians forced out of their homes?

Ok so we have one of the most complex geo political (and religious) issues in the history of humans and you expect me to provide a workable solution just like that. Grow up and start thinking about issues rather than grandstanding and pretending you are billy big bollocks.

As anyone with two brain cells would know i cannot answer that but as a princpile i do believe that there should be a Jewish state after thousands of years of persecution. 

[RedKettle]

This collects the major theories together
External Link/Members Only

That is helpful summary, thanks.

[mills_and_bhuna]

Ok so we have one of the most complex geo political (and religious) issues in the history of humans and you expect me to provide a workable solution just like that. Grow up and start thinking about issues rather than grandstanding and pretending you are billy big bollocks.

As anyone with two brain cells would know i cannot answer that but as a princpile i do believe that there should be a Jewish state after thousands of years of persecution.

It's not complex.
Israel is a settled colonial project birthed by the remnants of our Imperial past.
We colonised the area with the French, drew pretty designs on maps (Sykes-Picot) with nice straight lines unhindered by trifles like giving a flying fuck about indigenous peoples and their concerns.
The Palestinians who had lived there for hundreds of years were given an ultimatum.
They understandably protested, and the Zionists took matters into their own hands.
They were better funded and better armed and carried out the Nakba.
These facts were conveniently looked over and the Palestinians have been paying the price for our collective Western guilt about the slaughter of Jews by fellow Christians ever since.
A one stage solution with safeguards in place for whichever group happens to be the minority would be preferable to an ethnostate  practicing apartheid and a gradual ethnic cleansing which is what we had until October 7, 2023.
Now we have that on steroids.
Einstein(definitely not an idiot) predicted this outcome.
A Jewish democratic state is an oxymoron.
Maybe you should read more Gideon Levy and Ilian Pappe and less Keir Starmer and Rachel Riley .
It's not complicated. The lobbyists obviously disagree.

[mills_and_bhuna]

This collects the major theories together
External Link/Members Only

Theory 1 is a joke.
Russia could have turned the gaps off any time.
Theory 3 fits all criteria.
Theory 4 was a blatant psyop  by Western intelligence to distract from the Seymour Hersh story.

[RedKettle]

Theory 1 is a joke.
Russia could have turned the gaps off any time.

Theory 1 has an explanation that counters your objection, did you not read it or not understand it?

Like all rational sane people I do not know who did it.  You are creating a certainty where there is none and on the back of your totally unjustified certainty calling other people idiots etc for not sharing your delusions.

[RedKettle]

It's not complex.
Israel is a settled colonial project birthed by the remnants of our Imperial past.
We colonised the area with the French, drew pretty designs on maps (Sykes-Picot) with nice straight lines unhindered by trifles like giving a flying fuck about indigenous peoples and their concerns.
The Palestinians who had lived there for hundreds of years were given an ultimatum.
They understandably protested, and the Zionists took matters into their own hands.
They were better funded and better armed and carried out the Nakba.
These facts were conveniently looked over and the Palestinians have been paying the price for our collective Western guilt about the slaughter of Jews by fellow Christians ever since.
A one stage solution with safeguards in place for whichever group happens to be the minority would be preferable to an ethnostate  practicing apartheid and a gradual ethnic cleansing which is what we had until October 7, 2023.
Now we have that on steroids.
Einstein(definitely not an idiot) predicted this outcome.
A Jewish democratic state is an oxymoron.
Maybe you should read more Gideon Levy and Ilian Pappe and less Keir Starmer and Rachel Riley .
It's not complicated. The lobbyists obviously disagree.

Everything is so clear and certain in your simple world. Shame it bears no relationship to reality.

[mills_and_bhuna]

I suspect it’s a long time since any of us were proud of our government. Though I hope most of us love many things about our country.

Personally I think Israel has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path.

Do you agree that similarly Russia has used significantly more force than it should have, and wish it would follow a different path? (After all Russia before they decided to invade Israel were provoked much less than Israel, and facing much lower external threats.)

You are kidding ?
The US recently revealed that they had set up CIA stations near the Russian border(a network of 12 if I recall).
The US is a nuclear power visibly hostile to Russia.
It could be argued that given Ukraine has been supplied with plenty of armaments that Russia's first invasion and then retreat was aimed at pressuring Ukraine to negotiate .
It certainly bore no relation to what a takeover of Ukraine would look like much less a precursor to rolling through Poland just for you guys prone to hyperbole.
I'm not defending what happened on October 7 but it didn't represent an existential threat to Israel.
Hamas are a resistance group with limited capability.
Israel are a well funded and armed state with a large capability to be destructive as we have seen.
That's the difference.

[PepeMAGA]

Theory 1 is a joke.
Russia could have turned the gaps off any time.
Theory 3 fits all criteria.
Theory 4 was a blatant psyop  by Western intelligence to distract from the Seymour Hersh story.

I didn't think Russia blew the pipeline, but I think the Hersh story is dubious also.
They reference Jens Stoltenberg in the politico article, with Hersh making the claim that he's been involved with American intelligence since Vietnam, they point this out as being unlikely due to his age... Also if you look in his Wikipedia page, there is an article from 2019 talking about him actually protesting the war in Vietnam.... Unless the suggestion was that he was a very young plant in a protester group, but there is no reference to that in Hersh' s article.

[mills_and_bhuna]

Great so you agree that Putin is very similar to Hitler, progress at last.

Not sure how I have double standards, I detest the current Israeli government and support calls for a ceasefire. I do support Israel’s right to exist. Do you support Ukraine’s right to exist as an independent country?

I an also capable of discussing Ukraine and Russia without having to throw in crap to divert the debate. Can you?

Where did I say Hitler and Putin were similar?
Hitler came to power in 1933 and was 8 years later launching Operation Barbarossa.
Putin came to power in 2000 and here we are 24 years later .
No blitzkrieg.
No equivalent of Sobibor, Treblinka or Belzec.
A pretty healthy Russian economy despite the best efforts of Western sanctions and the Africans and the Global South not to mention China clearly trust him more than Uncle Sam which seems strange for a modern day Hitler.
It must be all that Russian propaganda they see.
I would love to see Ukraine as a truly independent country.
I would love to see the UK as a truly independent country.
Unfortunately we are both vassals of the US economic empire just like most of the EU.
Russia's crime is they see what's at stake and are taking a stand.

[mills_and_bhuna]

I didn't think Russia blew the pipeline, but I think the Hersh story is dubious also.
They reference Jens Stoltenberg in the politico article, with Hersh making the claim that he's been involved with American intelligence since Vietnam, they point this out as being unlikely due to his age... Also if you look in his Wikipedia page, there is an article from 2019 talking about him actually protesting the war in Vietnam.... Unless the suggestion was that he was a very young plant in a protester group, but there is no reference to that in Hersh' s article.

Harsh only claims he has a source in American intelligence.
You're not going to get far without sources and they are not going to be of any use if exposed.
So it's always going to be speculative.
Hersh has a history of being right.
Politico has a history of lying, being biased, misleading and deceptive .
That's not to say they haven't printed good stuff but they're establishment and have to toe a certain line.
I know it's not definitive but I believe Hersh

[mills_and_bhuna]

Theory 1 has an explanation that counters your objection, did you not read it or not understand it?

Like all rational sane people I do not know who did it.  You are creating a certainty where there is none and on the back of your totally unjustified certainty calling other people idiots etc for not sharing your delusions.

I read it.
I understand it.
I disagree.
That ok?

[mills_and_bhuna]

Everything is so clear and certain in your simple world. Shame it bears no relationship to reality.

I could say exactly that about you.
Putin bad.
Trump bad.
Biden good but too old.
Netanyahu bad but if only we could get a good Zionist leader who would listen to Biden.
Let's not be hasty in halting arms sales to Israel.
Let's build a port in Gaza because Israel isn't letting in humanitarian aid.